Run durability and Get Faster
What is the EN guidance for Run Durability during the get Faster program? I just finished Nov OS and then swim camp and want to continue RD. Are we to just add frequency of TP runs?
Tagged:
0
Comments
we are in the same boat. Rich has me on the get faster plan. Seems to increase volume and add swimming. The run frequency seems to be there as well. I am only in day two, but it seems like it is going to give me the push i needed.
I'll be starting 8 weeks GF next week. My plan is to keep running (hopefully) 7 days a week. 45' on days I swim, 30' as a brick on days I bike, and one day of 70-90' long run. I'm not yet sure how I will add in intensity.
I reflect on a conversation I had with Turby Wright in Kona after the race. He had an outstanding run there. He's been a life-long runner - 4 decades or so, staying relatively fast the whole time. I asked him about his training, and how he avoided injury and breakdown after all those years. He insisted, it was all about consistency, very little intensity, just get out and run Z1-Z3 as much as possible, as often as possible.
Then, there's Joe Friel, who says to be fast after 50, you gotta do some intensity every week. But I suspect that is more easily applied to cycling, That's his primary focus as a coach, you know. Over the past year or two, as I try to apply it to running and swimming, I find myself dealing, for the first time in my life, with chronic tendonitis in my Left elbow and Right knee/hamstring.
So for now, at least, I'm gonna go with daily running and very little "speed" work, but keep up the FTP and VO2 sessions weekly on the bike. Swimming, since I've just started back after resting that elbow for a few months, I'll have to wait and see what I can handle in addition to going 3 x 1' each week.
On my side I add running to get to the pool and come back home. This adds about 8K to my weekly milleage.
The GF plan, as it exists right now in your dropdown, has been very successful for the past ~4yrs. However, PnI are currently in the process of rewriting it, with lots of changes and to make it 10wks vs 8wks. We'll get that uploaded shortly for everyone to use, thanks for your patience.
I look back on all my training and this year I finally felt good running. I started the year with 2- 1/2 marathons, 1 full in the spring ,lots of long runs and will end the season with the Vegas Marathon. I didnt watch my pace like before, only RPE during training. Towards the middle of the season I was able to keep up with the group runners.
I will keep trying using your theory. Thanks again!
I have come to the same conclusions you have: cycling intervals are probably OK, swimming is suspect, and running is still a no-no for me. I am able to run daily at a pace of 8:30-8:50 (which means the first mile is about 10 min/mile, and the fastest is in the range of 8:1X, sometimes as fast as 7:5X), basically what Turby outlines above.
This is VERY HARD for me to accept, because the only thing I've ever liked about running was GOING FAST (for me, 6:20-7:00 min/mile). Doing a bunch of track intervals, or a 5K race. Everything else I view as work, not fun, unlike swimming and biking and racing. I'm going to try a 5K in November, aiming for a "comfortably hard" pace, not an all-out one for 22 minutes, and we'll see how that goes.
For cycling, while I can continue to do VO2 and FTP intervals, I can no longer do them at the frequency we see on our OS. This year's OS seems to have a five week cycle. I am planning on doing 2-3 VO2 sessions and 2-3 FTP sessions each of those 5 week blocks. You may be able to do them more frequently, depending on how quickly you seem to recover.
My injuries during 2015 and 2016 were recurrent upper hamstring in my right leg, happening every time I started up intervals after recovering from a race. But in Dec, that happened in my left leg, more severely, with persistent piriformis sciatica (basically, pain in the butt whenever I sit wrong for too long, like a car trip or plane ride.) I've added several stretches and body weight exercises to my daily routine, which has seemed to help keep that at bay.
That being said I have been able to run almost every day without creating additional damage to the Achilles. It’s not pretty but it beats being on an orthopedic boot again
It worked for me as well: started Run Durability last November and kept at it all the way through IMLOU; no speed work other than the 30-second strides and getting into Z4 HR during races. Just steady weeks of running with nothing fancy, and no spikes in weekly miles or single-run miles
Frankly, it was kind of boring, but it sure worked
Do you feel that adding strength training to to the run durability will help with keeping tendons strong and more injury proof?
I'm coming off a season of rehab from a crash and feel like all the body work I've done should continue and ultimately help my running. There isn't much talk about strength training and running. I also like the idea of getting intensity on the bike, (safer).
Been doing run durability only at Z1 - Z3 intensities. Longest run was 10 miles with other runs anywhere from 2 - 8 miles. Ran 35 miles last week and 32 miles the week before. No treadmill runs.
https://www.strava.com/activities/1252719044 Ending temperature was 72 degrees. Hard to argue with results.
SS
Re: Friel, frequency, and intensity. My own experience and conversation with a number of other over 60men who are long term runners has convinced me that sadly dropping the 5k and faster intervals I used to love is necessary. I’m still on the fence about 20-30second strides.
I need to be careful and balance load here. Running 30 - 35 miles a week while in a bike focus OS may be my limit in terms of running Z4/Z5 intervals...... Another way to say it, would be very hard to increase both Bike w/kg and vDOT at the same time with no injury for a veteran given only minimal gains will be seen at this point. Pick your poison and be careful not to take in too much. Day by day.......
SS
I am taking the Run Durability plan to heart this year as I am returning to the IM in 2018 and the RUN has always been my limiting sport of the 3. I am an "ok" upper-BOP swimmer, a pretty decent cyclist, and my run is for shyte. I realize that it is shyte because that is what I keep telling myself it is. I literally just give it away without even really trying. And that is just lazy.
How about I put in the work and see where it takes me? Novel idea, right?!
I think my aversion to running has been that it is hard on me. It is not fun, it takes sweaty work and pounding lungs. I am going to work on getting comfortable with being uncomfortable from now until 11/4/18. I am on a mission and I have a passion brewing inside me that I have not felt in... oh gosh... ever?
I am focusing more just getting out there and running the time even if it is not exactly as prescribed. Consistency is king for me the mile repeats and threshold runs will certainly come when I am ready in the OS - but for now I just need to run!
Finally I am in a place that I am no longer afraid to start a new. I am at peace that I am not where I was when I "retired" from racing in 2014 when I was at the top of my execution and speed games, but I am no where near where I will be.
How is everyone doing on consistency so far?
I am in the Bike focused OS plan but making sure I get a run in everyday as well. Most of my runs are TRP and a few are progressive with TRP to Z2 to Z3. This week so far has been:
Mon - 3.1 miles @ TRP - Z2 (short swim intervals)
Tues - 3.1 miles @ TRP - Z2 (bike intensity day)
Wed - 7.5 miles @ TRP - Z2 - Z3 (bike Z2 day)
Thur - 3 - 4 miles @ TRP (bike intensity day)
....and so forth......
SS
BTW, my HR avg/max for 2007/2017 runs were 154/159, 144/148. My VDOT has fallen from 50 to 44 over that decade.
Updates from others?
The EN Strava run club is looking awesome! Getting geared up for the Holiday run challenge!
Happy Holidays all!
SS