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2016/17 NOS Week 5 Bike Thread - Fighting with a gorilla

Welcome to the "I can't believe it's already week 5" bike thread. It's great to hear of everyone's challenges, progress and questions. This weeks workouts will again be the basically the same format, but the Z4 intervals get a little longer and the quantity of 30/30s goes up.  

Rule #10 of the Velominati Rules of Cycling states: It never gets easier, you just go faster. As this famous quote by Greg LeMan tells us, training, climbing, and racing is hard. It stays hard. To put it another way, per Greg Henderson: “Training is like fighting with a gorilla. You don’t stop when you’re tired. You stop when the gorilla is tired.”

I noticed in the coaches notes for Tuesday, there is a comment on bike position.  You may recall, there was a lot of discussion in the forum in week 4.  position on the bike -- choose the position (or select the bike) that reduces the mental cost of doing the work. If that's road bike in the hoods vs tri bike in the aerobars, that's fine. Just build the fitness with the lowest mental cost venue available, then we'll transfer that to a tri-specific riding position later when you shift to your A-race training plan.



 

 

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  • my work schedule doesn't allow for Tuesday bike wkos on my trainer at home, so I did a spin class in NYC this morning; hard to simulate the 2x16's, but I did get 60' of bike work in at an elevated HR; Central Park loop teed up for tomorrow's longer run and will be able to hit the trainer for Thursday's bike work
  • Tested FTP early this morning, given my low HR and RPE over last several workouts. Improved 10w/4.8% to 3.0w/kg. Lots more work needed to reach the 3.5 - 4.0 w/kg, 253ftp - 290ftp, goal in time for spring HIM.

    10/31/16, FTP: 208, W/kg: 2.83
    11/29/16, FTP: 218, W/kg: 3.00
  • Whoa - that was hard! Got it done though - first interval NP was right at my FTP and second was 2 watts below - I'll take it. 14 min was a long time image Husband set the workout up on Trainer Road - that was kinda fun. I normally just stare at my power meter, so this gave me something else to look at.
  • Lost some time on morning admin stuff. I knew I wouldn't have time to complete the 2nd interval so I upped the resistance.

    45' ride
    1x14'@ 1.07
    1x5'@ 1.07

    Definitely a hard one this morning.
  • @Mike, the important thing is you got the workout in...well done.
    @Ashton, nice FTP bump after only 4 weeks!
    @Ellen, Great job! I also stare at Trainer Road and my Garmin 520

    Wow, that hurt! 16' is a lot longer than 12'. I had to turn off Netflix and listen to my music to stay focus on maintaining watts. 2X16' were at 1.01 and 1.03.
  • 2x14'. Holy cow!! Tat gorilla tried to eat me alive! But there was not stopping until he was tired, so got it done. Run after felt great, though.
  • @Leslie, I'm with ya on that darn Gorilla. Love the analogy though. Great FTP bump @Ashton!! Excellent work all.

    My 2 x 14' started off great. Hit great numbers for first interval, 1.03.. then, my 3 young boys (3, 4, 6) woke up and came downstairs about 30 mins sooner than I expected. That blew up the middle of second interval, but recovered some to hit 0.98. Tried to keep them from killing each other while pushing through the z3 work, but  having them around my spinning rear wheel was unnerving.  Oh well, got the work done. Delayed brick run, for obvious reasons. lol

  • Lots of people hitting their workouts today. That's awesome.

    @Mike - jealous about your Central Park run tomorrow. Sounds much better than what I got going on.
    @Derrek, @Ed - thanks for the kudos. Trying to catch up to you guys. Ed, that's the worst when they get fixated on the spinning rear - I go into panic mode, shouting to the wife for backup. The dog, on the other hand, only needed to catch a couple whacks to head from the pedals and she won't go near me now!
  • After a rough week last week because of rain/vacation... I'm back at it today. Got a good ride in today. Feels good to be back at it (and my legs had a bit of a rest last week).
  • Workout completed on Tribike/Trainer/TR.  I love Trainer Road ...

    I watch/listen something on my iPhone on the trainer to cut the boredom.  From now on need to set DND.  I can ignore the emails/texts, but the calls seem to break my concentration.

    Anybody have any good podcast recomendations.  Watching movies is getting harder now that I need to focus on the power number so much.

  • @Marvin -- I'm a big sports fan and enjoy the Bill Simmons Podcast (covers NFL, NBA, some pop culture) and the Solid Verbal (hard core college football coverage). For uptempo music, Avicii's Levels podcast is great.
  • Thanks for the mojo today team...stared down 2x14 and nailed it. 197 and 197, followed by 15' at 179; amazing the difference in effort required. Think I'm just about ready to test to really see where I'm at. Started watching a series on Netflix, the 3%; might be interesting. I also listed to EN podcasts all the time, especially while running. Great work team! mark
  • Great work, everybody! When the intervals get to this length is when I start "hating" the OS a little bit, but I got through today thanks to TR controlling the Kickr and Zwift engaging my brain. 1.01 and 1.02 respectively for the intervals; didn't want to push them too much due to the significantly longer duration.
  •  

    @Mike - I've only done a few spin classes, but I left each one totally crushed, so a good substitute.  I saw your run in Central park on Strava this morning.  That is where I love to run when I get to New York.
    @ Ashton - Great FTP bump - I'd say you are on a good trajectory to the 3.5 - 4.0.

    @ Ellen - pretty even if the second was only 2 watts slower.  TR is awesome wko tool.  I am glad you got it set up.

    @ Phil - 19' at 1.07 is great.  considering the first set was 14', I'd say you are set for a nice bump in a few weeks.

    @ Derrek - I needed music as well.  I do not know how anyone can focus on a movie while doing these wkos.

    @ Leslie - Way to tire the gorilla.  You are killing it!

    @ Ed - I admire all you folks who can do this while raising kids (especially 3 young boys).  It certainly takes away my excuses.

    @ Peter - Good to be back in the groove!@Marvin - I've tried podcasts, but I just cannot concentrate.  I listen to them when I drive - EN, IMTalk, Cup of Tri, Tower 26, TRS Radio, ZenTri &  Training Bible Coaching

    @ Mark - Holding 197 for both is great.  Bump in your future for sure!

    @ Bill - Smart not to push too much.  You will have no choice in a few weeks.....

     

    I did the 2 X 16' yesterday.  I am certain that I would not have been able to hold these if it what not for the fact that I did not want to report back to you all that the gorilla won.  I was able to hold both right at 100% and then the 8' ABP at 84%.  My heart was racing for sure!  I am looking forward to a nice run tonight!

  • I'm not an official NOS member but have been doing the training since week 1. I haven't planned my 2017 season yet but figured I would get ahead of the curve by participating. This is also my reason for not posting until today.


    I'm trying really hard to get my FTP up this year (this is my 3rd OutSeason) and am pushing each ride a little harder than prescribed. It could be a recipe for disaster or possibly a huge ROI? Time will tell. Anyway, yesterday's ride was tough....2 x 14' seemed like a big jump and I completed it at 102% FTP but added 2 minutes of additional rest between intervals.



    Did anyone else think the rest interval seemed a little short this early on?

  • Posted By Todd Bray on 30 Nov 2016 08:58 AM
    ...


    I'm trying really hard to get my FTP up this year (this is my 3rd OutSeason) and am pushing each ride a little harder than prescribed. It could be a recipe for disaster or possibly a huge ROI? Time will tell. Anyway, yesterday's ride was tough....2 x 14' seemed like a big jump and I completed it at 102% FTP but added 2 minutes of additional rest between intervals..
    Hey, Todd; I'm sort of with/not with the group as well, starting OS last week. To get ready (even though it's my 8th OS), I checked out the links Brenda put in the Introductory thread, to refresh myself. You might take a look at those, where there are multiple comments from both members and coaches about how your approach is risky, not helpful. Over-achieving in the OS often does lead to injury and/or burn out. You really only need to do the FTP interval @ 95-100% to get the benefit without the risk. The admonition is, if you think you should be doing a higher FTP, prove it with a test. You can always replace Tuesday's workout with an official test.

    As to rest between intervals, wanting more rest is a sure sign that the work is too hard for your current fitness, and is an early warning sign you are slowly creeping up to the overtraining abyss. If you fall into that, you won't get the improvements out of the OS you are seeking. Be humble, patient, disciplined, and consistent. (The right amount of) work works.
  • @Todd, if you've been doing the NOS workouts since week 1, sounds like you're an official member to me.    Welcome!  If I remember correctly we had 4' rest breaks in last year's OS.  To be honest, so far I've been ok with the 2' rest intervals.  I really soft pedal and my watts are way below z1 or the target watts in TrainerRoad, but my goal is to recover as much as possible.  And it's enough time for my HR to fully recover.  In the first minute my HR goes from the upper 150s down to ~120. 
  • What a fun workout!!! LOL, not really. Works has been crazy so my workouts are a safe place for me to relax. i did well on my first 12 minutes but the second was really really tough.
  • For the rest intervals, I've been unplugging the Computrainer from erg mode and soft pedaling.  I do this to 1) wipe sweat off my arms and hands, 2) blow my noes since I can't launch snot rockets in the basement, 3) get my HR down as low as possible before the next interval starts.  I usually plug back in after 90 seconds.  That 2 minutes goes by pretty quick!

  • Spent the whole night cursing trainer road only to realize today my garmin sensors are ant+ not Bluetooth. Ordered the dongle will bike Thurs and Fri this week to get in all of the wkos. The penalty of being a dumbass.
  • Completed 30/30's this morning at new power numbers. The start of the second 14x set was a little tough. Better workout overall though. Wish you could manually toggle between slope and erg mode to make the spin-ups and single leg drills more manageable.
  • knocked out the bike & run early this morning; i'm enjoying the single leg drills as something different in the OS this year -- definitely feel fatigue near the end of the 30 second mark and it takes my full concentration to keep a smooth pedal stroke all around. i was glad when the main sets were over, but i definitely have a different gear in reserve for after the week 8 re-test. trying not to overdo things at this point, because week 9-14 are TOUGH!
  • Completed the 20x 30/30 VO2 set early this morning. Fatigue definitely present after yesterday's run. Still finished the last sets stronger than the first.
  • Al.....thanks for the heads up and now that you mention it I do remember reading what the coaches advised. I need to just trust the training and not overextend myself.



  • Finished my 30/30's today. Actually felt ok. I think i'll bump up to the Int OS plan. I had been doing the beg. because I didn't start in good enough shape, but now i know I can handle the Int. OS plan. Goal is to ramp up next week and be fully in in for week 7+
  • I'm hacking the crap out of this week due to half Marathon Saturday. I don't sleep much Sunday- Wednesday and the building fatigue of the workouts hit me Wednesday. Today's bike was 15 min of warm up and 15 min in zone 3. After a great night of sleep! I missed the 30/30s - I like them!
  • Completed my 30/30s this evening. All went well. The second set of 30/30s were stronger than the first.
    It's very motivating seeing everyone getting in their workouts. Great job.
  • @Al, thanks for the reminder about over-cooking the workouts. I tend to push above each zone target, but need to keep that within reason. 

    Despite mainly following the intermediate plan, I did the advanced 30/30s in Trainer Road on Thursday, as well as last Thursday. I feel like I can do a bunch of 30/30s without fatiguing all that quickly. 14 of them definitely is a bunch of work though. Both sets were similar power numbers, and strived to hit upper end Z5 each time.  Definitely need to let the legs chill on Friday.

  • Got my 30/30s in at lunchtime today after getting off a brutally early flight home from a week on the road. Felt good and had stronger second set. Need to do a little research on trainer road. I've just been bumping up resistance level in wahoo app for 30/30 and setting power in erg for the longer interval sessions. Anyone use trainer road on iPad?
  • Got the 30/30's done today. Did the whole thing on TR at 110%. With rain coming this weekend, it may be a long lonely weekend on the trainer!
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