Bike Course you can't ride steady

gamb

Ok.  Got a little sprint coming up just for fun and to go hard a little bit.  Problem is the bike course can't be ridden steady (at least for me).  Climbing the hills is above my FTP no matter how slow I go (some take 400W + just to get up them.  240ish FTP) and then the downhills you spin out on and this is often.  Tough bike course to say the least. 

Here's the bike course

 So thoughts on riding it.  Easy as I can up the hills and then just go hard everywhere I can?  Just hammer it everywhere and suffer.  I've cooked myself the past two years and barely been able to run 9's for the 5k when I'm typically 7-7:15 open 5k.  Not this run course because it's much like the bike but I would like to be able to run a little bit faster than in the past.  I'm not in the greatest shape but did a trainer workout last week that included 40 minutes at threshold then ran 2 miles at 8's off of it pretty easy so I think if I can figure out a way to not cook my lungs I'll be ok

Coach Rich

No reason to ride a sprint steady. Ride as hard as you can for the distance of the bike

gamb

Well I guess the root of my question is I want to run better off of it and obviously I can blow myself up in 15 miles. Cause I've done it 2 years in a row

Coach Rich

Typically sprints are ridden at about 95% of FTP. But rather then using the PM as a pacing tool (hold yourself back) it's typically used as a whip to ensure you see ^that^ number on the dial as much as possible after giving yourself maybe 5-10' of easier riding first to get your legs back. 

Or course, the commonsense guidance is to not go so hard that you crush yourself for the run but our guidance to ride very, very steady becomes more important at the longer distances, especially Ironman. It's less important at shorter races. 

If it were me, I'd use the PM as a tool to get me riding as fast as possible, given that fact that I also need to run a fast 5k when I get off the bike. 

mgraffeo

Race hard, put a cap on yourself based on how long the climbs are. Remember how you feel after a 3' VO2 interval? if you've got a 3' climb, you probably don't want to feel that way when you get to the top. So tell yourself you're going to target racing at FTP, and set a hard cap of 10% above that or so, unless it's a short (<30 second) climb. <br />
YMMV

morpheus

Jamie, I think we're in the same area, what race?



My take on this, and I'm no better than average, is target that FTP without spiking too much over. You're going to go over, I know these hills that you're talking about, and I think Mike has a great angle...how LONG are you going to HOLD that spike over FTP?



Look at it this way....you keep mentioning that you want to run better at this place, so, do everything you can to go strong/steady on the bike while the whole time you keep reminding yourself that you want to kill yourself on the run and see how long you hold the pain during that 5k.

 

Sorry, I know that this is stuff you already know.  These rollers do make it tuff.

gamb

Posted By Chris Hardbeck on 09 Apr 2013 05:05 PM

Jamie, I think we're in the same area, what race?



My take on this, and I'm no better than average, is target that FTP without spiking too much over. You're going to go over, I know these hills that you're talking about, and I think Mike has a great angle...how LONG are you going to HOLD that spike over FTP?



Look at it this way....you keep mentioning that you want to run better at this place, so, do everything you can to go strong/steady on the bike while the whole time you keep reminding yourself that you want to kill yourself on the run and see how long you hold the pain during that 5k.

 

Sorry, I know that this is stuff you already know.  These rollers do make it tuff.

It's the TriPathalon in town.  It's a fun race but tough and in my neighborhood so why not do it.  Live less than a mile from the start. 

 I ride the course roads all the time so I'm very familiar.  I'll try and manage myself better.  I think I know I can push some of the hills but others I need to back off.  We'll see, I"m not in the best of shape but I know I can run off a hard bike, I've done it in training, I just need to not kill myself on the bike

 I have a free weekend the week before so I might do a rehearsal.  Ride the bike at a good steadyish effort where I can and then run the first two miles and see how that goes

Coach Patrick

If the spikes are _that_ bad, you could consider going anti-EN and recovering a bit more on the downhills...or maybe riding at .9 on the flats instead of .95....but yes, it's all about the run!!!