So after reviewing my bike intervals, my cadence looked pretty low compared to what it looked like I should be doing based on the rest of the EN population. (about 75 avg) I was hitting my watts no problem though. So today I focused a bit more on cadence and got the avg to about 85. Watts suffered a bit but managed to still hit the lower end of my Z4 for the first 10 min. interval. 2nd 10' was harder and bailed after 8', just short of Z4 by a few watts. (Had to meet running partner and was distracted) Managed to have enough in the legs to do 5 mi. at my slow 12:00 pace overall, but with a nice .75mi kick at the end. 2 homemade choc. chip cookies and a chocolate Honey Milk afterwards.
Question, when doing intervals, does it matter how you get the target watts? (faster/easier vs. slower/harder?)
@ Kim - Others more knowledgable about biking than I may chime in but here are my $.02. A slower cadance (60 rpms) in a harder gear is a replication of hill climbing - requires pure leg strength. A higher cadance (85-95) in an easier gear is more like riding on a flat road. To be a well rounded cyclist, one needs to be able to ride in both situations. I personally like to ride @ higher cadance since 90 rpms is about what my leg turnover is when running. Since I'm a long time runner, a higher cadance just "feels" more comfortable to me. I am learning to be a better rider on hills by practicing a rpm of 60 and pushing big watts on 1' or 2' intervals. In the end , you have to find what works best for you, but you might want practice doing intervals in both situations to be able to handle anything the road throws at you.
@ Matt - Nice work.. You're gone rock Jan OS. BTW - what's up with your Dad? Is he getting more serious about tri-training?
I did the Computrainer class today. Averaged 200 watts for 70 minutes. But it was 1x 15' warm up @ 150 watts, then hill intervals - 16 x 1' @ 225 watts, 16 x1' @ 150 watts and 16 x 1' @ 300 watts, and 7' cool down. Pushed my HR into Z4-5 @ 160-165. Then ran 6 miles include 4 x 1/2 mile @ 6:55 pace. I'm ready for beer and some ice.
@Bruce, 16x1' @ 300w, ouch, that's gotta hurt. As for my dad, he just got a trainer and I set it up for him. Over the holidays we'll talk a little goal-setting and see what he wants to do training wise and where EN fits in. He really neeeds to improve his biking and EN is great for that. I think he wants to target Pleasant Prairie olympic-distance next year.
been getting the pain cave mojo going for the last 2 weeks.
also, have been able to get some group riding in about 1x week since ~mid Nov. Have been pleasantly surprised at my minimal decrease in fitness compared to most others.
meaning...gonna be a good start to Jan OS and the rest of 2012!
Brutal workout today. A fail. But since we're in the "pre-OS", that doesn't matter. Plenty of time to get back into shape once the work starts.
But one thing is for sure, it's time for an FTP test, a lower FTP and new zones that I can actually hit. I'm for sure in a different spot now than I was in the summer. I'd ballpark FTP at 225-230, sown from 248. My HR's are incredibly high these days.
@ Chris - sounds like a fun time at your house last night. Good to hear that you are feelin' good about your condition going into OS.
@ Matt- I wouldn't call that workout a "fail". Looks like you were able to hit the pretty close to the IF for those intervals. Also, good to hear your Dad is getting on the bike. That will help.
I've got a 40' time trial on the Computrainer tomorrow. Gonna see if I can boost my watts from 236 to somewhere around 260. It's gonna hurt. So I took it easy today. One hour spin class then a swim just doing drills. Now off to do more Holiday errands. A good weekend to all.
It has been 14 days since my last run. My achillies still does not feel great. But I need to resume running, so I'm going to try and see what happens. Then I may try some stretching / loosening.
Got my 2 x 12' Z4 done. My FTP is 137. First 12' @ 152 NP, 2nd 12' 136. I know I overachieved on the first one, but just wanted to see what I could do. Seems like I am making some improvements in just 4 weeks of pre-OS. Re-test in 2 weeks for Jan. OS. I was thinking of covering the PM for the test so I wouldn't sell myself short... Anyone ever done it that way?
Did 3 x .5mi Z4 on the treadmill Fri. @ 9:00 pace. (My 5k test pace is 10:00/mi)
@ Kim - Nice work. You clearly are seeing some gains and I predict a nice bump when you test. IMHO, don't cover up the PM, but keep you eye glued to it. Aim for something like 150-148 range on the first 20' and then see if you can hold that for the 2nd 20' too.
@ Matt - Good stuff. Take care of that achillies. They take a long time heal. ICE, ICE!!
I did a FTP test today at the end of the 8 week Computrainer class ( which I'm doing with 4 other ENers + 3 others who bought an EN plan). Avg watts for 1st 20' = 257. Got a 5' rest then avg watts for 2nd 20' = 263, for a total avg watts of an even 260. Damn near puked at the end of the 2nd 20'. My HR hit 172 which I haven't seen in a long time so I know I was working. Then ran 4 miles in 32:30, avg pace of 8:07, which included 1 x 1/2 mile at 6:25 pace. Weather was just too nice for this time of year in Chicago (40F, sun, no ice on path) to pass it up. I'm spent and ready for a beer. I think I'll use the 260 as my FTP for the Jan OS since I trust this number more than the one I get off the bike at my gym.
Good ride tonight in front of the football game. Pretty unstructured…targeted somewhere between z3 and z4 with recoveries during the commercial breaks. It ended up being 3 intervals after a structured 20' warmup:
Using the month of December to attempt to break my quad-dominant movement patterns in both running and biking, as I believe they've been holding me back significantly. After taking some time off the bike and run to re-educate the glutes and hamstrings on what they're supposed to be doing in general, I got on the bike and treadmill for a very short time, and am finally understanding what it means to run with hamstrings and glutes as the prime movers. it's also interesting to see what happens when I can actually turn off my quads when I'm supposed to in the pedal stroke (as opposed to at the bottom of it!). Very interesting educational process. Can't tell you how excited I was on Sunday when, for the first time in over 15 years, I learned how to do a squat with my glutes as opposed to my quads. Might be a few extra weeks before I'm really on track, but I believe that this is necessary to break through my plateau of the last few years.
Mike- That is an excellent plan and something I suspect many triathletes (myself included) could benefit from! How are you going about it? What other exercises are you doing?
Kim, in 2009, I was diagnosed with a tear of the labrum in my left hip, and spent a good chunk of time with a PT developing a plan to strengthen my hips in order to avoid surgery. With just a few exceptions, I'm back on that plan, as my hip strength had waned over the last two years since I finished up with the PT. Nothing all that fancy, lots of glute bridges, single leg bridges, clams, crab walks, etc. Big difference now is my focus on recruiting my glutes and getting my quads to relax/turn off during glute movement. It's made me realize just how much quad compensation I've been doing for so long. I'm hoping that with another week of glute and hammy strengthening, I can start to incorporate some more regular running and continue the strengthening. I'm starting to miss just regular working out!
Workout today as written was 3 x 5' Z4 but I was anxious to try the new Sufferfest video I downloaded so I did part of that instead. I did 3 of the 4' intervals but was more like Z5 so I'll call it even. I ignored my watts for the most part (except the occassional glance) and followed the on-screen RPE and cadence guidance. Here's what I got: (My FTP is 137 NP)
I'm thinking that since my watts were still going up with each interval, I could have done another, but since I am technically pre-OS, didn't want to push it. (I'm a plan follower, what can I say.) I need to re-read my Training w/ Power ebook to start analyzing my stuff better but I believe these are the key data points to look at. I really liked doing the video so I'm going to download some more! I think it is probably best suited for Z5 stuff, otherwise I would have to hold back quite a bit to hit my actual zones as prescribed in the plan.
So my dad and I took our bikes up to Michigan and set up the trainers in the basement of this vacation house. It's a really nice setup. I decided to do some VO2 max intervals. Man, I forgot how tough those are. We stuck to "easy" intervals of only 1', so did 3 sets of 4x1'(1') with 2 mins additional recovery between each set.
In any case, my numbers are very interesting. I was targeting 298 watts for z5, which is my z5 based on my old season-high FTP. So I was probably targeting a too-high FTP. But in any case I hit the numbers…average power for each interval was: Set 1: 319, 318, 309, 318 Set 2: 314, 312, 315, 314 Set 3: 328, 314, 317, 315
So overall pretty solid. It's funny how you can look at the power numbers an hour later and think about how great a workout it was. The memory of how bloody difficult it was fades quickly. The HR numbers tell the story of the intensity. My Max HR for each interval: Set 1: 155, 160, 167, 174 (still warming up) Set 2: 173, 176, 179, 183 (NOW we're working hard) Set 3: 181, 183, 185, 187 (doesn't go any higher than that, let me tell you)
Figured I'd get my bike test out of the way since I have this week off. Pretty much EXACTLY the same as first test about 6 weeks ago. (Did it just to see where I was since I just got PM) I think I went to hard first 20 mins. Plus, I was aiming for a number that was prob unrealistic since I have only been doing pre-OS for a few weeks half-heartedly. Also, I did take it easy enough on the 2 min. recovery since I saw the avg. dropping and was shooting for 150, basically just based on the gact that I have been overachieving on my intervals- although much shorter! (Last test was 137, as was this one today) Plus, I felt a lot worse after test today than I did the first time. Lesson learned. Before next test, I'll re-read the testing "instructions" and try not to blow it. GGGRRRRR OK, I'm over it now.
@ Kim, no worries. Pacing is key. Hold your horses until the OS actually begins!
I'm still up in Michigan and was able to hammer out another trainer ride tonight before dinner. Man vs. Food was on...I always seem to have great rides in front of that show. I decided to do some FTP work, W/U 10' then 3x8'(2') then 5' "z3+" to total 45 minutes. I'm still using my season-high FTP so maybe once the OS starts and I get a new FTP the intervals will actually be a lot easier...
@ KIm - I agree with Matt. Pacing is key, especially the 1st 5 minutes of each 20' set. If you go overboard at the start, you have a really hard time holding the watts for the last 5, even 10 minutes.
@ Matt - really nice IF on those intervals, super consistent results. If you can achieve that IF at your season high FTP, you're ready of a good OS.
@ Bruce, yeah, I can't wait to get an FTP about 10 watts lower. My IFs will be looking really good at that point. And for sure I'll go to WKO and back-date that FTP...to enjoy some retroactive TSS!!
In any case, another bike tonight before dinner at this vacation house in Michigan. This time I just did 32' to complement this morning's 28' run. There's something about hitting an even 60' for the day, right??
It has been good to get in some rides over the past week, and now even some runs. I plan to back off a bit later this week in anticipation of the testing week and the beginning of the OS, but I'm feeling good about wrapping up a pretty inactive "offseason" with some work to get me ready for the OS.
FTP done. Hzd nice weather plus new wheels. Wanted to test this week. 10 wa tts over pre IM test. Had a little trouble pacing today. Its been awhile. Monday, here we come.
Another bike tonight before dinner in Michigan. I was game to do a 60' ride but my family got hungy early so I had to cut it short to head out for dinner.
Random 30 min. Z3 ride today then some upper body strength training. I am reading "17 Hours to Glory" and found I can read and ride Z3 at the same time... Cool way to pass the time, and 2nd use for aerobars!
Matt and Kim - Nice work. On to the OS as you guys are ready.
I did a "fun" ride today. Did back to back 1 hour spin classes at my club. Just enjoyed the music, people, videos....No power meter, no plan, no pre-determined intervals - just went hard when I liked the song being played. Stayed mostly in Z3 HR (143-149) but did spike it up to both Z4 (150-159) and Z5 (160-170) at least a dozen times. Felt pretty good. Then went for a 30' swim to cool off - just did technique drills.
Last ride of 2011, and last post to this thread. A nice steady pre-dinner 26.5' to complement this morning's 33.5' run and make it an even 60' for the day. Now time to get that Prime Rib out of the smoker! http://connect.garmin.com/activity/137866770 HAPPY NEW YEAR!!
good days back to back of riding Fri/Sat, today I'm off to the annual Jan 1 race, the Freezer 5, which will take the place of my Vdot test. Looking forward to seeing everybody in the OS group!
Comments
Question, when doing intervals, does it matter how you get the target watts? (faster/easier vs. slower/harder?)
Another 60', this time 2x10'(4') @z4 then 20' z3. Tough.
- 10'(4') @ z4, NP 242 (IF 0.975)
- 10'(4') @ z4, NP 246 (IF 0.99)
- 20' @ z3, NP 212 (IF 0.856)
Overall ride 60' @ NP 211 (IF 0.853)
Once again, HRs were very, very high
http://connect.garmin.com/activity/133768011
@ Kim - Others more knowledgable about biking than I may chime in but here are my $.02. A slower cadance (60 rpms) in a harder gear is a replication of hill climbing - requires pure leg strength. A higher cadance (85-95) in an easier gear is more like riding on a flat road. To be a well rounded cyclist, one needs to be able to ride in both situations. I personally like to ride @ higher cadance since 90 rpms is about what my leg turnover is when running. Since I'm a long time runner, a higher cadance just "feels" more comfortable to me. I am learning to be a better rider on hills by practicing a rpm of 60 and pushing big watts on 1' or 2' intervals. In the end , you have to find what works best for you, but you might want practice doing intervals in both situations to be able to handle anything the road throws at you.
@ Matt - Nice work.. You're gone rock Jan OS. BTW - what's up with your Dad? Is he getting more serious about tri-training?
I did the Computrainer class today. Averaged 200 watts for 70 minutes. But it was 1x 15' warm up @ 150 watts, then hill intervals - 16 x 1' @ 225 watts, 16 x1' @ 150 watts and 16 x 1' @ 300 watts, and 7' cool down. Pushed my HR into Z4-5 @ 160-165. Then ran 6 miles include 4 x 1/2 mile @ 6:55 pace. I'm ready for beer and some ice.
been getting the pain cave mojo going for the last 2 weeks.
also, have been able to get some group riding in about 1x week since ~mid Nov. Have been pleasantly surprised at my minimal decrease in fitness compared to most others.
meaning...gonna be a good start to Jan OS and the rest of 2012!
hope you guys are doing well.
But one thing is for sure, it's time for an FTP test, a lower FTP and new zones that I can actually hit. I'm for sure in a different spot now than I was in the summer. I'd ballpark FTP at 225-230, sown from 248. My HR's are incredibly high these days.
The ride was 60' including:
- 10'(4') @ z4, NP 238 (IF 0.96)…HR avg 154/ max 176
- 5'(2') @ z4, NP 236 (IF 0.951)…HR 170/ 179
- 14' @ z3, NP 208 (IF 0.839)…HR 174 / 183
Overall ride 45' @ NP 207 (IF 0.833)
I hit a higher HR for z3 than z4. So you know the zones aren't right.
http://connect.garmin.com/activity/134725296
Cheers,
Matt
but did get in a good hour on the trainer this morning
main set of 2x 12' (5') then some weights.
I feel good about starting the OS in decent shape.
Hope all is well with you guys!
@ Chris - sounds like a fun time at your house last night. Good to hear that you are feelin' good about your condition going into OS.
@ Matt- I wouldn't call that workout a "fail". Looks like you were able to hit the pretty close to the IF for those intervals. Also, good to hear your Dad is getting on the bike. That will help.
I've got a 40' time trial on the Computrainer tomorrow. Gonna see if I can boost my watts from 236 to somewhere around 260. It's gonna hurt. So I took it easy today. One hour spin class then a swim just doing drills. Now off to do more Holiday errands. A good weekend to all.
My stats:
- 12.5'(2.5') @ z3/4, NP 230 (IF 0.927)…HR avg 163 / max 173
- 10' @ z4, NP 240 (IF 0.07)…HR 173 / 183
Overall ride 45' @ NP 217 (IF 0.877)
http://connect.garmin.com/activity/135142098
It has been 14 days since my last run. My achillies still does not feel great. But I need to resume running, so I'm going to try and see what happens. Then I may try some stretching / loosening.
Did 3 x .5mi Z4 on the treadmill Fri. @ 9:00 pace. (My 5k test pace is 10:00/mi)
@ Kim - Nice work. You clearly are seeing some gains and I predict a nice bump when you test. IMHO, don't cover up the PM, but keep you eye glued to it. Aim for something like 150-148 range on the first 20' and then see if you can hold that for the 2nd 20' too.
@ Matt - Good stuff. Take care of that achillies. They take a long time heal. ICE, ICE!!
I did a FTP test today at the end of the 8 week Computrainer class ( which I'm doing with 4 other ENers + 3 others who bought an EN plan). Avg watts for 1st 20' = 257. Got a 5' rest then avg watts for 2nd 20' = 263, for a total avg watts of an even 260. Damn near puked at the end of the 2nd 20'. My HR hit 172 which I haven't seen in a long time so I know I was working. Then ran 4 miles in 32:30, avg pace of 8:07, which included 1 x 1/2 mile at 6:25 pace. Weather was just too nice for this time of year in Chicago (40F, sun, no ice on path) to pass it up. I'm spent and ready for a beer. I think I'll use the 260 as my FTP for the Jan OS since I trust this number more than the one I get off the bike at my gym.
- 6'(2') @ z3/4, NP 225 (IF 0.907)…HR avg 152 / max 163
- 6'(4') @ z3/4, NP 228 (IF 0.918)…HR 161 / 167
- 15'(2') @ z3/4, NP 230 (IF 0.926)…HR 171 / 179
Overall ride 60' @ NP 215 (IF 0.868)
http://connect.garmin.com/activity/135463625
#1- 156 NP, avg speed 15.7, avg. cadence 94, avg bpm 151- max 166
#2- 167 NP, avg speed 16.3, avg. cadence 77, avg bpm 155- max 170
#3- 172 NP, avg speed 16.5, avg. cadence 73, avg bpm 157- max 168
I'm thinking that since my watts were still going up with each interval, I could have done another, but since I am technically pre-OS, didn't want to push it. (I'm a plan follower, what can I say.) I need to re-read my Training w/ Power ebook to start analyzing my stuff better but I believe these are the key data points to look at. I really liked doing the video so I'm going to download some more! I think it is probably best suited for Z5 stuff, otherwise I would have to hold back quite a bit to hit my actual zones as prescribed in the plan.
Overall ride 45' @ NP 228 (IF 0.919)
- 8'(4') @ z4, NP 247 (IF 0.995)…HR avg 169 / max 181
- 8'(3') @ z4, NP 253 (IF 1.02)…HR 180 / 188
- 3' @ z4, AP 253…HR 179 / 186
http://connect.garmin.com/activity/135911556
Overall ride 40' @ NP 21 (IF 0.877)
- 10'(2') @ >z3, NP 222 (IF 0.895)…HR avg 156 / max 164
- 8' @ >z3, NP 226 (IF 0.913)…HR 163 / 171
http://connect.garmin.com/activity/136402679
In any case, my numbers are very interesting. I was targeting 298 watts for z5, which is my z5 based on my old season-high FTP. So I was probably targeting a too-high FTP. But in any case I hit the numbers…average power for each interval was:
Set 1: 319, 318, 309, 318
Set 2: 314, 312, 315, 314
Set 3: 328, 314, 317, 315
So overall pretty solid. It's funny how you can look at the power numbers an hour later and think about how great a workout it was. The memory of how bloody difficult it was fades quickly. The HR numbers tell the story of the intensity. My Max HR for each interval:
Set 1: 155, 160, 167, 174 (still warming up)
Set 2: 173, 176, 179, 183 (NOW we're working hard)
Set 3: 181, 183, 185, 187 (doesn't go any higher than that, let me tell you)
Getting ready for that OS…
http://connect.garmin.com/activity/136908548
@ Kim, no worries. Pacing is key. Hold your horses until the OS actually begins!
I'm still up in Michigan and was able to hammer out another trainer ride tonight before dinner. Man vs. Food was on...I always seem to have great rides in front of that show. I decided to do some FTP work, W/U 10' then 3x8'(2') then 5' "z3+" to total 45 minutes. I'm still using my season-high FTP so maybe once the OS starts and I get a new FTP the intervals will actually be a lot easier...
Overall ride 45' @ NP 221 (IF 0.89)
- 8'(2') @ z4, NP 241 (IF 0.974)…HR avg 148 / max 160...avg cadence 96
- 8'(2') @ z4, NP 245 (IF 0.986)…HR 163 / 173...cad 97
- 8'(2') @ z4, NP 244 (IF 0.986 - really NP different and IF the same - WKO error??)…HR 171 / 180...cad 96
- 5' @ "z3+", NP 220 (IF 0.887)…HR 169 / 178...cad 98
http://connect.garmin.com/activity/137149602
@ KIm - I agree with Matt. Pacing is key, especially the 1st 5 minutes of each 20' set. If you go overboard at the start, you have a really hard time holding the watts for the last 5, even 10 minutes.
@ Matt - really nice IF on those intervals, super consistent results. If you can achieve that IF at your season high FTP, you're ready of a good OS.
In any case, another bike tonight before dinner at this vacation house in Michigan. This time I just did 32' to complement this morning's 28' run. There's something about hitting an even 60' for the day, right??
Overall ride 32' @ NP 222 (IF 0.894). W/U only 8' then:
- 3x1'(1') @ z5 (target 298), AP: 305, 307, 304
- 2' easy recovery
- 6'(2') @ z4, NP 242 (IF 0.976)…HR avg 157 / max 168...avg cadence 97
- 8' @ z4, NP 238 (IF 0.961)…HR 166 / 177...cad 97
http://connect.garmin.com/activity/137379463
It has been good to get in some rides over the past week, and now even some runs. I plan to back off a bit later this week in anticipation of the testing week and the beginning of the OS, but I'm feeling good about wrapping up a pretty inactive "offseason" with some work to get me ready for the OS.
Overall ride 45' @ NP 206 (IF 0.832). W/U 10' easy then:
- 3x3'(1') @ z3 (target 198-211), AP: 207, 208, 208
- 8'(2') @ z4, NP 241 (IF 0.971)…HR avg 161 / max 170...avg cadence 96
- 13' @z3/4, NP 221 (IF 0.981)…HR 162 / 171...cad 93
http://connect.garmin.com/activity/137572535
Happy New Year!
Matt and Kim - Nice work. On to the OS as you guys are ready.
I did a "fun" ride today. Did back to back 1 hour spin classes at my club. Just enjoyed the music, people, videos....No power meter, no plan, no pre-determined intervals - just went hard when I liked the song being played. Stayed mostly in Z3 HR (143-149) but did spike it up to both Z4 (150-159) and Z5 (160-170) at least a dozen times. Felt pretty good. Then went for a 30' swim to cool off - just did technique drills.
Happy New Year Everyone..
HAPPY NEW YEAR!!