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TRAINING TO PACE BY HEART RATE IN HILLY RUN COURSE. NEED HELP!!

Juan VergaraJuan Vergara
in General Training Discussions
HAVING RACED MOSTLY ON FLAT COURSES over the past 5 years, I am beginning to seriously hill run train for St.George. Given the (scary) run elevation I assume I am better of pacing by HR. However, I am having a "hard time" stabilizing HR going up and down ..... any advice?? Anything you have experienced or read that might help me??

Comments

  • Al TruscottAl Truscott

    Juan - I agree about St G - nothing but up or down there. Luckily, the last few miles are DOWN! The gradient is not too bad, 4% or so. And yes, I used HR to manage my pacing. But I live in an area where I do nothing BUT run up and down. So how to get used to it? Are there any long bridges near you - bridges usually have similar gradient to the run at St. G, although not as long. It's pretty easier to control yourself going UP - who wants to work hard up a hill, right? But going down, learning how to push yourself without hurting your knees is the tricky part. Think of tilting your whole body forward a bit, using your arms/elbows as outriggers for stabilization. Stride length is the critical variable; keep turnover constant, but take short strides going up, long ones going down compared to flat runs.

    Remember, St G is pretty warm by the time you get to the run. So using HR helps with that variable as well. I started out with my HR in low Z3, and was in mid-high Z3 by the time I finished. Z4 would probably be a mistake, unless you are planning to run the 21 K in less than an hour!

  • Mark HickmanMark Hickman
    Juan,

    I consider myself a bit of a hill runner, though not a great one. To keep my HR at a reasonable level, I have to consciously slow my speed while maintaining turnover. I find the shorter strides takes out a lot of the effort that elevates my heart race. If the hill is still too steep, I maintain a 45/15 or so run/walk. The short walk periods do wonders for keeping my heart rate at a manageable level, and counting strides makes the hill disappear mucho faster than focusing on where the top is...

    Mark
  • morpheusmorpheus
    OK, I've got the popcorn. I am so watching this thread.....


    I run on terrain that is similar to what Al describes. Before my Run Durability Plan last fall, I was running long and slow for a couple of months. Disciplined slow. Walk up the hills or baby step up the hills slow. Anything to keep my HR down, no matter what.

    I found that my slow zone HR, say mid zn2 to lowest zn3, correlated with an extremely slow pace.....in the beginning. But, my system did acclimate. I really don't think my fitness changed that much. But, by 4-6 weeks into it, those same HRs were yielding paces that were slightly quicker than I expected.

    As I said, I don't think that I was getting fitter. It was late in the year and I was about as fit as I could be for a year when I'm not racing anything. I really think the body just adapted. Strides. Timing. Efficiency. Stuff that I can't put a finger on.

    So, my input is that you start working on this earlier rather than later. Certainly stick to the EN stuff but find a way to get a couple of HR controlled runs in. They don't have to be super long runs. Just keep it in the zone no matter what. Run some repeatable courses and watch what happens over 6-8 weeks.

    Disclaimer: I have not tried this in a race build. Many others have done so and very successfully. I plan on doing this at my HIM in the fall and at my next IM.

    As I said, I'll be watching this close b/c I can relate and this style might be beneficial to my racing, too.

    Thanks & good luck!

  • Al TruscottAl Truscott
    I (and I hope Juan is as well) am talking about using HR as a racing, not a training tool. Juan's HR correlated to flat land pace is probably stable at this point of his build, less thaneight weeks out. He should know what his HR @ MP is. That's the general range I suggest he go for during the race. I think his query is not how do I train with HR, but rather, how do I get comfortable with running at a steady HR when going up or downhill. IOW, he needs to get an inner sense of what Z3 feels like while going up and down hill. That'll take finding some "hills" to run on, monitoring his HR instead of his pace, and linking that neurologically with RPE. Just like "riding steady", that will take a little bit of practice. Juan knows his body well, and if he can find some slopes to,practice on, 2-3 weeks worth of focus on that metric ought to do the trick.
  • Juan VergaraJuan Vergara
    Exactly right Al : need to "get comfortable with running at a steady Z3 HR when going up or downhill".
    Thanks all for the input!!!!
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