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30/30 questions for the experienced folks

RumpoleRumpole
in General Training Discussions

Hey y'all-

 

Did my first 30/30 set last night using Trainerroad using power tap, no computrainer.   I have never done intervals this short with power.  On the beginner OS.  I have a question about pacing--it seems like in order to hit the target power on average, I have to be going well above the specified range.  In other words, most of my interval APs were -below- what I think the target should be, even though I tried to  bring the power up and hold it rather than spike it and bring it down. (AP was between 105% and 125% FTP).   In contrast, a 10min tempo interval at the end looks like a tabletop (but I've had a lot more practice with those).  Am I looking for tabletops on the 30s? Hills sloping down to the right?

 

The point being that if you're using your 5 min power as a cap and only doing 30s, 2.5 min @ VO2 ought to feel relatively easy, no?  Or did I do this all wrong?

Comments

  • Gordon CherwoniakGordon Cherwoniak

    Chris,

    I can keep the power fairly steday even on the short intervals.  I typically hit all intervals between 1.20 and 1.22.  A couple things that I try to do is gear up about 5-10 seconds before the start of the interval.  I use this pre interval time to spike to the watt to my 1.2 level.

    I've notice that I have a harder time holding the watts constant a a lower cadence (hard gear) say at 80 rpm's and also on the other end when I get above 95-97 rpms as well. 

    As for VO2 workouts being easy, no way.  You are doing several sets.  I'm not sure what level (beg, int adv) you are but for me the advanced plan calls for 15' of VO2 work with 2' breaks between.  Also the recovery section is at 65% and as you go further in the workout the HR climbs.

    Gordon

  • RumpoleRumpole
    OK that makes more sense. Beginner was 2 sets of 5 == total 5 minutes @ VO2.
  • RumpoleRumpole

    OK that makes more sense. Beginner was 2 sets of 5 == total 5 minutes @ VO2. Here's the graph:http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/120755

     

    Took one interval off by mistake b/c I got sucked into the walking dead on netflix.

  • rmillerrmiller
    For the real short intervals, I wouldn't worry so much about nailing the average (but try to keep effort steady throughout). You get used to, and better at, it over time - as Gordon mentioned you can start spinning up a few seconds ahead of time to really maximize the time @ target power as well as eliminate skewing the average due to ramp-up time. But given the sampling rates for the PT and TR and such, I always find the shorter intervals resultant average is less than target. Especially TR, as it is basing its virtual power on rear wheel speed, which doesn't catch up from 65% FTP to VO2max speed for at least 3-5 seconds - the PT is a little quicker because it measures torque directly regardless of rear wheel speed.

    But you do want to try to keep the power steady during the interval. BTW - I switched from 30/30's to 1/1 (1 minute on, 1 minute off) because I felt like the 30s of ON was such that I was just barely getting to the 'good' stuff and then had to go back to rest. So you may want to toy with keeping the same total time of VO2max, but adjusting how long each interval is to find something that suits you (45s or 1m)
  • Gordon CherwoniakGordon Cherwoniak

    Chris,

    As you do more of these workouts I'm sure the power will stabilize in the proper area with a little attention.   

    Also remember that you have done an FTP/z4 bike on Tuesday and a TP run on Wednesday before this workout.  The goal is not to crush you every workout but give you enough work to provide fitness results.

    As for the longer intervals i'd give it a couple weeks before deciding to ramp up to longer intervals I believe you will get those in the plan in later weeks 45/45's anyway.  The VO2 work can dig people in a hole. I'm in my 4th OS and did 30/30's on the beginer plan the first year and had great results.  I was coming off the couch and went from 180 to 220 watts over a 20 week OS.   

    Gordon

  • Peter WickPeter Wick
    All I know is that if you're not having play dates with the little red sparklies in your head by the end of the first set yer not doing it right. ;-) Just kidding.

    Take your time with these things. They'll start to hurt soon enough. As for technique, I like that idea of jumping onto the interval a few seconds early, especially if you have TR set to smooth out the power data by 3 seconds or more. That will help avoid over-shooting and let you practice consistent power output.
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