Question for the group: I did my run test this past week and came up with a 156 LTHR (bike test was 164). I ran 6 mi today (8:42 pace, and starting to feel the strength coming back) and it felt like Z4, but the HR monitor says I'm up above 156 into Z5. The test was on the treadmill, but today's run was outside. Do you think I should redo the test this week (outside), or just wait till the next scheduled test and for now guage my runs off of RPE?
@Patachin - not sure if you've done this. Test consistently - meaning if you test on the treadmill then do subsequent tests on the treadmill. Also, I also test solely on treadmill and have incline set at 1.5% as this better simulates outdoor running. At 0% you have feeling of almost running slighly downhill. If you decide to test outdoors, then do all subsequent tests outdoors under like conditions.
I am not an HR guy, just soley a pace guy, so take this with a grain of salt. If you ran 8:42 pace, then GREAT ! Perhaps your HR was elevated for the various external factors than can influence HR and make it not a precise science, such as how much sleep you had night before, air temperature, etc.
Thanks David. I probably can't rely on one test anyway, and once have 4-5 tests under my belt I'll have some more confidence in the results across a range of tests. Last season I did all my run training, including marathon training, based only on pace. So I might be overemphasizing the HR thing here. -John
@Patachin - Ya, the EN way for running is to focus on pace. Not really worry about HR unless you are using it as a secondary data point. And once you do a few tests, as you have noted, you will get it dialed in.
The good news: the run felt good and my intervals were about .5 mph faster at the same HR than previous Sunday runs. The bad news: my left knee started to ache again (below the knee cap and a little on the inside) on the first interval. I adjusted my run style to bend my legs a little more and run lighter on my feet, like I was trying to run quietly. This was a little harder on my muscles but a lot better on my knees. The aching went away almost immediately so I kept with that style for the rest of the run. I think this will help as well as losing about 10 more pounds to reduce the impact to the knees. I'm down from 210 lbs to 203 lbs in January and my goal is to get to 190 by the IMCDA.
I have the same (or similar) issue from time to time and I find if I really stretch out my quads, calves and hami's it goes away. I also use The Stick and roll up and down my Anterior Tibialis (the outer fleshy part of the shin). It is all connected.
Ok, Sunday run confessional. I tweaked things up today, got excitable, and threw in a 5k test. Id been feeling pretty good running, and wanted to establish my Vdot for the next 4 weeks, since i have a half marathon coming up end of February.
2 miles Z1 3.1 miles in 19:21 3 miles cool down
For 8 miles in 61 minutes, and a 4 point bump in Vdot. Very psyched, and very focused on recovery for the next day or so!!!
@ John - Yeah, stretching every day. I'll have to look into The Stick and maybe step up my stretching to twice a day until the problem goes away. The interesting thing is that it's been a few hours and my knee feels fine going up stairs. That leads me to believe it's muscle related and not bone or cartilage related so I think you're right that stretching more would be a good plan of attack for now.
@Allen: I've had the same problem in both knees after a lot of overtraining (that's redundant, I know). Better now thanks to making quad stretching a religion (every evening), and also the foam roller on the quad and ITB. You can get a smaller diameter roller that's about 4", and roll down along the ITB and gently over the lateral side of the knee. I have the stick too, but the roller seems to work better, at least for me. www.athletestreatingathletes.com has a great runner's knee prevention page. Good luck with it.
I hate it when I go for a run and forget to press start on my Garmin, doh!! Got two miles in and realized my watch was still at zero miles. Oh, well. It was a good run anyways. Got the 2x1miles done and hit my paces with ease - I can tell I am getting stronger/faster. And the balance of the run was fun, especially the last two miles when it started to rain. I love that!
@John, that was a solid run, above. I would call that a success. Awesome job.
@Mike, great time, no doubt. You are getting faster very quick. Keep it up. I have been at 19:30 for two years and got tired of it this fall, used Daniels 5-15k, went faster and now seem to get even faster with OS.
Week 4 complete. 8mi in 60min, IF .91, TSS 77, treadmill 2x12min(4min)TP+10minHMP, all on target, felt good and strong even though legs are tired.
Group, great work, get rested for week 5. Good night.
@Allen - Might also be helpful to post your issue in the Medical Forum. And it's a bonus if you can take a picture of the area that hurts with your finger pointing to the specific spot and then post into your thread. Or, just describe the best you can.
Lotsa good advice from PT's and docs who are part of EN.
@Allen - your knee description sounds similar to a knee (left knee) I have been dealing with for 3 weeks now. I've been frustrated as the knee has zero issue when I cycle or walk, but pain discomfort quickly appears if I run or jog. I think stretching is a big component (stupid me, I have not started yet) to remedy the situation. I am going to visit a physical therapist next week to assist me on setting a pathway (and, yes stretching) to get rid of this pain. I hope you have success in eliminating the discomfort. It's thrown my run training out the door for now.
Run in Sunday. - RPE, because the Garmin wasn't charged. I made a short stop to the Middle Eastern Grocery on the way home and ended up home at the time I should have arrived without the baklava buying. Oops.
Last minute run on Sunday night at the gym. 1/4mil w/u, 2x1 at 7:36, 1/2mi c/d. Zipped through it and headed home to put the kids to bed. Back to a normal schedule this week. Can't wait!
I got in almost 5 miles on my skate skis instead of run for my Sunday run. It was OK, but today (Monday) I am really feeling my tight hamstrings. I thing its from picking up my skis. I was able to hit my numbers but don't feel like I went as far as I expected. Total milage was 4.82 miles in 57". I never got too deep into z4 during my mile intervals but finished up strong nonetheless. New snow today and uber cold temps throughout the week, should make for really good skiing this weekend.
Comments
Thanks John S.
Question for the group: I did my run test this past week and came up with a 156 LTHR (bike test was 164). I ran 6 mi today (8:42 pace, and starting to feel the strength coming back) and it felt like Z4, but the HR monitor says I'm up above 156 into Z5. The test was on the treadmill, but today's run was outside. Do you think I should redo the test this week (outside), or just wait till the next scheduled test and for now guage my runs off of RPE?
Any insights appreciated of course,
-John
@Patachin - not sure if you've done this. Test consistently - meaning if you test on the treadmill then do subsequent tests on the treadmill. Also, I also test solely on treadmill and have incline set at 1.5% as this better simulates outdoor running. At 0% you have feeling of almost running slighly downhill. If you decide to test outdoors, then do all subsequent tests outdoors under like conditions.
Perhaps your HR was elevated for the various external factors than can influence HR and make it not a precise science, such as how much sleep you had night before, air temperature, etc.
I am not an HR guy, just soley a pace guy, so take this with a grain of salt. If you ran 8:42 pace, then GREAT !
Thanks David. I probably can't rely on one test anyway, and once have 4-5 tests under my belt I'll have some more confidence in the results across a range of tests. Last season I did all my run training, including marathon training, based only on pace. So I might be overemphasizing the HR thing here. -John
@Patachin - Ya, the EN way for running is to focus on pace. Not really worry about HR unless you are using it as a secondary data point. And once you do a few tests, as you have noted, you will get it dialed in.
@Allen: Are you stretching?
I have the same (or similar) issue from time to time and I find if I really stretch out my quads, calves and hami's it goes away. I also use The Stick and roll up and down my Anterior Tibialis (the outer fleshy part of the shin). It is all connected.
2 miles Z1
3.1 miles in 19:21
3 miles cool down
For 8 miles in 61 minutes, and a 4 point bump in Vdot. Very psyched, and very focused on recovery for the next day or so!!!
@Allen: I've had the same problem in both knees after a lot of overtraining (that's redundant, I know). Better now thanks to making quad stretching a religion (every evening), and also the foam roller on the quad and ITB. You can get a smaller diameter roller that's about 4", and roll down along the ITB and gently over the lateral side of the knee. I have the stick too, but the roller seems to work better, at least for me. www.athletestreatingathletes.com has a great runner's knee prevention page. Good luck with it.
I hate it when I go for a run and forget to press start on my Garmin, doh!!
Got two miles in and realized my watch was still at zero miles. Oh, well. It was a good run anyways. Got the 2x1miles done and hit my paces with ease - I can tell I am getting stronger/faster. And the balance of the run was fun, especially the last two miles when it started to rain. I love that!
GP
@John, that was a solid run, above. I would call that a success. Awesome job.
@Mike, great time, no doubt. You are getting faster very quick. Keep it up. I have been at 19:30 for two years and got tired of it this fall, used Daniels 5-15k, went faster and now seem to get even faster with OS.
Week 4 complete. 8mi in 60min, IF .91, TSS 77, treadmill 2x12min(4min)TP+10minHMP, all on target, felt good and strong even though legs are tired.
Group, great work, get rested for week 5. Good night.
@Allen - Might also be helpful to post your issue in the Medical Forum. And it's a bonus if you can take a picture of the area that hurts with your finger pointing to the specific spot and then post into your thread. Or, just describe the best you can.
Lotsa good advice from PT's and docs who are part of EN.
@ John - Good suggestion, forgot there was a Medical Help forum. Both David and I have taken up the cause in that forum.
Run in Sunday. - RPE, because the Garmin wasn't charged. I made a short stop to the Middle Eastern Grocery on the way home and ended up home at the time I should have arrived without the baklava buying. Oops.
I got in almost 5 miles on my skate skis instead of run for my Sunday run. It was OK, but today (Monday) I am really feeling my tight hamstrings. I thing its from picking up my skis. I was able to hit my numbers but don't feel like I went as far as I expected. Total milage was 4.82 miles in 57". I never got too deep into z4 during my mile intervals but finished up strong nonetheless. New snow today and uber cold temps throughout the week, should make for really good skiing this weekend.