Bike specific volume camp or "tri-camp"

Mark Maurer

Hey folks, my wife, also an EN member, and I are planning on taking a week off in late March and doing a big bike week. But I've read in other places on this site that a big bike week is most useful in the last 10 weeks or so leading up to an IM. We're both doing Victoria 70.3 in mid-June and then Challenge Penticton in late August. So my question to all of you is, given the timing, which would be a better option? Should we do a big bike week as laid out in the wiki or would a high volume "tri-camp" week where we did swimming and running as well be better? I'll be in the last phase of the intermediate get faster plan and Susan will be in the last part of JOS. Of course by then just doing the workouts in those plans may be enough and getting in the extra recovery and some wine tasting would be the best thing for over 50 bodies.

FYI - this is Susan's first NOS and my 2nd year in EN though we've both been doing triathlon for 13 seasons.

 Cheers

Coach Rich

Posted By Mark Maurer on 17 Feb 2015 11:16 PM

Hey folks, my wife, also an EN member, and I are planning on taking a week off in late March and doing a big bike week. But I've read in other places on this site that a big bike week is most useful in the last 10 weeks or so leading up to an IM. We're both doing Victoria 70.3 in mid-June and then Challenge Penticton in late August. So my question to all of you is, given the timing, which would be a better option? Should we do a big bike week as laid out in the wiki or would a high volume "tri-camp" week where we did swimming and running as well be better? I'll be in the last phase of the intermediate get faster plan and Susan will be in the last part of JOS. Of course by then just doing the workouts in those plans may be enough and getting in the extra recovery and some wine tasting would be the best thing for over 50 bodies.

FYI - this is Susan's first NOS and my 2nd year in EN though we've both been doing triathlon for 13 seasons.

 Cheers

Sorry, not understanding your question, as you seem to jump from a discussion of a week in March to maybe a week closer to your races? 

If you're talking about what to do in March in relation to your first race in mid-June and then August, I don't think the flavor of the week in March really matters, as it's still pretty far out from your June race. BIG volume is more effective when done closer to your race. For example, that window of Wk14-18 in your TSR. That's where the money is. 

IMO, I think having separate Bike Focus and Run Focus weeks is more effective than a Tri Week. That is:

• A Run Focus week is something you can usually roll from home without crazy logistics, by simply adding a run or two and adding 15-20' to your existing runs. In other words, adding 1:30-2hrs to your existing run schedule. That's pretty easy to do, from a planning and execution stand point, from your home without special logistics, etc. And at the same time maybe scaling the bike back a bit, or at least the intensity to facilitate the bump in run volume. And so the net is a pretty big jump in running volume, say from the typical 30-35mi week to 45+.
• A Bike Focus week, if we're talking about going BIG on the bike, usually means a 3-day weekend, etc. IOW, it's a bigger logistical footprint that may include moving to a more formal training camp location, etc. Then, within this Bike Focus week, maintain your running frequency (sorta) but drop the volume, and maintain your swimming frequency, if possible given location, mostly for recovery. 

Mark Maurer

Hi Rich, sorry for the confusion. It was clear to me what I meant to say. We're going over to the dry side of the state in March and we were thinking of doing a big bike week (as outlined in the wiki as 5 days of riding with a couple of 100+/- days) but then I started thinking about it and started to wonder if that's the right thing to do that far out from out races. So perhaps the question should be of you had a week to get away and train that was 10 weeks out from your first A race (a HIM) how would you structure it?
A confounding factor is that the area you're going to is wine county with lots of vineyards and trading rooms.

Mark Maurer

Posted By Mark Maurer on 18 Feb 2015 09:29 AM

Hi Rich, sorry for the confusion. It was clear to me what I meant to say. We're going over to the dry side of the state in March and we were thinking of doing a big bike week (as outlined in the wiki as 5 days of riding with a couple of 100+/- days) but then I started thinking about it and started to wonder if that's the right thing to do that far out from our races. So perhaps the question should be of you had a week to get away and train that was 10 weeks out from your first A race (a HIM) how would you structure it?
A confounding factor is that the area you're going to is wine county with lots of vineyards and tasting rooms.

Al Truscott

Mark, it's not clear if you're talking about taking the week off and *going* somewhere, or just intend on having a week off and staying @ home, using the time to switch up your training program. Here are some of my thoughts on this:

• It's *always* a good idea to mix up training, meaning 14 weeks straight of the OS as written gets pretty stale, especially if you have a long history of s/b/r training.
• I've done lots of variations on a week long block of endurance activity over the years: multi-day group bike tours, tri camps, big bike weekends,. All of them (except the 2013 EN "National Rally" in Tucson) were *private*, meaning just something I did myself with friends/family.
• I've done them in all phases of training, and truthfully can't decide when might be the best time. I once did a week long bike tour (no swimming, ran once) in Canada 2 weeks before the Spokane Troika HIM, and had my best race ever there.
• As a general rule, my thought is, if you aren't within 6-8 weeks of an HIM, or 10-14 weeks of an IM, don't worry about trying to fit specific "training" into your "fitness week" vacation; just do what the locale or your whim indicates. IOW, if there's no pool or lake available, don;t worry about swimming; if you can;t take your bike along, don't worry about cycling, etc.

Living where you do, you really have a lot of choice if you are staying home. I'm sure you can easily get 3-500 miles of good country cycling in without driving anywhere: Rochester loop, Rainier/Yelm/Tenino loop, part of the STP route, Chehalis/Western + Yelm/Tenino trails, etc. So if you;re staying home, pick a focus - swim, bike, or run - but don't neglect the other disciplines. Above all, while continuing to do fitness stuff you enjoy DON'T look on it as something which has to be structured specifically towards race goals. Rather, see it as a way to clear some head space FROM training while maintaining your desire to "have fun with your fitness". My 2¢.

Coach Rich

Posted By Mark Maurer on 18 Feb 2015 09:29 AM


Hi Rich, sorry for the confusion. It was clear to me what I meant to say. We're going over to the dry side of the state in March and we were thinking of doing a big bike week (as outlined in the wiki as 5 days of riding with a couple of 100+/- days) but then I started thinking about it and started to wonder if that's the right thing to do that far out from out races. So perhaps the question should be of you had a week to get away and train that was 10 weeks out from your first A race (a HIM) how would you structure it?

A confounding factor is that the area you're going to is wine county with lots of vineyards and trading rooms.

Hey Mark,

Good points from Al. I think the net is that that far out from your race, it doesn't really matter what you do, as long as what you do is epic, fun, and therefore valuable on it's own merits. 

Al Truscott

Mark - "Dry side". Don't know where you're planning on going, but I've found GREAT cycling around Walla Walla, Ellensburg, and the area around the old Grand Columbian Tris. Yakima Valley, or Tri Cities, not so much.

Mark Maurer

Al, we're going to Walla Walla. It looks like a lot of good bike routes around there, some of which I've already loaded into my 810.

Al Truscott

My daughter went to Whitman, class '12. We went out a couple of times a year, I did lots of training for IM AZ there. The college bike club has a great map of local routes, I'm sure you can pick it up at the student store/center. Our favorite restaurant was in, believe it or not, Dayton, Patit Creek. Don't be fooled by how it looks.

robin sarner

I am not hearing the answer to the question I think is being asked.    so I am going to ask my own question.

within 10 weeks of an ironman, what is better to do?   Bike Bike week or Big Tri week.

until last year, I have done Bike Bike weeks.     But I now feel that this is not a great idea.    Bites into the overall training,   takes a while to recover from.   etc.

I now think that a big volumed Big Tri week is the way to go.                 what do the coaches and others think?

 

Dino Sarti

My vote is a big bike week, simply because the origins of the practice as I understand them are that a BIG volume blast early in the season will give you a huge TSS bust that you can build on for the rest of the season.

I host a Big Bike week for my ti-club. This is March will be the 3rd annual. We do it early in the season to create that cycling fitness for the rest of the year. It's four long days of riding all of it on stout mountain course. Gain after 4 days is 32K feet.

It's a great event and I would highly recommend.

Al Truscott

Posted By robin sarner on 18 Feb 2015 11:58 AM

I now think that a big volumed Big Tri week is the way to go.                 what do the coaches and others think?

Last 6-8 years, since turning my focus to Ironman exclusively, any "volume pops" I do within 10 weeks of the race, I do as regular tri weeks - standard swim and run -  with additional biking - an extra day of volume, not intensity. Don't know of that is a big tri or big bike week, but its what has worked for me.

Dave Tallo

Posted By robin sarner on 18 Feb 2015 11:58 AM

I am not hearing the answer to the question I think is being asked.    so I am going to ask my own question.

within 10 weeks of an ironman, what is better to do?   Bike Bike week or Big Tri week.

until last year, I have done Bike Bike weeks.     But I now feel that this is not a great idea.    Bites into the overall training,   takes a while to recover from.   etc.

I now think that a big volumed Big Tri week is the way to go.                 what do the coaches and others think?

 

My experience:

Within 10 weeks of IM, big tri week.  For (a) putting far on top of far on top of fast, and (b) race-day specificity.  But I know this doesn't jive with others' thinking, so take it as one man's opinion.   

Outside 10 weeks, big tri week disguised as big bike week (or vice versa).  The equation is simple:  ride 4-5 hours per day, stepping back every third day to lighter and less ...say, 3 hours easy.  And run or swim every day.    See how many days you can do it.  (My April  challenge will be 12 days @ 60 hours this year, which doesn't seem like too much when you compare it to Pro's workloads, but I have found to be very, very challenging by about day 8-9.)   The preparation here is a bit different, because while you're still on the triathlon vehicles of run, bike and swim, you are probably focussing more on just pushing the higher limits of just work, day in, day out, and repeating.     Starting to think about the eventual race impact of 3 days of 100miles is a tough connection to make, so instead, just training in a way that is sustainable for the block is my preference.  Then, along the way, you pick up a lot of fitness, endurance, economy and mental strategies.  

(I don't want to derail the OP, so this was to Robin's question.  Now back to regular programming.)  

 

Mark Maurer

Thanks for your thoughts and suggestions. It sounds like the consensus is since it's still outside of the "race training season" for the two of us it sounds like whatever we do to add volume, as long as it's epic and fun, will be all good. So that means we can ride to the bakery down in Oregon and then stop at a vineyard on the way back the first day and then hit the restaurant in Dayton the next day with a stop at another vineyard in the afternoon. 

That's two days down, I guess I have to get busy mapping out the rest. 

Dino Sarti

Epic is the key word....

Mark Maurer

Yeah Dino, I want to have at least one week when I'm closer to the top of the leader board, but don't tell anyone. ;-)