New power meter

Jon Allen

I am doing Ironman Frankfurt in July this year and may have the possibility to get myself a power meter in April. Will having it for 8-10 weeks before the race be enough time to collect and use the data to race with??

John Withrow

Yes, that's plenty of time. Not only will it help you with your mid-week FTP sets, but more importantly you will do many long rides with it to help push yourself. You will dial in your goal race power with your Race Rehearsals which will definitely help you with pacing.

Do it!!!

thekidduxc

Absolutely. Do it if you can. The sooner you get it the better. Plenty of time to dial in race pace with power 8 weeks out.

Jon Allen

Hey team, so I've finally got my new power meter, BUT I've only got 6 1/2 week until IM Frankfurt, can anyone give me some advice please :-)

Michael Quinton

It's a game-changer. Probably the most helpful accessory I own!

Trish Marshall

read up on how to use your new tool here in the wiki.  There are also a lot of threads you can read as well.  Get Joe Friels How to train with Power book and read it. If you use training Peaks, they have a articles on power too.  Do a power test and start riding with your meter asap.  Use hr and rpe to help you understand your new power zones.  

Basically, you've got some homework!  

John Withrow

Hey Jon-- As a quick starting point, go here and spend the 20 mins reading the entire thread... http://members.endurancenation.us/Forums/tabid/57/aft/10477/Default.aspx#10477

John Withrow

I'd suggest you do an FTP test instead of your next weekday workout just to see what it tells. You'll likely blow your first test anyways, but this will give a starting point. Then you can re-test in a couple of weeks. Then just "collect data" on your next longer weekend ride and see how it compares to your tested number. Or you could reverse that order by just doing your weekend ride as normal, and seeing what your total Normalized Power (NP) for that ride is afterwards. Then test next Tuesday and see how that compares to your weekend ride. This will give you a couple of baselines that you can use for your mid-week bike workouts and for your upcoming Race Rehearsals. On such a short time frame, you're really looking to get your training and data usefuleness (is that a word?) to a point where you can really get the most benefit out of your last Race Rehearsal.

The 200 level course is to also pay close attention to your real-time power numbers during your longer rides and practice to keep them as steady as possible as this skill will help you to not burn extra matches during your race.

You need decent data though because you want to be able to miter out your effort evenly over the bike leg of your race to not overcook yourself for the run... But if you have bad data in the next 2-3 weeks, it could also slow you down too much (which is arguably better than overcooking, but still not ideal).

Jon Allen

Thank you so much for your input, I'll test tomorrow and see what happens. Fingers crossed :-)

Jon Allen

Wow that was a wake up call, so I did the EN 20 minute power test earlier today on my new 4iiii power meter, I appreciate that everyone is different but how low is a FTP of 235? With only 6 and a bit weeks until IMFrankfurt I know I'm not going to make massive gains but any help/advice will be most welcome.
My W/kg is 2.65 and my NP was 247
#feelslownow

John Withrow

Jon-- Congrats. Your number is your number... Hard to compare with different people with different equipment, body styles, etc... So don't get too caught up int he comparison contest. Drop a link in here of your data file from your test (Strava or Garmin, etc) and we'll eyeball it to give you opinions. Curious to see how your HR on your test tracked with your old HR TT test or compared to what you think your max HR is. Did you build throughout, or blow up into the end, etc. My guess is that your next test will be higher because it's rare that anyone nails their first ever test. Tests are supposed to be miserable, but also makes for a great workout.

Now do your long ride as you normally would and simply observe what your power data looks like throughout and for the whole ride. You'll quickly see that the PM will be a stick to make you push a little harder each time. Okay to push harder on your long rides, but you'll quickly need to get to the point to dial in your steady Race Rehearsal rides to be able to plan your race effort.

Shaughn Simmons

Jon, you're in great hands with Withrow........some gold in this thread with the advice being thrown down........

As JW suggest, post a link here to your test so that he can give more feedback....

 

Jon Allen

thanks for the advice, i think this will work??

  https://connect.garmin.com/modern/activity/1174824704

 cheers

 jon

Joe Matchette

Posted By Jon Allen on 19 May 2016 04:17 PM

thanks for the advice, i think this will work??

  https://connect.garmin.com/modern/activity/1174824704

 cheers

 jon

Jon,

That looks to me like you paced it pretty well. As you gain more proficiency, you will be able to be smoother and hold a more consistent power.  Your HR data looks like you kept it pretty well at Z4 during the 20min test period.  It is hard to tell for sure from the graph, but it looks like you had to slow down/ease up a few times during the 20min interval.

Can you go straight down 367 without having to 'flip-it'?

Joe

Jon Allen

Thanks Joe

I chose this as its kinda straight out of the front door and easy to re-test on. I can't keep going on that road as 1/2 a mile after I turn to loop back it it drops down a very steep hill into a town. Maybe I could have gone harder?? This is my first venture into power meters so a massive learning curve for me, plus I've been out of action for (no real excuse) 3 weeks as I've just bought and moved into a new house 

Thanks for all of the advice everyone has offered

Who says you can't teach an old dog new tricks????

 Jon

John Withrow

I agree with the others. My guess is your "actual" FTP is closer to the 245-250 window. ~5W for it being your first test and another 5+W for all of the 0's in your 20 min segment. I'm sure that just had a lot to do with the terrain you tested on, often that is unavoidable (it's very very hard to find a 20 min stretch with no stops or turns).

Now let us know what your NP turns out to be for your next long ride (don't obsess over it in your ride, just ride as you normally would and see where it ends up). That number will help to validate your FTP number and will also give you a carrot to chase for your remaining long rides.

Shaughn Simmons

My outside FTP on flat course typically runs 3-5% higher than my equivalent trainer tested FTP consistent with JW comments.  That can go as high as a 10% variance if I test outside on hills.....

Again, if you are going to being training more outside in preparation for an upcoming race, hard to go wrong testing outside.  

Taking it one step further, we need to document your watts/kilogram ratio resulting from your test.  In other words your weight in kilos divided by your FTP test result.  Raising your FTP over time is one way to get faster, but at the end of the day raising your FTP ratio, i.e., less weight, more power is what really counts.  Body composition improvement along with an improving FTP (or 5 hour power for IM distance) is what eliminates the competition on race day.

SS

Jon Allen

Hi John & Shaughn

Thanks massively for the help you guys have given me so far.

I've attached the data from todays ride, I've now changed the power on my Garmin 810 to show every 10 seconds (should I go to every 30??) as I had is set initially to show every second and it was mad trying to keep up with the numbers :-)

What's the best plan for now? Sorry to ask loads of questions as I know I've a lot to learn with using a power meter but with my race now in 42 days I kinda need a bit of help to get up to speed

https://connect.garmin.com/modern/activity/1178938000

Again thanks for your input

Jon

Shaughn Simmons

Great job on the ride Jon,  19.5 mph with good steady power and HR profile per your Garmin file.  Update your FTP setting in Garmin (currently its shows 400W) to your FTP test of ~245 - 250.

Next step for you is to download the EN IM plan with the end date of your race date and follow the daily prescribed workouts as best you can.

There is no such thing a too many questions.  Ask as needed.

Also consider posting your wkos on STRAVA and joining the EN STRAVA team so that you can see what many of the current EN team members are doing for their long IM Swim/Bike/Run wkos......I find this very helpful to me and motivating.

SS

John Withrow

As far as your Garmin sampling rate is concerned, 10s is probably fine. 30s is too long, and 1s is definitely too short. I use 3s, but your PM only samples on the left side, so 3s is probably okay, but will still seem jumpy compared to 10s.

Your VI was a bit high at 110%, but some of that likely from all of the u-turns. I'd go crazy staying on that same small stretch of road for 2.5 hrs... VI is your NP divided by AP, in your case 213W/194W = 110%. You'll want this to be lower for your race (i.e. ride steadier/smoother).

Your HR had a good "average", but lots of spikes up to 150 and drop-offs into the 130's (similar to your Power). I push and spike all the time in training (good to get the extra work in). But just know that your "racing" self has to be steadier and smoother than your "training" self (if that makes sense).

Now for the questions for you... How did you feel during your ride? Was this a "normal" ride? were you crushing yourself or just riding steady? Did you run afterwards? If so, how did you feel? Could you have run for 13+ miles? How long did it take for you to forget that you rode and were just "running"?

If I were to guess that your rode "moderately hard", then that's likely a 80% effort. (again, just a guess). Then 213NP divided by 0.80 = 266W. If you were REALLY pushing and hammering a lot of the time, then that might be 85% so 213NP divided by 0.85 = 250W. That's pretty close to the FTP we "guessed" above based on your first test. I'd suggest you do as SS suggested and load up the IM plan. Do your mid week FTP work ~250-255W for your intervals (and test again in a couple of weeks)... Then next week on your long ride, do the prescribed intervals as well, but try to beat that 213W NP number for the whole ride. And if you're only 6 weeks out, you better log more than just a 2.5hr ride. This is your crucial period for putting the work in (PM or not...)