Keith W. micro thread
Hi Coaches,
I've been looking at the OS Modification Flowchart and thinking about the bike focus. This isn't so much because of the need for bike focus, but I'm starting to lose the frequency of the running based on scheduling and find it easier to jump on the bike at 8:30 pm vs go for a run, in the cold, and the dark, on ice, here in Boston. In looking at the schedule of: Tues & Sat is Saturday ride and Thurs/Sun is Tuesday ride I was wondering the following how to incorporate the vo2 max workouts into this schedule. I like the OS so far this year with the Tues FTP, Thurs VO2 & Sat FTP rides and it seems to be working well for me. Which ride would I substitute in the Vo2 max?
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Now if you have to shitcan a Wednesday run b/c of weather, do the Thursday bike there and try the run on Thursday.
Am I helping!?!!?
P
I'm about to jump into the Get Faster plans next week after my epic no swim-Swim Camp weeks (I have a plan for that swim stuff). In looking at the plans for the bike I noticed that they are similar to the old OS in that there is 2 threshold workouts the first few weeks and then it switches to 2 Vo2 max workouts per week about half way through. I've had such good success with the threshold and vo2 combo within a week that I'm wondering if there is a downside to keeping that schedule? In the past OS's I've had a hard time rebounding from the Vo2 weeks to get back into threshold stuff, but this OS has felt different and good for a number of reasons, so I'm also curious if I won't repeat that issue. I was able to do most of the bike focus weeks (although not so much running), but lost it on the last week and a half---not sure if it was because of the 4 bikes per week or the 2x 110% stuff.
Just wondering your thoughts on the FTP/Vo2 combo or just stick to the plan?
Thanks-Keith
I've never felt that I was able to do well with the intervals at my last tested FTP---bad legs last 2 weeks of OS, not great test as needed 2' break during the 20'--but FTP went from 216 to 233,--- swim camp weeks don't have much riding, and then I don't normally do well with new FTP and jumping into 20' intervals.
Life has also been kicking my ass with coaching, some weird stuff at work, plus did I mention this week I've been sick? I have a more normal week of just work and a few meetings before coaching starts up the week after, but I've got a plan for the new coaching season and workouts
Plan options:
1. Drop down my FTP back to 220, keep the amount of FTP time, but break it up into shorter units like I have been--adjusting them by feel daily.
2. Drop from advanced plan GF to intermediate while keeping 233 FTP
3. Do combo of Begin GF plan for bike with Adv GF for runs and keep 233 FTP
If you have other thoughts, feel free to add those in.
Thanks for your help.
Make sense?
I'm struggling with a hip/IT band issue that just won't go away, so I'm just not able to get any real running mileage in. I'd like to put some additional bikes into my plan as the bike does not seem to impact the hip issues. Time is not an issue since I'm not working now, so I could reasonably bike 5-6 times per week. What should I put into the weekly training plans in place of the runs? I will probably run 2-3 times per week for no more than 25 minutes at MP (if my PT approves it).
Thanks-
I'm about 4 weeks out from IMMT.....so bad timing for no running
. I've been struggling with this issue for about 3 weeks now, so the run has been really limited, but I did feel I ran well a month ago at 70.3 Mont Tremblant. I'm going to try pool running this week, but I'm not sure what that will be like.
On a sidenote, it'll be great to see you there!
I'm doing the run focus plan, but the Thursday run is really hard for me to get in logistically. Can I shift it to Friday, the flip the Sat run to Sunday, then the Sunday bike to Saturday?
Thanks,
I'm doing some research prep for the upcoming OS in few weeks. In trying to do the run durability project and incorporate it into the OS I noticed it says the following for the interval run for Outseason weeks 28 to 25:
2 x 45' as 2 x 1 mile (4') @ TP/Zone 4/Hard
I get the 2 x 1 mile repeats, but I don't understand the 2 x 45'. Can you clarify this part? Does this mean the total run is 1:30? with 4 one mile repeats?
Let me know. Thanks.
If I start to use the new warm up during the OS, given that it has 12' @ 80-85%, does this just shift the last part of the Tues OS workouts from the end to the beginning or is it a matter of extending the workouts so there is ABP time in the warm up and at the end after the intervals?
In my mind extending is always optional but a good warm up is critical. Esp if you start tracking your power numbers and Avg HR for the last 1' of that interval -- those become critical indications of your fitness and readiness!
I'm starting the OS in December due to some illness over the past month. In reading other people's threads--mainly Cronk--it seems that you really had them focus on being able to be a strong biker before really attacking the run portion. I know I'm not nearly in there league, but it has me questioning whether or not this is a good time for me to take on the run durability project vs should I do a normal OS, but make it a true bike focus OS. What are your thoughts? My bike numbers over the past few years have been stable (no real bump and 240-250 FTP is starting to piss me off), which is what's making me rethink bike over run. But when I compare the two, I know that I totally suck at running.....thus my conflict. I'm willing to do a phone consult to figure this out if a conversation about where I'm at would be more helpful. Right now I feel like I'm chasing Kona (dreaming) by wandering around Oahu (although I'm nowhere near KQ). I just want a bump to come from someplace vs nickel and diming may way through this stuff.
Thanks for any guidance.
That said, most "focus" points aren't during the OS (for results) I usually recommend them more in season when the weather is nicer....aka add a 4th bike, for example.
I prefer the bike focus first (year two in the EN Three Year plan, see wiki section) as it's low cost and fun to ride faster and further, etc. But there are other factors like health, body composition, etc, that if altered could lead to solid improvements as well. IOW, faster isn't always about more work.
Now that I think about it, given your lifelong status as EN member you might want to mix up the OS a bit using a fixed week not unlike the one I set forth in my training update...let's talk.
Please keep me posted!
Hey Coach P,
Background:
It's been so long since I've really been on the thread that I hope it still works. Life and well old age caught up to me, but I'm trying to get back on this horse with a 1-2 year plan. I've been riding consistently on the trainer since Sept. and going between Trainerroad sweet spot base, then some power builds, which has really strengthened my knee. I haven't run in over 2.5 years due to knee surgery/rehab issues. I've been following the EN modified/accelerated Return to Run Program where I only did each run 2x's, added a 4th interval to each run, jumped over some weeks (6'w/4'run, 7'w/7'r), and am finishing my 2nd 5'w/8'r tomorrow. I'll be at run #8 this weekend. At this point in the process, I feel my overall run conditioning is the issue, not so much the injury. I don't pay too much attention to pace when I run, so It's just what speed my legs want to go regardless of how my lungs feel. According to my Garmin, my HR during run intervals is 165-175 bpm, so it's putting me in zone 4-5 HR for a good chunk of time during the run part.
Question:
What should the focus be: (1). just continue to finish the next 2 weeks at the speed my legs want to go or (2). start to dial in the run part to where my zones should be vs the faster pace I'm running now for the 8-10' intervals?
Is the long term goal of the Return to Run Protocol to be able to continually run for 40 minutes or to be able to jump into a SC or HIM plan to complete the workouts as prescribed?
Thanks for any guidance you can provide.
@Keith Wick - the forum thread definitely works! So good to hear from you. I can actually hear your voice as I read through your post! 🤣 really excited to hear that you're getting back on the training focus, and grateful that you chose the proper plan to start.
I think being in a place where you can run consistently and not have to worry about effort is a great place to start. The challenges arise when folks start trying to force speed or a certain distances. Mo zen is mo better at this point!
Once you get to run #8, our goal is to continue the run build. Ideally we get you to the point of 9' run / 1' walk that could carry you through the rest of the season. Think running between aid stations but walking the aid stations. 👍
In terms of the next plan, it's it's about the running workout progression and more about how you see the overall season. Do you see it being some thing where you would be more try focused? Or are you more in the Duathlon space with the current situation due to COVID-19? Ideally we would be able to begin adding some "light" volume on the bike now that the weather is nicer.
We don't want to overstress the knee, but extending the ride time on the weekends is good for the mind and body. I could see you moving into one of our Durability Run programs (#2 or #3) for four weeks to get more of a traditional progression, and then making the call about the rest of the year. What do you think?
~ Coach P
My initial thoughts were to try and get into an Olympic by the end of the year, but that will depend completely on this run progression. I've been able to sit on the bike trainer for 2 hours, so I feel like if I just maintain that on the bike for now (maybe push to 3 hours once I get outside) then I'm happy with that. Given the situation, I'm going to ignore swimming for now and see what July holds.
I'll keep building the run, working toward the 9'/1' without paying attention to speed. I'll take a glance at the run durability program and then start to test out shorter back to back run days.
Thanks so much. It's hard to build back to running without feeling like it's taking too long. I think the plan and reassurance on it is really helpful.