New race wheels - suggestions please?

Dawn Cass

Hello - I currently have the stock wheels/rims on my P3 and looking to upgrade to race wheels.  I will be doing my first full IM this summer in Madison and want wheels that I can both train and race in.

Any suggestions on what's good on the market?

Do the actual rims/wheels make a big difference to speed?

Thanks.

Dawn

Al Truscott

Dawn ... You can spend anywhere from $90 to > $3000 on race wheels, so there's no one answer. But unquestionably the best bang for the buck is to get a rear disc cover from wheelbuilder.com. (the $90 solution.) Many folks @ EN put this on their rear "training" wheels to race an IM, including Coach Rich. For < $600, an aero helmet, expert bike fit, and disc cover will get you 98-99% of the way to the best possible set-up in terms of aerodynamics. Once you've spent those $, then consider the $$$$ for,the last 2%.

If you insist on spending 1000's of $, then Zipp Firecrest and Hed wheels have time tested reputations for quality, speed and durability.

Joe Matchette

@Dawn - do you have a powermeter yet? If not, then I would make that the next $$$ purchase after "aero helmet, expert bike fit, and disc cover".

William Jenks

Assuming you pass the above two tests, :-) have a look first and decide on a budget and then make a decision. $100 for a rear disk cover is a no brainer . For new wheels, FLO are a very good bargain choice if you have some time. Used Zipp and HED wheels are readily available. The older style Zipps are going for less than they used to because the fire rest models are the latest and greatest. For general usage you are probably looking for the "404 equivalent", which refers to a very popular Zipp model.

Dawn Cass

Thanks all for the comments. I want to "treat" myself on something big...wheels or power meter come to top of the list so interested to hear opinions on both! I got a professional bike fit already so happy on that side. Need to build my own strength and endurance through training however if I can get some help from wheels...power meter....helmet....I want to grab it.

Budget wise expect to spend a decent sum of $$ for wheels...will do it if worth it so great to hear thoughts!

Dawn

Scott Alexander

If you don't get a PM first, Coach Rich will show up on your doorstep and kick you in the bits. It's in the terms and conditions, I swear!

ezellrh

times 1000 on a power meter first. My n=1, it totally changed my perception/intensity/focus of training. Coming from 10+ years of road cycling/racing, it was the most significant improvement to my training ever enacted.

[Deleted User]

Agree with Roy and Scott, if you don't have a power meter THAT would be and was my first choice.  No question.

William Jenks

PM

Gordon Cherwoniak

Dawn,

I'd go with the power meter first as well.  You can get the rear wheelcover and a front wheel if you still have a extra cash. 

I have a power tap (4 years ago) and a rear disk cover from wheelbuilder while still saving for the front wheel. 

Gordon

Dawn Cass

Thanks all for the comments...you have really given me something to think about......next step to mail Rich on what kind of deals he can give on power meters.

Any general opinions on which power meter to go with....I only know a small amount about them however know there are a few options to go with.

Thoughts all?

Dawn

John Withrow

x10 on Powermeter before race wheels. Way more bang for your training/racing dollar. The most important question is, What is your budget?

You can get a Wireless Powertap wheel on eBay for ~$500. A disc cover is ~$85 or so. A used Quarq ~$1,000-1,100. A new Quarq for ~$1,300. A used Toroidal 404 clincher front for ~$400-550. A Toroidal 404 set or similar like (Reynolds Assault/Oval/Profile Design/Bontrageur set) for around $1,000. A Firecrest 404 front will be ~$800 and ~$1,600-2,000 for a whole FC404 or FC808 set. The FC404 is a little more versatile, but for my money (and my size), I'd rather have the FC808 set.

So with all that, here's what I'd do if it were me based on the following budgets:

$600 - Powertap wheel on eBay + disc cover
$1,000 - Powertap wheel on eBay + disc cover + used older 404 or similar front from eBay
$1,300 - disc cover for your existing wheel + Quarq + borrow a front wheel for your A-race
$1,500 - disc cover for your existing wheel + Quarq + rent a front wheel for your A-race
$1,700 - disc cover for your existing wheel + Quarq + used older 404 front or similar from eBay
$2,000 - disc cover for your existing wheel + Quarq + FC404 or FC808 front from eBay
$2,000 - alternatively, buy a used set of FC404s with a Powertap and a disc cover (but then you'll be training on your race wheels) (I have a FC404 set with Powertap for sale in the classifieds if you want this route)
$2,300 - quarq + older 404 set or similar (Reynolds Assault/Oval/Profile Design/Bontrageur set) + disc cover
$2,500 - Powertap training wheel + FC404 set with Powertap + disc cover (I have a FC404 set with Powertap for sale in the classifieds if you want this route)
$3,100 - quarq + FC404 (or FC808) set + disc cover

Dawn Cass

@John - Thanks for the rundown...very useful regarding budgets....will have a look into the options and see what feels best!  Appreciate it.

Dawn

William Jenks

Over the summer, I bought two PT wheels off ebay. Both were only a couple years old, which may have pushed the prices a bit, but I paid more like $650 each. I also was being fairly particular. I wanted a wider rim (e.g., Hed Belgium C2), so when I saw something that met all my criteria, I bought at least one of them on the "right now" price...so that's obviously not the way to be the cheapest possible buyer.

I watched for used FC 808 front wheels like a hawk for a few months and knew what the market was...and ended up buying one off slowtwitch rather than ebay for well below market...but had to move immediately for that to happen. this is, unfortunately, not the right time of year to do that.

Wm

Pina

PM For sure.
HED Jet 6/9 FR Clinchers if you want to shell out, I love them!
Otherwise I'd follow John's advice
@John... can you be my personal shopper?

Tom Glynn

I use Zipp 404's front and back with built in Powertap. Aero jacket on the back. Both wheels were purchased from e-Bay. If you want one wheel easily swapped between bikes, I'd go with a power tap and wheels that you can use for training and racing (like the 404 model). If you want expensive race wheels and a set of durable day to day wheels, go with a crank based power meter like quark. It's harder to swap bikes, so if you have a tri bike and a road bike you'll need to practice swapping out your cranks once in a while.

All good advice above - especially about Rich coming to visit you if you buy expensive wheels and no power meter

Dawn Cass

Hello! You all have me convinced. Currently thinking crank based PM...specifically quarq ELSA. In the future may do race wheels but for now, working on "the engine" is probably a better bet.

Will be shopping this weekend so any more thoughts, drop me a line! ;-)

John Withrow

Hey Dawn-- Send BicycleDoctor@att.net an email and ask for pricing on the Quarqs. About a month ago, they were offering the RIKEN for $1,299.90 (+$50 for BB30) and the Elsa for $1,599.90 (+$50 for BB30). I just bought an Edge 510 from them and I have 2 friends who recently bought the RIKENs from them. For my money, I'd get the RIKEN and save the $300 to put towards your disc cover or aero front wheel... $300 seems like a lot for 88 grams and L/R balance... Unless you happen to need a really short crank and then you would need the ELSA since the RIKEN only goes down to 170mm.

You should definitely get a Compact. My opinion is to also go shorter on the cranks. I'm 6'-1" and ride 170mm cranks. I could point you to some other threads on these topics if you are interested...

@Sukhi, I am the personal shopper for many of my tri friends... I love spending other people's money.

harrast

To add to John's post--I bought my quarq used/demo at Bicycle Doctor and saved a couple more $100's off their already competitive pricing. I had to wait a few weeks until they were ready to part with it, but it's nice to save some $$.

Dawn Cass

Thanks for the suggestion on Bicycle Doctor...good pricing indeed.

I have now ordered quarq elsa and should get it sometime this week.

I think if I am going to go with wheels at a later stage (which is still in the cards!).....seems a lot of debate/discussion around HED vs ZIPP. I imagine both are a good bet to go with however apart from the price difference, I don't really see what is the real benefit of one vs other??

John Withrow

Kind of like asking which is better, a Ferrari or a Lamborghini... I'm personally in the camp that owns and loves Zipp Firecrest wheels... I have bought into the science (or marketing) around the Firecrest shape, but it's really hard to argue against any of the other great wheels out there either. (HED, Enve, Bontrageur, Dura Ace, Mavic, Reynolds, etc, etc...)