Sunday Long Run Nutrition - What do you do?

[Deleted User]

At risk of asking a stoopid question ... would appreciate some team wisdom here ... 

Even as the OS long Sunday run has gradually ramped from about 45' to 80'+, I still am not taking any nutrition/hydration with me. Instead I tend to be extra hydrated sunday morning, take a gel before heading out, and refuel when I get back. I'm hitting my targets so seems to be going well.

Starting to wonder though if this is a bad idea ... should I be making more of an effort to practice fueling on the run during the OS? Or is there plenty of time in season for that?

I really just hate to carry more gear while running so have been avoiding this as long as possible. 

Thanks for your $0.02.

 

rlh2000

There seem to be different camps on this one. Some vote for more fasted workouts, others really stress the importance of fueling workouts. I think a good clue to whether you are fueling your workouts well enough is 1) able to perform well and not crash; 2) not overeat the rest of the day. I am a fan of fueling workouts rather than using the calories burned as a bonus the rest of the day and license to eat whatever. I generally take a gel for anything over 8 miles. Not much to carry, just pin it to my shorts/pants or in a jacket pocket when it gets warm. Another reason to fuel is to start figuring out what works for you and what doesn't, and train your gut so you are ready to fuel in the race.

Chris Davis

Good question David. Thank you for asking it. I'm interested to hear everyone's feedback as well.

I have some Gatorade Endurance in a handheld squeeze bottle that I use for hydration on runs. I also carry a gel with me, but I dont use it unless I start to feel shaky or something.

One reason I've decided to start using nutrition this early is to start experimenting, both with the nutrition itself, and also the gear to carry the nutrition.

Brad Marcus

@David - I generally fuel on runs > 1 hour. Here is why:
1 - As Rachel mentions, it is good practice. You will figure out and get your gut used to what works and what does not work leading to better success when our runs increase in distance at some point. For me, my GI system used to not be able to tolerate much at all on a run besides water. I can now drink sports drink and take gels, usually without incident.

2 - I am a big believer in how improper fueling/hydrating effects downstream workouts. This is especially apparent to me when the workouts increase in length. Although I am not a "heavy sweater", I can lose some serious weight on a run when the weather gets warmer. It's really easy to ignore this now when we are running in cooler temps. But, I think that not taking in any liquids/calories during these runs, can hurt you a day or two later.

I'm sure that you may get different answers depending on who responds, but I'm a full convert vs just a couple years ago when I didn't take in anything on runs.

Scott Giljum

David, I will typically fuel like I would on race day for the gut training others have mentioned and to try and reduce the hangry (hungry+angry) I can become if I am not properly fed. This is a sneaky one I think in that I don't think the downstream effects show up for a bit, at least for me. So for me, I can be going along with nothing for a week or more and then suddenly feel like someone kicked out the plug. I also rarely miss a chance to research and fawn over some knew piece of gear (yes, those are my wife's eyes rolling as we speak). Seriously though, I look at it as through the OS I am training more than my legs.

Shaughn Simmons

Over ten miles:

No breakfast, glass of half diluted Perform out the door and half diluted perform as needed depending on temps.

At mile 7, I start ingesting 1 Caf cliff blok shot and repeat every two miles.

That works for me....

SS

CountingStars

Me personally: Runs over 60-75 minutes: Gel at 45, and every 45 after. I can go 60-65 minutes and feel fine, but much past that I need a bit more... but since it takes time for your body to process and use, I'll bump the time back ~20min to find my fuel time. It's gotten longer as I've gained experience running. Mornings, I need to have a bite before I go out; I usually run in evenings.

IMO (runner coming into tri) - practice what you're going to race. I have problems switching from fasted to fed runs, my body has to relearn how to process fuel. There's plenty of variables to be had: liquid v. gel v. solid fuel, how much water to take in with it, how much to you really need, some people can't tolerate some brands.

Fortunately the only time I've had problems has been one long run after enjoying pepperoni pizza for supper - I was fine until the chocolate gu hit my stomach and didn't play well with the pepperoni.

[Deleted User]

Thanks for all the good perspectives folks (and if you haven't chimed in yet - keep them coming).

I like Scott's comment about "training more than the legs", and I need to recognize the 4th discipline (nutrition) was where my IMWI '11 went terribly wrong.
So, even though I seem to be able to make it through just fine for now, makes sense to practice/condition the nutrition. Also, as was mentioned... will get much harder when it's warm out again I'm sure.

Thanks folks!

Mike Roberts

@David,

I always eat a few carbs before heading out for a run (English muffin or half a bagel).  After that, my simple rules are, anything over 5 miles, I'm wearing a Fuel Belt with sports drink and/or water.  Above 8 miles, I'll add a gel at the halfway point.  If I'm in the teens, at least 2 gels.  Why? 

1.  It's good practice (a well-trained stomach = a strong stomach). 

2.  EN long run WKOs are serious endeavors that occasionally border on the mean-spirited.  If I'm supposed to run 12 miles with a couple of Z4 miles sprinkled in, and then run home at HM pace, I'm sure as hell gonna need all the nutritional help I can get.

3.  I recover much, much faster when I properly fuel a hard WKO.  And recovery is what sets me up for a whole lot of WKOs the following week. 

Jonathan Collins

@David
Generally for runs 1 hour or less, I just run. Over 1 hour, I start planning my nutrition that I will use on race day. Usually 1 gel every 30 mins. I use a combo of Infinit and powergel depending on what I feel like carrying or having.

Nate Parady

During the OS I'm typically running or biking after having eaten on the weekend. So I'm just water on the bike and for the run I have a water fountain on one of my loops or I carry a small 3-4 oz flask with water in it.

During the week, most mornings I'll do a cup of coffee and some water before and some water during bike sessions. Maybe a half a banana if I'm hungry.

Runs are water before and out the door.

I try to keep things simple in the OS.

I also like the idea of staying away from sports drink unless I'm doing long stuff. Having said that, for anyone needing to practice race day nutrition, every run or bike is an opportunity to practice and experiment.

Keith Wick

I've not been fueling my runs with anything, but think that I'm going to change that from nothing to a purely electrolyte drink (Nuun tabs in water). I'm changing because I feel very dehydrated from my runs--energy is fine, but feel that the cost of rehydrating is taxing on my body. Over the past year, I've gotten away from gels and been fueling my races with real food. I still do some calories in drink (Skratch labs), but this is a lot less than gatorade or perform.

Keith Wick

I've not been fueling my runs with anything, but think that I'm going to change that from nothing to a purely electrolyte drink (Nuun tabs in water). I'm changing because I feel very dehydrated from my runs--energy is fine, but feel that the cost of rehydrating is taxing on my body. Over the past year, I've gotten away from gels and been fueling my races with real food. I still do some calories in drink (Skratch labs), but this is a lot less than gatorade or perform.

Steve West

Typical long run starts with a PBJ 2 hours before and I pre-load 24 oz water just before starting and carry 24 oz on a belt. Gels for calories every 4-5 miles plus I often will carry an extra gel in case I start to bonk. I also can refill my water at mile 6.2 on my long out-and-back.

Some long runs I under-fuel by eating less before, and / or skip the first gel, sometimes the second, just to remind myself what it feels like to run under-fueled.

Mark Maurer

During the out season I don't usually take anything on my runs that are less than 90 minutes. I have several routes with water fountains and I use those liberally. Of course this time of year it's usually nice and cool so sweating and hydration is not as big of a deal as it will be later in the season. Once the run gets over 90 minutes I will take gels, clif blocks, or power bars along with me depending on what I feel like that day. I do usually eat before starting a run over 60 minutes and I always eat or drink a recovery drink right after I get in the door.

Mike Weinmann

for anything more than an hour, I take a 24oz bottle of Perform. during the OS, I've been doing the mile repeats at the track and take a swig during the recoveries -- usually end up finishing the whole bottle during the run.

i leave the bottle in the track infield, so i'm not carrying any extra weight during the speed work. i've also converted to properly fueling wko's to avoid binge eating later in the day.

Gonzalo Canteros Paz

Normally take a gel before leaving and one halfway through the run when the run lasts more than 1 hour

I am more conscious of hydration in the hot months and I add a fuel belt with 2x6 oz bottles where I carry either gatorade or (if I feel I really need more or if the run is longer than half marathon distance) a mix of water+carbopro+EFS 1st endurance (that is what I use o. I decide before leaving based on how I feel.

Also have a fountain in my loop at about mile 2 that I would stop at if I really feel I need the extra water.

hope this helps

Tony Puckett

Like a lot of others, I do not take and nutrition or water with me until the run is over an hour.
But I will have a gel before a run if more than an hour. This Past Sunday I had a Vega orange goo before the run and three blocks of clif shot gel. I took the other three blocks with me but did not eat them.
I do not take water or fluids in the winter. Maybe I will when the runs get to 90 minutes.
Good stuff to consider and try on this thread. Thanks.

Jan Schorpion

I always run with a water bottle, no matter how long the run , just in case I need to take a sip. I usually take a sip every mile. During the season when trianing for specific races, I will run with gatorade or Perform ( will be more Gatorade now that that will be offered on IM branded courses). I always take a salt pill before I go out, just to help prevent stomach problems. If I run first thing in the morning, I head out on an empty stomach, if I run later in the day I will be careful not to eat anything or as little as possible within 2 hours before I head out. Nothing is worse than having to go 3 miles away from your house. 

zwuba

OK I just realized that I obviously don't pay a lot of attention to that topic at all

The only run workouts were I really take care about fueling while running are the typical Thursday long runs in the HIM and IM plan and of course all race-simulation runs and race-rehearsal runs! There I typically take a sip of perform every 2k (which is a typical distance between the aid stations) and a gel every 5-6k.

For all the OS run workouts I've never fueled my outworn body while running. Though I try to pre-fuel and pre-hydrate well with a good load of carbs about 1,5h out of the run and a perform-bar or something similar 30' before starting!
This is for sure not something everybody can or should do but I know I can handle dehydration and a talk to bonko-the-clown pretty good ... have already done at least 2 half-marathon races without putting anything down my throat

For "fasting runs" I do normally eat or drink a small portion of carbs like half a banana or a small glass of fruit juice and out we go.

Ralph Moore

I fall in the nutrition every workout camp.

The main reason is that the Core nutrition lecture in the Wiki says that you should fuel every workout in order to make sure that you can effectively metabolize the calories on race day. I think many folks in EN have different ways of doing nutrition for short workouts but I have found that I can do most of the OS and build workouts without paying too much attention to the nutrition but then it bites me on race day. The limiting factor in all of my races longer than an Olympic has been my nutrition tolerance, not my fitness. Therefore, I practice it at least as often as I do my fitness.

[Deleted User]

Thanks again for all the great builds folks - going to start hydrating / fueling and to train the tummy and see how that goes.
My nutrition plan failed miserably last time, so getting this to a better place is critical for me.

mille1as

I drop water so it will be convenient if I need it. My favorite fuel for running is sweet potato. I bake a sweet potato until it just barely softens up - cut into wedges and put in a baggie. Then I pop a wedge when I need it. If not, I throw the leftovers out for the raccoons

RachelB84

I have tried both (fuelling and not fuelling on long runs). Anything over about 60 minutes I bring a gel (or two, depending on run length) and usually electrolyte drink (or water depending on my mood,really). Right now, I'm using long runs as a chance to try out gels and blocks to see which works better for me. So far, gels are winning because i almost choked on a powerbar gummy thing a couple weeks back. I also like to see how my gut reacts to different foods to try and sort out the "best" solution for racing.
I find the biggest benefit to fuelling on long runs, for me, is the recovery afterwards. I have done a few long runs without taking on enough fuel, and I usually am a mess for the rest of the day.

robin sarner

I get plenty of GI practice during the 10 weeks before an ironman.     then I hydrate and eat like I would on race day, before and during the long run.

for the OS, I go light.    maybe a gel and water during the run sometime.     light breakfast before.      I think it is good to vary things so the body and GI tract does not get used to one thing.    and running on lower calories may have some benefits, but I don't do the full carb deprivation thing.     

lots of things may happen on race day.     it is good to practice the standard intake.   but I think having the body be able to adjust to different situations is good too.

 

[Deleted User]

Quick update....

The Mrs got me a nice handheld bottle for Christmas so tried the long run yesterday with some Gatorade and GU. It is truly n = 1 in that it is 1 workout, but I liked having the option to put something in, especially as the miles started racking up.

Despite looking for a simple easy answer it's clear this is a ymmv type situation and you really need to try different approaches to see what works best for you. For me, getting stuff down and keeping it there has been a challenge in the past so going to work on practicing that as much as possible in the longer wkos.

Thanks!