@Jimmy, that's not an error...it's the weekend before the week you hit big long run mileage and do your Race Rehearsal!!! Hope you enjoyed the shorter (yet still hard!) ride!!!
in week 16 of intermediate IM plan there is a swim race rehaersal. But no other part of the RR is there. Is this a mistake? Should it be a regular swim set and then have the RR#2 swim in week 18 with the rest of RR#2?
P - It looks like there are two full distrance swims in the plan. The first comes the day before RR#1. The second comes a week before RR#2. Just want to be clear that this is intentional. It seems to me that the RR swim #2 should be moved out a week so that it can be the day before the rest of RR#2.
Jimmy, I downloaded and edited the plan before I replied to you...maybe you need to refresh? weeks 15,16,18 are all full distance swims...I made sure that was the way last night. Just downloaded and checked again, those 3 still stand, the others have a speed intro and longer main set for race pace work....hope that helps. I swear I am doing my best!!!
As I look back thru my mico thread questions, they can all be summed up as follows: Me - Do I really have to do ALL of that work? You - Yes. Me - Are you sure? You: Yes.
Coach - would you mind taking a look at my IMFL RR #2 report in the race reports section of the forum? I put it up and asked for feedback and got lots but varied responses. Would like your impression if you have time.
thx. ill drink more early. I could start with 3 bottles on the bike with the plan of drinking 2 per hr while picking up 1 per hr. Not sure I could grab two bottles at a station. On the power fade - Didnt really have one. Avg power was 156W (NP was 158) and the last hour and last 30min were both 155w avg with 157np.
@Jimmy rolling up you drink and ditch one....then first bottle grab and rack. Bottle #2 you grab and drink as much as you can / fill an aerobottle....then chuck it...
on the fade hard to see in online TP.com but I swear the power seems to drop in the latter half if no fade on power then you are rockstar fit and ready!!!
157AP for first 1/2 155 for second 1/2. dont you try and tell me I faded! I was going too slow to fade.
On the bottle #2, just drink as much as I can before the end of the aid station? makes sense. Plus I can ditch the cage on the down tube. None of the cool kids have a cage on their down tubes.
By bottle #2 you are past the end of the aid station...but there's a bit off a "buffer" ...I'd call it a 1/4 mile where you can drink and ditch it....make it the exit to start drinking so you are clear of swervers and tri-maniacs, etc.
Hey - sorry for taking up so much time - but a few of us are talking about the fact that there are aid stations every 10mi on the bike. We are considering just hitting all of them for the first 40mi or so and just taking one bottle per station. That way we are drinking more smoothly. Would this be slower?
Jimmy man between this and your Run Special Needs question you are clearly very focused on the time. Your goal is to leave EVERY AID STATION fully topped off internally and on the bike. B/c you never know what could happen...you might miss the next one...you might lose a bottle any time, etc. So yes early on you might not touch bottle #2...but eventually you will!!!
Well, it is a race after all. And since I can't get any fitter at this point I might as well focus on being as efficient as possible. In marathons, the early aid stations tend to be crazy packed so I tend to carry my own to get thru the first few miles so I. Can just run down the middle of the road and not get held up. I wonder how much speed / momentum is lost at bike aid stations and if they are long enough to grab 2 bottles. I have a torpedo / tube hydration thing but again, I would think that it might be tough to grab a bottle of perform, fill the torpedo and get rid of the empty perform bottle all before the end of the aid station might be tough.
@Jimmy, I totally hear you...I do the same obsessive stuff, so don't worry about it. In an Ironman, 112 miles has away of really spreading out the 2,500 folks such that the aid stations are NOT CROWDED in anyway as you would expect in a marathon. Not to mention the average marathon has a minimum of 7,500 competitors (up to 20,000)...
If you are good at an aid station, you lose nothing. To repeat, here is How To Successfully Execute An Ironman Aid Station Fluid ReFill (will have to suffice until I can get some video):
* Riding, drinking, eating being a good doo-bee....I see an aid station up ahead. * This prompts me to take my downtube bottle and fill up my torpedo (I only drink out of the torpedo!). I leave the torpedo bottle space open (see below). * I then SIT UP and drink as much of the remainder of the downtube bottle as possible / as I feel I can...then I toss that into the soccer net / bottle-catching contraption at the aid station entrance. * I roll into the aid station at about 18-20 mph, coasting. * Using my right hand, I point at the volunteer I want to grab a bottle from so they (and anyone behind me) knows what's about to happen. * I grab that bottle by "catching it" (remember, that bottle is effectively traveling at you @ 20mph!) and immediately rack it on my downtube space (ideally without looking down so I can still watch the road). * I continue pedaling through the aid station, making no eye-contact with volunteers and just keeping a straight line. * I then point and make eye-contact with the next Perform volunteer, repeating the steps above. * This time when I grab the bottle, I open it with my mouth and instantly begin drinking as I can (usually 3-5 big gulps, etc). If required I might add more to my torpedo bottle if there's room. * I then lightly toss the bottle (it's a loaded weapon being half full!) off the side of the road. This usually happens 100 to 300 feet after the aid station. * I then close my torpedo bottle and get back to work.
The net is I roll away with (1) my torpedo bottle 100% full. I have a full bottle on my downtube. I am personally 100% full.
Even if I have to slow down to 15 or 16mph, across a 600-ft aid station, I am losing maybe 20 seconds of regular ride time.
Generally rule of thumb is that you ALWAYS top off at every aid station as you just don't know what will happen between now and the next aid station. You could drop a bottle, you could have one bounce out, your rack could break, the next aid station is missing, doesn't have perform, etc.
This is good stuff. We really dont get to practice aid stations. Even in the 70.3's I've done I really only had to pick up 1 or 2 bottles given that I started with 3.
My target for perform from qt2 systems is 8 bottles on an IM bike.
I plan to use a torpedo and a cage behind my seat. I will head out of t1 with both full.
Given that there are aid stations every 10mi at florida I figure I will do my best to empty the torpedo between stations. At each station I will take a bottle, fill torpedo, ditch empty and go. If I can do this I will have had 11 bottles of perform and will still have a backup behind the seat. If I drop bottles or miss an aid station I will still have one behind the seat as a spare. If I use my spare I will just have to grab 2 at the next station.
If all goes as planned I could always grab the one behind the seat on my way into t2. Carrying the extra fuel might even help me slow down over the first few miles of the run.
@Jimmy you are right on for execution. No need to grab the bottle into T2, you'll already have your hands full with bag / changing and you will have an aid station at the exit or soon thereafter. Pumped for you!!!
Comments
4 it is. one more question on big day -
Is the 1hr swim just a steady 1hr continuous swim?
One minor note - in week 18 the session is listed as 60 minutes instead of the 90min that is listed in weeks 15 and 16.
I'll be swimming long this friday. I bet I take 2 minutes out of last weeks time too.
Me - Do I really have to do ALL of that work?
You - Yes.
Me - Are you sure?
You: Yes.
On the power fade - Didnt really have one. Avg power was 156W (NP was 158) and the last hour and last 30min were both 155w avg with 157np.
on the fade hard to see in online TP.com but I swear the power seems to drop in the latter half if no fade on power then you are rockstar fit and ready!!!
On the bottle #2, just drink as much as I can before the end of the aid station? makes sense. Plus I can ditch the cage on the down tube. None of the cool kids have a cage on their down tubes.
Would this be slower?
I have a torpedo / tube hydration thing but again, I would think that it might be tough to grab a bottle of perform, fill the torpedo and get rid of the empty perform bottle all before the end of the aid station might be tough.
If you are good at an aid station, you lose nothing. To repeat, here is How To Successfully Execute An Ironman Aid Station Fluid ReFill (will have to suffice until I can get some video):
* Riding, drinking, eating being a good doo-bee....I see an aid station up ahead.
* This prompts me to take my downtube bottle and fill up my torpedo (I only drink out of the torpedo!). I leave the torpedo bottle space open (see below).
* I then SIT UP and drink as much of the remainder of the downtube bottle as possible / as I feel I can...then I toss that into the soccer net / bottle-catching contraption at the aid station entrance.
* I roll into the aid station at about 18-20 mph, coasting.
* Using my right hand, I point at the volunteer I want to grab a bottle from so they (and anyone behind me) knows what's about to happen.
* I grab that bottle by "catching it" (remember, that bottle is effectively traveling at you @ 20mph!) and immediately rack it on my downtube space (ideally without looking down so I can still watch the road).
* I continue pedaling through the aid station, making no eye-contact with volunteers and just keeping a straight line.
* I then point and make eye-contact with the next Perform volunteer, repeating the steps above.
* This time when I grab the bottle, I open it with my mouth and instantly begin drinking as I can (usually 3-5 big gulps, etc). If required I might add more to my torpedo bottle if there's room.
* I then lightly toss the bottle (it's a loaded weapon being half full!) off the side of the road. This usually happens 100 to 300 feet after the aid station.
* I then close my torpedo bottle and get back to work.
The net is I roll away with (1) my torpedo bottle 100% full. I have a full bottle on my downtube. I am personally 100% full.
Even if I have to slow down to 15 or 16mph, across a 600-ft aid station, I am losing maybe 20 seconds of regular ride time.
Generally rule of thumb is that you ALWAYS top off at every aid station as you just don't know what will happen between now and the next aid station. You could drop a bottle, you could have one bounce out, your rack could break, the next aid station is missing, doesn't have perform, etc.
My target for perform from qt2 systems is 8 bottles on an IM bike.
I plan to use a torpedo and a cage behind my seat. I will head out of t1 with both full.
Given that there are aid stations every 10mi at florida I figure I will do my best to empty the torpedo between stations. At each station I will take a bottle, fill torpedo, ditch empty and go. If I can do this I will have had 11 bottles of perform and will still have a backup behind the seat. If I drop bottles or miss an aid station I will still have one behind the seat as a spare. If I use my spare I will just have to grab 2 at the next station.
If all goes as planned I could always grab the one behind the seat on my way into t2. Carrying the extra fuel might even help me slow down over the first few miles of the run.