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NOS Week 14 Bike Thread, hammer it home

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  • Test the bike today - I certainly FEEL fitter then way back in OCT image

    Oct Jan
    Distance: 8.97 9.17
    Ave Speed: 13.5 13.9
    Avg HR: 156 162
    Max HR: 170 170
    Avg Cadence: 80 90
    Max Cadence: 98 102

    The numbers don't look as dramatic as my improvement in fitness feels - strange?
  • Bike Test done. NOS was the first time I embraced a structured training program. At times it was tough (circling the bike for like an hour on Saturday mornings before getting on the damn thing) and at times it was necessary to let off the accelerator. But overall I'm leaving NOS faster, fitter, and looking forward to a week off, oops, I mean a week of unstructured active rest!

    Week1 AVHR 153 AVSPD 14.7

    Week8 AVHR 151 AVSPD 18.5

    Week14 AVHR 149 AVSPD 19.9

  • had a great FTP test last night -- http://connect.garmin.com/activity/268300564

    i was very nervous going into the test, as i'd been struggling mightily since the week 8 bike test. a few days ago, i realized that it might have something to do with not lubing my chain since the start of the OS -- i'm terrible with bike upkeep!

    i cleaned the chain and put some lube down before starting the test and it seemed to go smoothly during the w/u phase. when i got to the VO2 section, i could tell it still wasn't properly lubricated, so during my 10 min easy spin recovery, i hopped off the bike and re-applied. hopped back on and took it easy until i reached the FTP portion -- what a queasy/excited/nervous feeling it is those last few moments leading into the PAIN...

    i started out at my previous FTP adjusted for the 95% (242W) and held that steady for the first 10'. things were going well and i was drifting slightly above target, so once i reached the midway point, my goal was to increase the AP by one watt per minute. i ended up getting to 260W average power for the 20' with some major suffering during the last 5 minutes. all in all, it felt really well paced, and the suffering was minimzed

    got up early this morning to hit a yoga class with a friend -- shaky legs, but otherwise nice & relaxing!
  • Lots of Booms in here. Solid work across the NovOS everyone! It was really good to meet/post/groove with everyone the past 14 weeks. Keep pushing it into your next phase everyone!
  • @Shawn - probably not as strange as you might think. I had a similar experience with running over the summer before and after the get faster program - I felt significantly stronger, but my VDOT remained the same. It wasn't until a race when that improvement finally showed itself and translated to a better vDOT. Sometimes improved fitness doesn't make itself obvious until later.

    @Chris - umm, holy CRAP! Seriously - avg speed from 14.7 to 19.9? That's a sick increase! And at a lower avg HR, to boot! Nice work!
  • I'm disappointed with the final bike test but I probably shouldn't be. I posted on the dashboard but I'm also putting it here. The blood donation really knocked the stuffing out of me when it came to trying to make it through the last 5 weeks with the new wattage numbers I achieved just before the blood donation 5 weeks ago.

    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/192517 - I still went out too hard. It seemed okay but in both intervals I soon faded as my HR quickly got into the 180's and that's where I really feel the suffering. My average HR went up significantly in both intervals. Maybe it was my tolerance for the strain since that first test came before the donation. It could also have been due to poor test execution and going out too hard at the starts. So here are my final numbers on the bike.

    VO2max 320w (169 HR) -> 337w (177 HR) -> 343w (181 HR)
    FTP numbers: 242w (168 HR) -> 259w (173 HR) -> 262w (180 HR)
    W/KG: 3.04 -> 3.22 -> 3.38 (It helped to lose a few holiday pounds down to 171)
    A 7% bump in VO2max and an 8% FTP bump. W/Kg went up 11%.
  • @ Peter -- those look like great results to me, but could they have been even better? did you only take a 5 minute break between the VO2 and FTP sections of the test? test protocol is for 10 minutes and that extra 5 minutes of rest might have boosted your results
  • Whew!! So glad that's over. Was worried based on my 5k test not going so well last sunday and really feeling fatigued. So...I took rest days for both Wed and Thurs to get a little jump back in the legs. I had been struggling since my last test hitting some of my intervals. Apparently the rest days helped and I had a successful test!

    I ROCKED and went BOOM on the V02 portion- 201 -> 227 -> 250
    Happy with my FTP up 5 watts - (adjusted) 187 -> 202 -> 207!! - increase of 10%..YIPEEE>
    W/KG: 3.05 -> 3.20 -> 3.28

    Peter - note to self...no blood donations during training. image
    Chris - amazing!
    Mike - right there with you on being nervous about this test. As I noted i had been struggling since the last test!

    Great work everyone!!! This has been a great experience. I'll be missing everyone when I go off to start my RUN focus plan.
  • @ Ann - awesome! Smart taper as well. See you in the run focus if we get a forum started! This is my weak area, so I'll be lurking a lot!

    @Chris - wow. You get most improved! I can't think of anyone that has increased that much!

    @Shawn - I went up only a fraction since my last test, but I feel way stronger. Once you get up a bit in fitness, increases are small. You are stronger - after an OS you'll see it out on the roads with others soon enough!
  •  Need some motivation here....been hitting all the workouts but the bikes have been a real struggle the past 6 weeks.  I did saturdays (todays) workout on thur and attempted to do the bike test this am.  Legs felt dead during warmup so called it quits and hoping to try tonight.  Anyone else struggle with this week's test?  I have been swimming hard on off days which is adding to fatigue.

     

  • @Eric:  yup I'm having the  same problem.  For me its been the last 4-5 weeks or so, but really bad the last couple of weeks, and my bike test on thursday didnt go well.  I should have clued in back then, but now I'm in damage control mode.  I have given it some thought and decided to shut it down and start the transition period early, and when I plug the the transition weeks into my training plan it basically gives easy bike and run workouts for 2 weeks (but I would be jumping in halway through, so no FTP workout until thursday).  Then I plan on doing the bike test as scheduled at the start of the bike focus plan in about a week's time.  I'm having  to fight my natural instinct which is to try to train harder when the workouts aren't going well, but I think at this point it is probably better to overdo the rest and come out stronger than to struggle along in a semiovertrained state for weeks and weeks.  

  •  Hmmm, so FTPs w/ new power numbers 48 hours after bike test and 24 hours before run test.  This is my first OS, so someone is going to have to explain to me why that is a good idea... 

    I've been really struggling in my recovery from Thursday's bike test. No matter what I eat/drink, and how much rest/sleep I'm getting, my body still doesn't feel quite 'right' again, and when I got on the bike this morning, it wasn't so much that I was tired, it's that my quads were still incredibly sore. I got through warmup, but there was no way I could do the ftps.  Then the negative energy started flowing, because I realized that not only was I undermining my recovery from thursday, I was also sabotaging tomorrow's run test by building up more fatigue...  Still, I couldn't figure out a triage on the spot, so I finished the ftps -- a solid 5-10 watts lower than what I was supposed to hit.  I'm not happy about this, but I really couldn't figure the purpose of today's workout given I'm supposed to try and crush it tomorrow... I thought about pushing back the run test, but I only have one t-week before jumping into my HIM plan and I want to take full advantage of that week.

    So not a BOOM kinda day and certainly not the way I wanted to end the bike portion of the OS, but at least I moved my legs for 75 mins, which I guess was good. Now to start prepping for tomorrow. I'm scared 

  • @Eric, if you didn't feel it this morning, I doubt you'll be feeling it this afternoon. My advice would be to shut it down totally and if you want to test, rest hard today and tomorrow (rest defined as NOT swimming hard) and then try it again Monday. You probably need some real recovery time if you want to realize your potential on a hard test. And, you probably already know this, but putting hard swims into recovery days has probably put you into a hole. Obviously, only you will know if this is truly is the case.

    Good luck.
  • Morning all, I got up a bit later (I have been in dire need of a bit more sleep lately so I got in an extra hour) and put in the 3x12 this morning. I hit the 95-100 and tacked on 17 min of Z3 at the end to get the 75 min. I did have a question. I have been and will likely continue for a while to do my bike work indoors. If I should get a nice day and want to break out and use my power numbers, is there an indoor to outdoor adjustment for FTP? I would assume it would be adjusted up but just curious. Looking forward to the run tomorrow!
  • I waited until this morning to try the bike test. Ouch! I am very glad I do not have to do that again for awhile.

    Beginning of OS - Vo2 = 235; FTP = 193

    Middle of OS - Vo2 = 254.9; FTP = 208

    End of OS - Vo2 = 272.4; FTP = 217

    I am very happy with the progression. Thank you all for the continued motivation. After the run test, it is off to the Get Faster plan for a few weeks.
  • Posted By Kate Kaufer on 02 Feb 2013 08:31 AM

     Hmmm, so FTPs w/ new power numbers 48 hours after bike test and 24 hours before run test.  This is my first OS, so someone is going to have to explain to me why that is a good idea... 

    I had noticed the same thing and whereas in other OS testing weeks this week had little to no tapering or opportunity for resting. It didn't quite make sense to me which is one of the reasons I put the Saturday workout on Thursday. Same with the Thursday FTP test which still had workouts on Tuesday and Wednesday that leave some fatigue. Probably a better option would have been to have the FTP test on Tuesday instead I think.

  •  Start OS: VO2 Max 382 watts and FTP 270 watts 

    Mid OS: VO2 Max 403 watts and FTP 298 watts

    End OS: VO2 Max 412 watts and FTP 302

     

    I did not have great expectations for today's test. After the mid OS test I had some difficulty doing the intervals which were suddenly much harder (due to a big FTP bump) but also very long. Several of them I was not able to complete. Missed all workouts last week due to travel and being sick, but in general based on the last few weeks I just wasn't expecting any measurable gain. (Measurable, because I still think my recovery went up, my general fitness went up, etc). In the first half of the OS I could clearly feel how riding at the FTP at that time gradually got easier and easier - which I never felt in the second half of the OS.

    Then again, my FTP / kg went up with 18% which is not bad. I know my outdoor FTP is about 15 watts higher than my indoor FTP... so that puts my outdoor FTP around 315 to 320 which is not a bad place to be at this time of the year. Still expecting to see an increase in FTP during the rest of the season though. 

     

     

  • Hi All,

    Congrats, Ben. Those numbers are impressive. I hear you about how the latter part of the OS felt. I don't have last year's 20 week OS to compare it to so I cannot tell if it was too much too soon but I agree that it was suddenly quite difficult to meet my workout goals (blood donation aside). Many of us felt the same pattern. Maybe it was jumping right in with even longer workouts at the higher numbers? I dunno but I got the sense that folks suddenly felt behind the 8-ball for the next month.

    I'm looking forward to a restful week but I'm nervous about bouncing back. My lungs felt I'd been inhaling noxious fumes all morning after that test. I was a total wreck all day, giving prospective contractors tours of our frozen house. All I wanted to do was lie down.

    Perhaps we should write an open letter to the JOS folks and warn them...
  • Well, the key thing to remind ourselves of is that our season is not determined by numbers at the end of the OS. It's about the races and those are still months away. If training this hard will result in a good training buildup to our A-race, then it was a great plan. For me, i think that will be the case (maybe missing a couple workouts or getting sick saved me from too much fatigue). Hopefully those with more fatigue struggles bounce back after a short rest for a great buildup to their A-race.
  • Hi All,



    @Ben - FTP 302 - I work every day in the hope that one day - one day - I might achieve that TP.

    Congratulations - it sounds like you're set up to build for a great and hilly season!



    @Peter - rest up, do some fun workouts and I'm sure you'll be good to go in a week!



    @William - Congrats - that's a really nice progression



    @Scott - Mark up from indoor to outdoor FTP... I would go with 6-8% depending on how hard you've been hitting it indoors. I've seen people go with 10%, or even more. I personally go with 7%. Glad to hear you got in some extra sleep - that alone is worth 5%... hope you get that warm weather you speak of at some point!



    @Kate - Scared? You? Then take control of the situation by going off the plan for a day because that's what works for you. It's the end of OS and you're on your own time now - for a few sweet days there is no "next workout" to worry about. My recommendation.... At this point, do the full warmup on Sunday. If you feel ready to hit it hard and your HR is in line, then fire up the afterburners and break the sound barrier. If you feel like you're not going to to your best, put in an hour of 12 on 2 off at 85% then focus on nutrition and rest and hit it hard before work on Monday! You've worked hard in the OS and you deserve to have the test results to show for that effort; if you know you need rest, trust that knowledge and schedule the rest. One day out of T-week isn't going to hurt... you have to write your own plans for next week anyway! Remember - at the end of the day, you are your own coach, and it's up to you to make the call as to whether you're slacking or really need a rest day before the big test. See notes below for Satish - we're all where you are.



    @Satish ... "it is probably better to overdo the rest and come out stronger than to struggle along in a semiovertrained state for weeks and weeks." Sound like words to live by to me - go with it. Workouts don't make you stronger. Recovery makes you stronger. Work breaks you down and gives your body something from which to recover. You've done the work - now recover - and then test.



    @Eric - x2 on what Satish said - do some workouts for fun - maintain the regularity but back way off the VO2 and extended FTP - sweet spot for an hour is good - consolidate your gains and let your body absorb the training stress you've applied. See Ann's comments on the benefits of enough rest.



    @Ann - that's awesome



    ---



    I am still a week behind you all - this morning's FTP workout (20/20/15) was good for me - very good, in that it was uneventful.

    I was tired during warmup, but not terribly so; started each interval on the low end (95%) and gradually stepped it up: 97.5%, 98%, 98%.

    Don't get me wrong... it was hard, but I decided that I wouldn't stop unless I absolutely had to, and I didn't have to.

    Now... I feel good. Nice adrenaline high topped with a touch of caffiene - pretty much as good as you can do legally...



    So next week is 14 for me, and I've turned it on its head a little...

    Sunday is take-two at the 2x800, 2x1mile at 5k pace.

    I find I do really well with the second take - it's as if I learn.



    Mon - off. Tue, strides. Wed, 5k test. Th off. Fri sweet spot 1 hr. Sat power test. Sunday... transition week!



    Great work and great posts everyone...it's been really fun struggling through this OS with you all!

  • Learning / Wiki / Self Coaching / Modifications / Tracking Personal Metrics ...
    http://goo.gl/iV7bP

    "...not everyone knows how to successfully navigate the day-to-day balance of work and fatigue"
    "As each of us navigates our training across a season, it's important to remember that the only thing that allows us to improve our fitness is recovery."
    "...your gains are due in large part to how you absorb each session"
    "For those of us who have full-time jobs or even full-time families the addition of quality, high–intensity training can eventually lead to a significant level of fatigue. It's hard to come up with general guidance since fatigue and recovery are very personal."

    The point -

    It's up to us to individualize our plans and make sure we're absorbing the work on a weekly basis rather than becoming progressively more fatigued.
    If you always hit every workout then you need to up your targets - you're not aiming high enough.
    If you fail to make your targets on 20% of your planned workouts then you need to look for cause:
    - Starting out too hot (e.g. positive splitting your workouts)
    - Targets set too high
    - Insufficient recovery time (we need more as we get older, or if we travel a lot, or if we were up late taking care of the kids...)
    - Poor nutrition / rest cycles
    - Life stress outside your training plan (this impacts your recovery)
    - Blood, bone marrow or organ donation

    We all want to negative split our workouts. We all want to hear the BOOM upwards of 100% of the time.
    My point - don't blame yourself for the fizzle - look for the cause, address it directly and set up the next BOOM.
  • @Kate - I agree, today's workout did not make a lot of sense. Last year I did it and I think it compromised my run test the next day. So, this year I walked a couple of miles instead. Also, I did the 1000m Swim TT on Wednesday and combined with the bike test on Thursday, was smoked on Friday and knew I needed today to recover some more. I think in the feedback this year, I am going to recommend that the test be moved to to Tuesday like Ben mentioned.

    @Russell - great post. Although RnP put that on a podcast during our OS, it really needs to be repeated often. Accumulated fatigue isn't just one workout and it's hard to identify exactly what caused it in our hectic lives but we all know when it happends!
  • I saw the calendar and thought the same thing so I flipped it. Ran today which worked out great. Will bike tomorrow.
  • great post Russell! all things to keep in mind.



    Today it wasn't raining the in Pacific Northwest so I decided to go outside for my ride. Oh my to me it's so much easier to hit my numbers on the trainer than outside. That seems to take practice. I did the best I could - safely and at least got close. tomorrow riding with my bike team so it will be a ABP ride. Figured bike test is done...so my transition means ride outside and with team. Did my run test last week....

    Oh and I must be the only person who feels like they might have a lower FTP outside than in? 



    It's been fun in this group...thanks for all the support!

  • I did the 20', 20', 15' on the trainer today and I am still tired after Friday's run (wed.'s run switched). Shortened the 25' w/u to 10' and then hit the workout. I stayed in low end of z4 to start each interval then gradually worked it up. Not the best feeling day but got it done. Looking forward to week 14 then a rest week!!!!!! image
  • Somewhat delayed in posting, been busy...... Actual test was Thursday evening....

    This was my thrid OS and despite being smart about over-achieving and avoiding any "extra" work (like swim) I ended with a rather flat rusult, <2% change in FTP and 0% change in VO2 max.</p>

    Circomstances leading to the test were less than optimum but I did have a 4 day workout break to recover from some fatigue and a fever.  Still I think the test went OK and is a reasonable reflection of my current fitness.  With a proper taper, I bbelieve I could post bigger numbers but IMLP is still more than 5 months away/

    Beginning OS  @ 241 & 198

    Ending OS        @ 241 & 201

    I had blown 2 mid OS tests because I went out way too hard on the VO2 part so I decided to aim lower and avoid that mistake.  Tried to Keep my VO2 watts between 245 - 250m hence the resulting 241.  Not terribly dissapointing - I long have known I dont do fast twitch very well, never have.

    For the FTP set I started at my current FTP (95% adjusted) and planned on increasing a few watts every 5 minutes.  Well, It may have kept me from exploding but I never could get the watts to go up.  Details and splits below.

    Test        AP     AveHR     MaxHR

    VO2      241      167        178

    FTP      212      171        175

    0-5'          212       163       171

    5-10'        214       172       174

    10-15'      210       174       176

    15-20'      211       173       176

    Hope to get outside today and do the 5K test up at the HS track.  Then off to Run Focus as I ramp up for Boston.

    Great crew here in NOS.  You have all halped and motivated me in many ways.  Thanks for the mojo!  

    Onward and Upward!

  • Hi all,

    Final bike test was uneventful, and an incremental gain over my prior:
    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/209239

    This has me at FTP=260, up from 225 at the beginning of OS, and I'm definitely happy with that gain.

    Honestly, I can't wait to get out on the road to see what all those watts can do for me!
    March is right around the corner...
  • @Russell - you'll be pleasantly surprised! My racing team has been doing 50-100mi bikes. I usually smoke them in April in 40k TTs!
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