Running Naked

Derrek Sanks

Sorry, but this is not about streaking naked around the neighborhood.    I've been doing some reading about running by feel and not being controlled by a pace or HR. Running by feel lets your mind and body dictate what is an easy run or tempo or marathon pace that particular day.  Some days that might be a faster pace and some days slower, all based on how you feel, which of course is based on fatigue level, energy/stress, sleep, etc.  Anyway, my plan is to do this in the OS and see how I do in my Spring HM.  I will still wear my GPS watch and HR monitor just to collect data and review post workout, but I will not look at it during my runs.

Why? 

1. To get back to enjoying my runs.  Over the past 3 - 4 years during most workouts my mind was always focused on pacing and having a corresponding HR in the right range.  This, to me, has taken the fun out of running.  

2. I've been convinced that letting pace/HR control your level of effort can limit you from reaching your full running potential.  And I know we have a WSM (TC) who wholeheartedly believes in running by feel.

3. It's time for a change to see if I can increase my VDOT, which is at 51.

All this to ask, does anyone else run by feel?  If so, have you seen any improvements in your VDOT or race times?

Thanks!

Steve West

Derrek,

I often run by feel and have for the past few years. But I got there by running a lot. Last weekend at MDI (BQ for 2018) was my 25th open marathon over the past 13 years , so I know a bit about what things feel like for me.

For me I have 3 different run scenarios: (1) long or recovery run at a comfortable pace; (2) mid-distance tempo run; (3) intensity track repeats or hill repeats. Each one has specific goal and often a target pace but I let RPE guide my adherence to any targets as the workout begins.

For long and easy runs I start stupid easy and ignore my pace until I start to get aerobic, often past the 2 mile mark. During that warm-up I ignore metrics completely. After that I gauge were I am for pace and HR relative to my targets but mostly observational and not as a whip. I look at my HR and pace at mile splits and on the 0.5 but mostly to calibrate how I feel. My goal is usually to keep my HR below zone 3 for all but long/steep hills and let pace fall where it does.

Tempo runs start about the same but after the 2+ mile warm-up I gradually ramp up the RPE. The intent is to meter out my effort over the distance (7-10 miles) so that each mile is 5-15 seconds faster and so my last mile feels like an all out sprint. Hills chew into some of the splits but I recognize them as speed sessions in disguise. Here it is less about an absolute pace, and more about a steady RPE ramp. Steadily increasing with no fading especially the last mile. Here HR is secondary and only useful if I start to spike above zone 4, but I'd know that without looking because of how I feel and unless I going to bonk, I keep pushing.

For intensity work I ignore HR completely and only look at it after the fact. I approach hill repeats and track repeats the same way and it depends on how I feel at the beginning. My goal is to do the first at an RPE of 8+ and use the split, not pace (top of the hill, 800,1200, 1600, etc.) for all subsequent repeats. I follow this until I complete the full set of repeats or until I cannot make the split within 3 or 4 seconds. If I can't make the split a second time, I'm done and call it a day and set an easy pace for home.

May not work for everyone and not necessarily a method to drive your vDot up. I guess if I was to use an analogy to describe the process, it would be like using a hard Arkansas stone to hone a edge of an ax to sharpen it's cutting edge. Whereas raising your vDot is more like what you do with a mill-bastard file and a course stone to shape the cheek before the fine honing begins.

Good luck.

moetai@gmail.com

I used to do all my runs by feel, than tried the "run by pace" with EN 2 years ago, dealt with injuries (not related to EN protocol). Back from surgery this year, I now do all my runs by feel again and see my pace drop from 6'/km to 5'20s , I have a 920 and check my pace and glance at HR from time to time...but neither are goals or limiters (for now)

Dave Tallo

I think your reasons for considering this are very, very good. We (I, you, triathletes generally) spend a ton of time disconnected from our bodies and the reaction to training stress because of our various metrics, and while these start to become a game in themselves (and are of irrefutable value in short and long term development), they just aren't a substitute for the sheer pleasure of a undocumented trail run, easy spin in the fall, or the play that we need to keep up with this game, ensure consistency, and enjoy long term growth. Steve's points about the intersection - or re convergence - of HR, pace, and effort are very good, and I think this is where the real money comes in terms of achieving improved results in race situations. You are smarter, or tuned in, to all dimensions.

What might be interesting to get quicker is finding an old-school track group of people, some of whom are faster than you, with a coach with a stopwatch and a 400m oval, and hitting it old-school for an extended (and dedicated) block. No biking, no garmin, no headsweats visors. Just the pressure that comes with social facilitation, the self-limiting nature of going anaerobic, connecting with pain (and managing it with your brain, instead of plotting out where it appears on your pace curve), and getting whupped / giving a whupping.

Does the reading you're doing include Fitzgerald's book? This came up on my radar on a different search this weekend, and I was intrigued.

Peter Greagg

Back in the day (in my mid 30s) when I took up running, I never used a watch except to note my time for a particular wko. And I used a wrist watch with a stop watch incorporated but never looked at it during the run (why would I because the trail runs weren't marked in any way).
My marathon prep was simple. A bunch of trail runs over 10m km, 12 km, and 18 km were the weekday runs. I also did 10 x 400 m intervals with some buddies during the week — we used to start each 400 m every 2 mins, with the recovery time being from when you finished the last interval until the 2 min mark. Long runs on Saturdays were trail runs of either 24 km, 29 km, or 34 km. I used to average around 100 km a week for the last 8 weeks before a marathon race.
I only every ran by feel. If I felt tired after my warm up, I didn't push hard. If I felt great after the warm up, I pushed hard. You get the idea. One of the results of this approach was that I had a very good feel for pacing for races over 5, 10, half and full marathons as a consequence of not having a pace watch or even a heart rate monitor.
Now your 'Running Naked' sounds like to me is very similar to my approach in my mid 30s.
Given my success with this type of approach, I say, go for it.
Alas, I will never see my marathon PR from those days of 3 hours 13 mins and change. Of course, if I had been in EN (and if it had been around in the late 1980s), think I might have broken 3 hours.

Paul Hough

Back in my 20s as a serious competitive runner, the only time I was measuring anything apart from the total time spent running was either on the track or in a race. All other runs were by feel. I rated how I felt as Good, OK, and Ugh. There were also three effort levels: Hard, Moderate, and Easy. So, a typical run might be logged as 45 mins, Good - Easy. Volume was high. I ran a 30:11 10K, 48:01 15K, and 1:08:16 Half Marathon off that training.

Derrek Sanks

@Steve, Congrats on your BQ, especially on a hilly course. Thanks for your input. I see many similarities in the way we approach running. I started endurance running 11 years ago and competed over 16 open marathons. I ran a PR last year at Route 66 Marathon (at age 50). I also look at HR and pace at mile splits and a few times in between, which is what I want to stop because my mind is always thinking about pacing and what's my HR before/after hills. I think (if even on a subconscious level), if I see a faster pace or higher HR than what's normal for a particular type of run then I'd slow down (especially on tempo and interval workouts) to avoid blowing up in the latter miles. Based on my running experience, I would like to think my mind/body would select a pace appropriate for the distance or type of workout and can free my mind from pace/HR.

@David, glad you're back to running. Great discipline to not let pace/HR slow you down. If I'm on a 15 mile long run and see my pace at mile 5 to be closer to MP than TRP, I would slow down no matter how good I feel. Again, I hope my mind/body would select a pace appropriate for the distance or type of workout. I'll find out in several weeks.

@Dave, your description of "old-school track" workout brought back painful memories of my high school track days. I ran the 400 and 300 hurdles...wasn't great at it but I do remember all the interval work. Nowadays, 1600 and 800 intervals are key ingredients to my training, except it's just me against me. You've re-sparked my interest in joining a group track session. Lately, most of my run by feel reading is from coachjayjohnson.com blog.

@Peter, thanks for your insight!

@Paul, Wow...smokin' fast! Do you still run by feel?

Paul Hough

@ Derrek - My legs are shot from decades of high mileage running. I do use a Garmin now, but do NOT look at the watch (too depressing) on days I know I should be running slow. The key is to create greater variance between hard and easy days. Most athletes tend to push the two closer together. The slow days should be like you want to have a bag on your head so no one recognizes you going that slow. Hard days should have you with your hands on your knees after an interval - if you are training for short distance speed.

Meanwhile, there are two REAL naked runs each year down here in Tampa Bay - home of at least half a dozen nudist colonies. I've thought about it as a bucket list item, but then I worry someone would recognize me; not to mention that I would be an old lech staring at the young girls. Maybe in another life.

Scott Giljum

Derrek,
When I run, I run with two things in mind: my breathing and my HR.

I coordinate my breathing with my steps and my effort. Basically I make sure to breath out on alternate leg landings. And how many strides I take between breaths ties to my effort. Basically I run with a three then two for most runs. When I get to 2 and 1, I am pushing it pretty good. I also can see where my HR is based on my breathing pattern. I say all of this because when I say I run by "feel", these are my indicators of feel. I rarely look at pace for any reason other than vanity (I like to think I'm fast even if I'm not). For me, it's all about the breathing.

Derrek Sanks

@Paul, Ahhhh, the joys of living in Florida!

@Scott, that's a great method of running by feel. Thanks for sharing.