.............as if we really needed him to admit it! This ones gonna run a bit isn't it - not sure that its got the 'legs' however to bring the whole show down & knock pro-cycling back 2 steps so it can go forward positively - Landis has come over to damaged perhaps for his evidence to stand-up.
Way too many millions of $$ invested in the game & IMO the whole organisation in pro-cycling is rotten to the core with pay-off's , bungs/bribes etc - remember the lance cortisoid fiasco some years ago during the TdF?
Doping is the level playing field, its as old as cycle racing itself and part of the culture - ex-cycling coach of mine spent his early life trying to make it in Belgium, his attitude was just to legalise it and get on with it 'cos it won't stop the use.
Maybe I am pessimistic, but I think all the guys at that level dope. Don't get me wrong I could dope till the cows come home and never be half as good as they are. But for them to compete on a level playing field with all the other super talented and gifted cyclist they feel they have to dope to have a chance. And like Floyd said they probably do have to, to do what they do. Day after day with no rest, as gifted as they are they have to be taking something to continue doing that. On the one hand they are cheating; on the other I think they are playing on a level field. I found it amusing that, was it Oscar Piero who was second the year Floyd was stripped of the win, anyway him talking about how clean he was when he was given the tour win. You know he had to be doping also. I also think that is why Floyd and Tyler and others can sit there with a inocent persecuted look on there face and say I did not do anything. Because they can't figure out why they are being punished when they know good and well everyone else is doing it also.
Did anyone really believe that he wasn't doping? I saw both stages- where he was crushed and then where he was the hero. No way he did that au naturelle.
I remember watching Floyd race and win that Tour de France and found myself cheering and yelling at the tv as he made his magnificent move by seemingly pure force of spirit. And then a couple of days later I felt a bit crushed as I watched him loose his victory via a positive drug test.
There have been examples in a multitude of sports where the athlete and/or team seemed to pull himself/herself/themselves up by sheer will and turn the tide from defeat into victory. Think Mohammad Ali, Lou Gehrig, the 1980 US Hockey Team, the Dave Scott/Mark Allen wars – the list is endless and drug free. And each time seems to represent the best that humans as athletes are capable of.
I am not willing to say that the entire bike racing community is drugged. I may be looking at the sport through rose colored glasses, and hope that at this point in time drug use represents a very small minority of riders who will someday get caught.
And as for Floyd Landis – after the past several years how can anyone believe anything that he says? He is a sad individual and hopefully he will find some joy in life before his days on this great rock are over.
I'm also quite torn on this. One side says that maybe Floyd has realized that his only way back into the game in any way is to come clean. The fact that he did it in the "drowning man" fashion he did by accusing everyone else is evidence that Hayes may be right. If he was genuinely contrite about his own choices, he would own up, stop blaming the system, other riders, etc., and try to get on with it a la Millar.
As far as other riders, and Lance in particular, I'm also of 2 minds. 1 side is that it's just really hard to imagine him performing at the level he performed for as long as he did (a la Barry Bonds). The other side is that ever since he was 16 and winning the national US Sprint triathlon title, he's been a remarkable athlete, the kind that seems to come along every now and then (think Pete Rose, Tiger Woods, or Wayne Gretzky) and demonstrates a level of skill/ability that no one ever thought was possible. He's also literally the most tested athlete of all time, so if he WAS doping, you have to also believe that the UCI was in on it and taking bribes from Johan/Lance to not "catch him". Given the ongoing animosity between Lance, the UCI, and the Tour folks, that seems really hard to imagine. Occum's razor is a principle that I put a lot of faith in. It says: "When competing hypotheses are equal in other respects, the principle recommends selection of the hypothesis that introduces the fewest assumptions and postulates the fewest entities". In other words if you have to choose between all of the complexity embedded in Floyd's story (Lance NEVER getting caught despite more tests than anyone, Lance having moles in the doping agency who warn him or upcoming tests, Johan bribing officials who don't like Lance, etc.), OR the simple version (Floyd cheated and is trying to blame it on everyone else) the logical choice is the latter.
To me the obvious lesson to anyone else who gets caught is that if given the Millar choice or the Landis choice, better to admit your sins, start training clean, and the public will forgive you NO MATTER WHAT THE TRUTH IS ABOUT ANYONE ELSE. The other guys didn't get caught, you did. Compound your sins with more lies, denials, deceit, etc., and you end up losing not only your personal credibility but also your ability to ever race again. If Floyd had legitimately accepted reality and stopped making himself a one-man circus, he would probably be on a pro team racing the TOC. Instead he's reduced himself to being viewed as a raving lunatic. He's lost his career, his wife, his fortune, and his credibility. At some point he needs to man up, shut up, and get on with his life. Until then he's nothing but tabloid fodder. If a PROVEN liar tells you he's not lying this time, do you believe him?
I really like the way you framed this discussion, Bill. It succinctly lays out the scenarios that could make up the real story....and I learned something new from it: Occum's razor. Seems like a helpful wa to find a decision path when you don't have the facts you might wish you had.
Anyway...agree with what others have said. Flandis (as he is known in my house) has clearly lost a lot in this whole thing and since he tested postive really has been a circus. It's too bad, you feel sorry for him, but it is his responisbility to recognize that it truly is over and that he needs to move on. Truth is though that many of these guys for whom cycling has been all they've ever known therer isn't much to which they can move on. I can't fathom that despair. I'm sure it's deep and dreadful and it is probably no wonder he's done what he's done. i don't get it.
All - if you haven't read the full interviews with Lance, Johan, etc., I would highly encourage it. You can get there from Hayes' link. If you believe what they say, Floyd has truly gone off the deep end...to the point of trying to extort money from Lance, Johan, TOC organizers, Amgen, etc. Even sadder and more pathetic than I thought. It's like watching the TV show "Intervention". You can't stand to watch because you see seemingly normal (or even exceptional) people systematically destroying themselves, but you can't help but be compelled to watch the carnage. Truly, truly sad ending for a guy who was one helluva a racer and gave us some epic memories.
If he's really "coming clean", can someone please direct me to his published plans for returning the hundreds of thousands of dollars he received through his well orchestrated fraud?!?
Comments
Way too many millions of $$ invested in the game & IMO the whole organisation in pro-cycling is rotten to the core with pay-off's , bungs/bribes etc - remember the lance cortisoid fiasco some years ago during the TdF?
Doping is the level playing field, its as old as cycle racing itself and part of the culture - ex-cycling coach of mine spent his early life trying to make it in Belgium, his attitude was just to legalise it and get on with it 'cos it won't stop the use.
A few more links:
SCIENCE OF SPORT
WALL STREET JOURNAL
CYCLING NEWS--LANDIS EMAILS
Maybe I am pessimistic, but I think all the guys at that level dope. Don't get me wrong I could dope till the cows come home and never be half as good as they are. But for them to compete on a level playing field with all the other super talented and gifted cyclist they feel they have to dope to have a chance. And like Floyd said they probably do have to, to do what they do. Day after day with no rest, as gifted as they are they have to be taking something to continue doing that. On the one hand they are cheating; on the other I think they are playing on a level field. I found it amusing that, was it Oscar Piero who was second the year Floyd was stripped of the win, anyway him talking about how clean he was when he was given the tour win. You know he had to be doping also. I also think that is why Floyd and Tyler and others can sit there with a inocent persecuted look on there face and say I did not do anything. Because they can't figure out why they are being punished when they know good and well everyone else is doing it also.
He has lost his mind......I would like my $25 bucks back that I sent to support his fariness fund.
He's been harassing and "drunk" emailing for months....
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/arm...llegations
I remember watching Floyd race and win that Tour de France and found myself cheering and yelling at the tv as he made his magnificent move by seemingly pure force of spirit. And then a couple of days later I felt a bit crushed as I watched him loose his victory via a positive drug test.
There have been examples in a multitude of sports where the athlete and/or team seemed to pull himself/herself/themselves up by sheer will and turn the tide from defeat into victory. Think Mohammad Ali, Lou Gehrig, the 1980 US Hockey Team, the Dave Scott/Mark Allen wars – the list is endless and drug free. And each time seems to represent the best that humans as athletes are capable of.
I am not willing to say that the entire bike racing community is drugged. I may be looking at the sport through rose colored glasses, and hope that at this point in time drug use represents a very small minority of riders who will someday get caught.
And as for Floyd Landis – after the past several years how can anyone believe anything that he says? He is a sad individual and hopefully he will find some joy in life before his days on this great rock are over.
As far as other riders, and Lance in particular, I'm also of 2 minds. 1 side is that it's just really hard to imagine him performing at the level he performed for as long as he did (a la Barry Bonds). The other side is that ever since he was 16 and winning the national US Sprint triathlon title, he's been a remarkable athlete, the kind that seems to come along every now and then (think Pete Rose, Tiger Woods, or Wayne Gretzky) and demonstrates a level of skill/ability that no one ever thought was possible. He's also literally the most tested athlete of all time, so if he WAS doping, you have to also believe that the UCI was in on it and taking bribes from Johan/Lance to not "catch him". Given the ongoing animosity between Lance, the UCI, and the Tour folks, that seems really hard to imagine. Occum's razor is a principle that I put a lot of faith in. It says: "When competing hypotheses are equal in other respects, the principle recommends selection of the hypothesis that introduces the fewest assumptions and postulates the fewest entities". In other words if you have to choose between all of the complexity embedded in Floyd's story (Lance NEVER getting caught despite more tests than anyone, Lance having moles in the doping agency who warn him or upcoming tests, Johan bribing officials who don't like Lance, etc.), OR the simple version (Floyd cheated and is trying to blame it on everyone else) the logical choice is the latter.
To me the obvious lesson to anyone else who gets caught is that if given the Millar choice or the Landis choice, better to admit your sins, start training clean, and the public will forgive you NO MATTER WHAT THE TRUTH IS ABOUT ANYONE ELSE. The other guys didn't get caught, you did. Compound your sins with more lies, denials, deceit, etc., and you end up losing not only your personal credibility but also your ability to ever race again. If Floyd had legitimately accepted reality and stopped making himself a one-man circus, he would probably be on a pro team racing the TOC. Instead he's reduced himself to being viewed as a raving lunatic. He's lost his career, his wife, his fortune, and his credibility. At some point he needs to man up, shut up, and get on with his life. Until then he's nothing but tabloid fodder. If a PROVEN liar tells you he's not lying this time, do you believe him?
Anyway...agree with what others have said. Flandis (as he is known in my house) has clearly lost a lot in this whole thing and since he tested postive really has been a circus. It's too bad, you feel sorry for him, but it is his responisbility to recognize that it truly is over and that he needs to move on. Truth is though that many of these guys for whom cycling has been all they've ever known therer isn't much to which they can move on. I can't fathom that despair. I'm sure it's deep and dreadful and it is probably no wonder he's done what he's done. i don't get it.
Mike