Cool fast vs hard hot

Chris White

As it is really starting to heat up here in Florida, I started thinking about running in the heat vs cooler running.  It is more convenient for me to run after work but lately it has been very hot and it is getting  harder to hold my Z4 pace for all the sets.  So the question is by running in the heat of the day but at a slower pace (maybe 15-20 secs/mile) than my prescribed vdot will I get faster or do I need to try training in the morning to make sure I nail my target pace?  The effort is definitely there because of the heat but I am afraid by not running fast I will not get fast.

Coach Patrick

I suggest you shift the runs to the AM; hard to do but it's the muscles we care about, not the full responding system of your body per the heat. Feel free to shoot us questions re the schedule if you need to make adjustments!

rah2774

good question... I have a follow up, coach - kind of along the same lines.  Since the run is last... and in an HIM or IM, we're not getting around to it until the sun is high and it's hot out (very different from foot races/marathons) I wonder if we should do some run conditioning in the mid-afternoons/evenings so we're acclimated to more race-day like conditions. 

mancona

I personally avoid running in the heat for about 90% of the year, so that I can get the best workout possible. I do however get some lunch time runs in during the last 3-6 weeks of training leading up to my A-race to somewhat acclimated. Not sure hoe much of a difference it really makes, but I like to mentally know that I have run under direct midday Sun and heat.

Michele Cellai

x2 to what Mancona said. I always run early in the day until closer to race time. Then I put my BRick runs after work. I still always do longest run in morning as that is a time/ foot pain issue (more pain after being on my feet all day).

Coach Rich

Becky,

You only need a couple weeks of training in the heat to acclimate yourself. Until that time you want to avoid the heat, in order to maximize training stress placed on your body and minimize heat stress.

kurshing

I think the answer is two-fold; because there is a question and a question that will come up eventually because of the initial question:

(1) Rich is right (I would never admit if he wasn't anyway!)...you will get used to the heat if you stay with it.

(2) The MOST important thing would be picking a time and sticking to it...early or late.  If you like the cooler weather, get up early and learn to deal with flipping on the 'go' switch earlier!  If you would prefer to lounge in the morning and workout in the afternoon, then, learn to deal with the heat.  The worst thing would be working out early when you feel like it and late other times because you will end up with workouts that stack up 12 hours apart instead of the optimal 24 hours apart.  Does that make sense?  I have learned with being in EN since Dec that RnP are fans of morning workouts, every day because it is predictable and provides for optimal recovery.  I can't imagine much getting in the way of a 5:15-30am workout, but, with a 2 year old and a wife...I find that things consistantly get crazy after I get home from work.

So, the 'take-away', pick a time, make the decision, and then simply manage that decision daily.

Just my thoughts!  Good luck with it!

Coach Rich

Good stuff. Again, if AM in the cool = 7:30 pace and it get's done (ie, The Man, the Family can't take it away from you) vs PM in the heat = 7:50 pace and crammed in among other end of the day stuff, The Man has all day to take that run away from you, AM is better.

Al Truscott

In a cool climate, it works the opposite way. Where I am, 75 F is a hot summer day; 35-40F is a normal spring or fall morning. I almost always run in the warmest part of the day, just for comfort, and to try and get a leg up on the races I go to which are always warmer than where I'm coming from. Years of walking on the run in races where them temp was 80-100 F convinced me I needed to train my sweat glands and kidneys how to work in those temps. That's more important to me than training for absolute speed. Interval workouts, I'll sometimes do in cooler weather, though, I agree.

Now if you live in FL or AZ, or the San Gabriel Valley, it is a different issue.

atasic

 May I please add a follow up for a clarification on this, both related to running in elevated temperatures and also running into the wind.

As I understand, Daniels has an adjustment table for VDOT and pace when conditions are not favorable. In accordance with the table, paces are adjusted/reduced for temps over 60F, for every 5F rise, reduction is not linear but sums up to a 2-3 sec/mi. Do you entertain using this or in your opinion we need to stick to VDOT established at let's say 50F even when we train in 90F. I found this to be impossible in my short  3 year experience.

Also, running segments into the headwind. Can you really hold on to your HMP or LT into 10,15-20mph headwind and be at the proper intensity level for that duration. 

Can you please give us your thoughts on this.

Thank you.

mgraffeo

Aleksandar,

the coaches are knee-deep in their Tour of California camp, and may not see this for a bit.  I'll offer the following.

We all know that pace is a flawed metric.  To paraphrase Churchill, "it's the worst form of [IM pacing] except for all the others that have been tried".  Pace is imperfect on hills, into headwinds, with tailwinds, and even on very hot days.

All that being said, it's much better than HR (which drifts with dehydration, lags effort, and is notoriously variable as a function of temperature). 

The best way to answer your question is that we use pace to calibrate our own internal scale of Perceived Exertion.  That way, on race day, you can judge whether you're pushing too hard up the hill (just like we use a power meter, but if the PM dies, we can use pressure on the soles of our feet).  So, on a very hot day, going up a 4% hill at mile 15 of an IM, no, you're not racing based on your pace number.  You're racing on the perceived exertion which you know corresponds to that pace number, because you've spent hours and hours training those paces into your brain.

Hope that helps!

Mike

Paul Hough

Heating up...eh? That's an understatement. I croaked on a15 miler last week when our LOW temperature was 80 and the humidity was something like 99%. Yesterday, I knocked out 19 miles and recovered quickly simply because the low was 71 and the humidity a mere 79%!! Training in Florida is just tough. Before I became an IM masochist, I was strictly a runner and had approach to training almost 180 opposite in seasonality. You run your long base miles in the winter because the weather is nice and you CAN. Then as summer approaches you cut mileage and increase speed work (sort of like OS training). Doing the long runs in the summer in South Florida is about hydration, pace judgement, willpower, suffering, and torment. I do my long runs in the morning because it's more than hot enough to adapt anyway. I catch the heat of the day when I do my bricks...more misery. As we approach Jun-Sep, it's time to pay the piper for missing all those snow days our northern EN peeps have to put up with.

Al Truscott

Mike summarized the idea superbly - train enough at your EP to hardwire it as an internal sensation, and then race at that perceived level of effort no matter the wind, incline, or temperature.

I noticed something interesting since I started using WKO+ with Garmin for the first time this season to track my runs. Last week, my long run was on a very hilly, off road trail course, 2 hr, 6 min @ 9:06 min/mile average. No wind, cloudy, temp 50-55. This week, I did my standard long run route, much less hilly, in the sun at 66F. 2:16, avg 8:12 min/mile. The TSS for the shorter, slower run was 206, for the longer, faster one was 201. Does WKO account for the elevation or the HR when calculating the TSS? Why would a shorter, slower run have a higher TSS? Is the TSS a good way to correlate that those two runs were about equal in terms of work accomplished, despite the clear difference in speed?

atasic

 Thank you. That explains it.

mgraffeo

@Al, yes, WKO uses elevation to calculate e effect of elevation on the run. When you see the NGP, or normal graded pace, it's a reflection of the equivalent pace if you'd run on a flat course.