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Karissa Weeks -- The Micro Thread!

Great to chat today, KW. Here are my thoughts...let me know what you think!

Get Fast Plan



You mentioned a few things with your schedule, as follows: 

  • Tuesday Night Run
  • Wed Night Swim
  • Sat = Option for team ride or IM friend ride.
  • Sunday = Run Group or Team Ride

Here’s how I see it playing out in the Get Fast Plan, pretty easy!



Do the Wednesday Interval run on Tuesday Night with your Run Group.

Given the Interval run is on Tuesday night I’d save the “hard ride” for Wednesday. You can do both 15’ efforts in the PM home, OR, you can split 15’ in the AM and 15’ in the PM, your call!

Wednesday night you can do the Wednesday Swim as planned (with your group). 

Saturday Ride with your group.

Sunday Run with the Group.



Once you get to the Half Iron plan, we can go ahead and refresh this layout. 



As for the Marathon changes, I would be great to know what the actual weekend of the race is for timing. Given the marathon timing, I’d like to make sure your run volume is safe. So I suggest:



1) Alternating weeks of Split Long Run and Long Run. Example this Sunday you do 8 in the AM, then 8 in the PM. Next week you do 15. Then you do 9/9. Then you do 18, then 10/10 (May 10) then you can do 1 or two longer weekend runs of 20-22 miles. Of course, if your race is early June this might need to change.



2) During the week, I’d like you you to make sure Tuesday nights are about 8 to 10 miles all in (warm up, efforts, warm down) and Thursday is an 8 miler. You can run a few miles before the Sat ride if you see fit, but I know with the STP ride you will need to be more focused on longer rides here come June vs running. Worst case we can make sure you get a short run in on Wed / Friday as well, but let’s start off with the three run plan above. 

Comments

  • Patrick,

    Good to talk today. Really helped me sort out some specifics and you provided some good ideas on tweaking the weekly plan and building to a marathon. I was looking at Green River on June 6 but could also consider Rock 'n' Roll on 6/13 or Vancouver USA on 6/21. The split long run and long run combo may be my ticket!

    I'm curious as to your thoughts on building bike endurance ahead of STP on July 11-12. With enough long run mileage I'm fairly confident I can pull off a decent marathon, but am honestly worried about doing the 150 miles.

    If I need to trade off some weeknight running time for biking time, I'm willing. (A year ago I did the Paris Marathon on the long run plus 5-6 miles each on Tuesdays and most Thursdays.) With all the cross training, I will have the endurance for a marathon, just need to remind hips and legs what's coming. Similarly, my legs and bottom need to learn how to go long on the bike again. To date, I'm OK with a medium-hard 30 miler and have done a couple of 50 milers at year's end. How would we tune the Get Fast plan for a bit more cycling volume? Yes, I realize I'm talking about adding a bit more "farther" rather than "faster." I'm OK with training hard, but may need some more contiguous saddle time.

    Also, in the long range plans, I will be in Japan April 30 - May 11 (inclusive of travel days) with running as my primary mode for training. I will check into lap swims but biking would be more about sightseeing on a borrowed cruiser than training. Doing the Fuji Susono half Marathon May 10. The first 5K are uphill so I will need to work on some hills, more so the downhills. We can dial in the specifics down the road but wanted to point out a "running opportunity" window, as well as another race.

    Thanks,
    Karissa
  • Karissa - Thanks! Can you get me some specifics on the STP re terrain, etc? If you can ride/fuel 100 you can do 150 (just pace it well), in my book.

    If I had my way we'd work in a few bigger bike weekends vs modifying the whole of the GetFast plan. As in pick a weekend in April and May where we go long on both days. Call it 75/50 then 100/75.

    Is something like ^that^ an option?
  • Patrick,

    I'm on track for STP, completing the Flying Wheels century with 3600' and another fifty miles today.  Am on track for the STP ride; it's not too hilly, mostly rolling.  

    On Memorial Day I met a milestone of 2.4 miles in the pool (likely not again in a pool). Now to do it in open water.  I am planning an Oly triathlon on 6/21 and will need to focus on the open water swim over the next two weeks.  Thinking open water Monday and Friday, with pool workout on Wednesday (not Tuesday).  

    I didn't ramp my running mileage enough for a marathon in early June, but did a great half in early May (1:55 for a course that's half uphill).  

    My main question at this point is how to compare my typical rides against the plan.  Should I email screenshots of my Garmin activities?  

    Thanks,

    Karissa

  • Have fun Karrissa doing the STP.  I've done it a few times in two days unlike some of my crazy friends that do the ~205 mile in one day. Have a blast!
  • Karissa..to recap:

    Q1 = Patrick help me work in a marathon, need to focus on that.
    Q2 = Patrick I am doing a 150 miler in 8 weeks, need to focus please help me (but remember the marathon).
    Q3 = Patrick I need to focus on OWS for an Olympic just after (?) my marathon but before the 150 mile bike ride.

    How did you slip all that by me in the first place????? Thank got you just did the half...there is a higher power. I am totally okay with OWS...knock yourself out there!

    I am not super worried about comparing rides; the volume of STP kind of takes precedence over the specificity of the EN rides....IOW, no way you could "do" a typical HIM interval set for Saturday in the midst of a century. They are too disparate; trust that the volume will make you stronger.

    When you are 6 weeks out from the Half you'll want to consider being more triathlon bike specific, but for now you are okay (would help if you listed your A race here).

    In the meantime, keep fueling those runs like a rock star!!!!
  • Coach Patrick,

    I set up a call for Wednesday. Following are my main upcoming events:

    A race: Ironman Cozumel
    Milestone race: IM half Lake Stevens, Aug 16
    First tri and training event: Lake Meridian Oly, June 21

    Not running much at the moment, need to work on firing my glutes then building the miles.

    Let me know if I can provide additional info ahead of the call.
    Karissa
  • Karissa, good to chat today. For the glutes stuff, please see my Pre Run protocol in the wiki here...I do the same thing when my glutes give up!!!!

    Pre Run Activation Routine: http://members.endurancenation.us/Resources/Wiki/tabid/91/Default.aspx?topic=Pre-Run+Activation+Routine
  • Checking in after IM70.3 Lake Stevens and and planning ahead for the coming weeks.

    I am pretty happy with my results at Lake Stevens -- 6:13. I had decent pacing and OK nutrition. I'll probably dig into fueling strategies in a bit, as I'm doing another half on Sept. 13 (week 9), which brings me to schedule adjustments for the coming weeks.

    Changes on the schedule:
    Week 8-9: Labor Day half marathon
    Week 9: Half iron distance race Sunday
    Week 11: Good friend's birthday road trip that would mess with the 6hr RR, which may need to move to the following week (three weeks after the half).

    To fit that in, what other adjustments should I make? Worried about the 5 hour RR on week 8 mostly.

    Oh, and I will try to slip in a few CX races on the shorter weekend days, as my bike team has a new race requirement.
  • Karissa, now is the time to dial in that nutrition stuff as it will take a while for you to get comfortable with it. Promise you'll do that.

    As for the changes to your plan would do next week as planned, right into the Half Marathon...it will suck, but you'll get it done. Then Tuesday is OFF, Wed is bike only (bonus if you can swim), then Thursday is interval run (capped at 45'), Friday is swim only...Saturday is off...Sunday is RACE.

    The 5hour RR on Sat is critical as you need to "test" your position, nutrition and pacing!

    The week 11 RR can be moved to the following week...which is fine! Let me know if you need more help with the actual workouts of that week due to your road trip! image
  • This week will suck, not for what's ahead so much as what's (not) behind me. I got sick middle of last week and lost four days of training. I'll ramp up again and carry through this week, perhaps at a slightly slower pace. I also banged my knee at Lake Stevens two weeks ago and it's still swelling with fluid each workout. Seeing the doctor Tuesday.

    As for race execution, Lake Stevens left me some opportunities for improvement. I did OK, but felt full to point of burping during the ride yet was hungry at the start of the run. Tummy was a little upset for the first miles of the run too. A "longer" pitstop at mile 7 helped on all counts, something that is not normally part of my day.

    Breakfast was a 200 cal whole grain cereal (my standard), an Odwalla, a cup of applesauce and gel somewhere before the race start. I had about 1.5 bottles of Gatorade on the bike, along with one gel. On the run, I had two gels and Gatorade or water at each stop. My knee was swelling after doing a "turtle" at the aid station halfway through the bike. (Stupidity of forgetting, for the first time in 10 years, to unclip my left foot). It was pretty swollen by the time I started running and getting worse. Of course, seeing a guy run the other way with a prosthetic leg erased any thoughts of DNF. Mile 7 aid station was again the turning point, as the volunteers had two ibuprofen left (he dropped them on the ground, "I'll still take them!!!!"). Finished the last six miles at about a minute a mile better than the first half of the run.

    Other than general improvements in planning and practice, what more specific tips should I focus on for my next 70.3 on Sept. 13?

    Oh, and I wish I had realized that Labor Day and Sept 13 were within a week! If nothing else, the half marathon will be a training run with bling!

    In the big picture, the road trip has moved to week 10, so it will fit well between big weekends on weeks 8, 9 and 11.
  • Karissa, a couple things on the nutrition:

    1) Race breakfast...I'll give it a 6.5 out of 10. Does your cereal go with milk? Not ideal. Does your Odwalla bar have 5g of Fat and 5g of protein? Also might not be ideal. Finally, this should be eaten like 3 hours before the race...not sure of your timing.

    2) 1.5 bottles of GE???? Combined with your one gel, you probably took in about 100 calories an hour...great for a brisk walk, not a HIM! You didn't eat nearly enough. Not sure why you felt full (did you pee 1x on bike per our guidance?)...could be a breakfast hold over.

    3) I know it was cool out there, but assuming your rode a 3:15 bike, you drank a little less than 1/2 a bottle of Gatorade an hour. As a baseline from sweat testing, most people need at least one bottle per hour. Please go back and revisit your sweat test results.

    4) Your nutrition on the run sounds about right...I think it's worth it for you to carry salt pills in case you need to help settle a backed up tummy like this.

    Do you drink just water on the race that you didn't mention? Did you do the Gel + drink @ 15' before the race or did you not eat after breakfast (when was that again?).

    Onwards!
  • I finally found notes on race execution and was studying the plan all week. Of course, more practice may have helped. More precise details on my HIM consumption:

    Breakfast: up at 3:45, eating 4:00-4:30, 7:13 start
    Odwalla smoothie 280 cal, 2 g protein
    Bob's Red Mill 8-grain hot cereal with some sugar, no milk, around 200 cal
    One cup applesauce 100 cal
    7.5 points????

    Bike plan was three bottles Gatorade and two gels. Not a "big" plan but was prorating IM plans and up from my Oly "plan" where I take a gel and some Gatorade. I think I had about 1.5 bottles first half of the ride and .5 in the second half. Fell off plan because I was burping full and distracted by my swelling knee (and perhaps wanting to keep both hands on the bars).

    Could have peed at mile 41 but there were three people waiting for the toilet so I opted for no line in T2. The problem was probably a backed up gut rather than belly. I had some relief at T2 and after some "settling" on the first half of the run, I was dire need of a #2 pit stop. Job done, finished better. Not sure what the difference that morning was, but I usually have a great pre-race toilet routine. Hydration felt fine.

    For this weekend's swim-bike-run, I'll try the same breakfast but will likely not be up quite as early and may not choke down the gel before the swim. The goal on 2.5 hours on the bike is 24oz Gatorade/hour and two gels or combo with shot blocks. Run will be one gel and as much fluid and I can sip (I'll take notes on consumption).

  • PS, I mostly drank Gatorade on the run. Alternated with water to wash down a gel, wash out my mouth or wash my face/hands.
  • KW, yes a 7.5! image

    I like that much better, so thank you. No coffee in AM to make morning magic happen? Was that the back up? I'll take the burping...you might be getting some air in when you sip, it's when you burp it back up that you need to back off. I can't be there on race day but basically your goal is to exit the bike as well hydrated and fueled as you can...bonus if you can pee on a downhill so no lines!

    Can't wait to hear the next report!
  • Race tomorrow-- trying to fine tune my HIM race plan Temp = 60-69

    What improvements for breakfast? Hot cereal, Naked smoothie, 1c pear sauce (home canned, no sugar added)
    Sip sport drink and take a gel before the swim.
    Bike: I'm going to try for 3 full bottles and three gels (still a step up from my latest rides). Pee at mile 45
    Run: same as Lake Stevens, taking sport drink at all the aid stations and two gels, bringing salt pills this time.

    Mornings are typically not a problem (and I don't drink coffee). Working on getting more veggies back in my regular diet as well. Yes, lots of burps, but all burp up. It appears that the sweat test seems to fall on race weekends, so I'll do that soon. I typically lose a pound during a run on a 75-80 degree day.
  • Did the Black Diamond half iron tri today and met my season goals for HIM. Under 3 hrs for the bike and under 2 hrs for the run, and the swim was one of my best (but that's not saying much). This put me well under 6 hrs at 5:47! And a bonus AG win (OK smaller race, but I'll take it).

    Contrary to Coach Wisdom, running the half marathon last Monday was the best prep for me for this race. I had been sick and stressed out and started that race not feeling the best but managed to pull in a 1:52:34, less than 2 min off PR. That put some fire in my belly and reminded me how to run faster and how to pull through miles 9-10 that always seem tough for me.

    I will give myself a 9 for following my race execution plan as outlined above (although I peed at T2 again rather than at 45). Drank almost all three bottles (need to measure the leftovers but the bottles are more than 20 oz). Slurped all the Powerade I could on the run and finished hydrated. No other "issues" this time. Felt good all day.

    Boom. Done with these "short" races now. On to Cozumel!
  • KDUB - YES! I _still_ don't agree with the half marathon, but I can't argue with your results...5:47 is a legit time and what better way to kick off the Road to Cozumel (in your best Phil Liggett voice) than with a PR.

    Bonus that these nutrition lessons will help you do a better job training, recovering, and ultimately on race day.

    Pumped!
  • Looking for advice on the last 10 weeks!

    I still need to fit in a sweat test -- when might be good?
    Should I redo the run HR test? Never actually did a good bike HR test. Should I add that too?

    Finally added up what the next four Saturdays look like. What is the priority on the various segments? I can't find a pool available before 8am and which would mean I couldn't make my team ride. And my training buddies don't go to my gym. Is a tri-style ride and the whole swim-bike-run more important than riding with my roadie friends who make me go faster?

    Weeks 12: I've got a swim and 45min run on Tuesday and a swim on Wednesday evening. How should I adjust the other activities? I am also feeling like I need to run more.

    Thanks,
    Karissa
  • KW, getting focused...I like it! Here's what I think:

    1) You can do the sweat test on any weekend ride. Just plan to weigh before / after ride (following protocols); if you want to be a stickler do the last hour on your trainer (weighing in first) to be more accurate.

    2) You don't _need_ to do an HR test for bike or run to get valid race execution numbers. As long as you are tracking your workouts in a log and can view your avg hr information, you will be all set. You can dig into your averages over several weeks of long rides and runs and you should see some very consistent number you can use as guidelines for your RR, and eventually Race Day.

    3) Last 10 week is about being as race specific as possible. At the LEAST I would alternate one week swim / bike / run on the weekend and the other week with your buddies. I think there is a TON of value learning to ride after a swim that will pay off for you come race day.

    4) I don't know what you need me to adjust in Week 12 as I can't tell what the other constraints are...sorry!

    5) Running more is "fine" but you have to define a baseline (avg running weekly volume over last 6 weeks vs what you have been doing prior 6 weeks). That delta will tell you if you are already "ramping up" and more could be dangerous. You have two options...one is to brick it up and run a short run very often outside of the regular running sessions. The other option, one I like, is to shorted the Sunday ride by cutting it down, and replacing the back half with a run.

    Example: A 3 hour ride becomes a 2 hour ride followed by a 1 hour run. Eventually this would build to a 50/50 split, maxing out at a 90' run. The run is done at Goal Race Pace (IM pace for you), which should feel very easy. This is a good chance to also dial in that HR target!!!
  • Definitely more focused on the micro plan week by week or even day by day. Please let me know what other info you need to provide advice.

    Run: 30 min 5K on Tuesday, planning 100min run commute Thursday and 90 mins on Fri/Sat

    Bike: Planning a century with my IM training buddies (first time all 6 of us together in one event despite training "together" for over a year). So how much run/bike should I balance with on Saturday? I need to work on more bricks to help ramp my run mileage.

    Swim: Tuesday morning swim, bailed on Weds night but will do 90 on Friday.

  • Karissa...okay, let's keep it rolling. On the day of the Century, run 30 minutes; you can run 60 on the other day. That said, do you have a weekly running mileage AVERAGE number for the past 6 weeks? We can start by using that number as a baseline from which we can build.

    Please keep me posted!
  • Weekly run average is a little low. Tossing the first two weeks of six, as I was coming off Lake Stevens HIM, was tired, did an Oly, then was sick for a week. Last four weeks averaged 22+

    I'll squeeze in an LTR Friday, add remaining time to Saturday's run. If it's 6h riding on Sunday, should I do 2-3 on Saturday?
  • Great to catch up today...keep me posted on the targets we discussed! image
  • I did my RR ride on Saturday. 83 miles in 4:25, around ideal race pace. You'll be proud, Coach P, I drank three bottles in the first two laps and about a bottle each lap after, with an assortment of gels and chews. I was around 350 calories per hour. HR was at 140 avg, so I'll likely need to slow down a bit for the heat in Cozumel.
  • The camp weekend protocol says swim on Thursday but the details of the swim suggest doing it before the RR brick. So is the preference to do the long swim on Thursday or Friday?
  • Kdub, that's a FANTASTIC job on the food...keep it up baby!!!! As for the camp weekend, if you are riding Fri/Sat, then the swim goes Thursday (rest before the storm). If it were a solo RR day, then I'd say s/b/r....but in this case, make thursday a swim only day!
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