Hi @Coach Patrick - I think you completely forgot about me, but I wouldn't want to assist 700 or so athletes all by myself either Next week my daughter is swimming at State (prelims/finals so all day) so I will be swamped Friday, Sat, Sun. I will have to do the rehearsal on another day that week. I don't even know how I will get it all done, but I'll do what I can. Also, what workouts should I scratch if timewise I won't be able to get it all done? Week 18 Adv Half Plan. Thank you!
@Daria Matthews - I am so sorry! Usually I am pretty good, but now that my training has ramped up I am definitely suffering.
I hope things are going well for you as they appear to be going well and strong.
Cheering on your daughter at states is a great way to recover. While you were at the meet hopefully you can get in some short runs just to keep the consistency up.
I would recommend on doing the race rehearsal on Wednesday before you go.
that means that Monday would be your long run for the week, and Tuesday would be your bike intervals national with the brick run. Unless you can do the long run later in the week early in the morning before the meet starts, this seems like the best plan.
If you have an option to do the long run over the weekend, then I would make Monday your long swim day!
I hope that helps, let's plan on checking in during week 19...and good luck to your daughter.
Hi @Coach Patrick! I think I’m all set for the race. I can’t believe it’s time to party! So many
months of training and suddenly boom – it’s race time My field is loaded with strong ladies so it
will be one tough day, but I’m as ready as I can be and ready to just have a blast out there.
@Daria Matthews - remember anything can, and will, happen on race day. Don't worry about the competition so much is been the best version of yourself! You'll be amazed at what happens towards the end of the race if you make all the right decisions leading up to that point.
It's not easy to remain so internally focused until that late in the race, but it can have a profound effect if you do it right.
We will miss you! Remember you don't just have to cancel… You can go into maintenance mode which allows you to still stay connected to the team and have a basic training plan. It's an opportunity for you to still receive some guidance and support even when you aren't full on training.
Over the years we have found that even smaller levels of support consistently distribute across a year can Have A positive affect on your total progression as an endurance athlete.
if that interest you you're funny information under the my account tab at the top of the Endurance Nation members site. See you on GroupMe!
@Coach Patrick - that was the best pep talk ever! Thank you for that! I'm sending you a virtual high five I'll definitely check out the maintenance mode, but for now I'm all focused on Saturday! Have a good one!
@Daria Matthews - I was just checking out your results in this weekend, and saw that you were just about a minute slower than 14 time there. While your bikes that was 12 minutes faster, the swimmers to be slower in the run about eight. I'll be curious to know how you feel about the execution of a bike to run… Being able to lay down 12 minutes faster on that course is absolutely legit… So let me know what happened on the run.
You've had a great year so far given all the challenges, so let's wrap this up right!!
@Coach Patrick - great to hear from you! So here are my thoughts. Swim - to be honest I was very pleased with that time considering not swimming in the outseason, being a pretty weak swimmer, and not swimming 8-9K/week. It was very choppy and chaotic as expected, but I felt strong and had no issues with the crazy waves (thank god all my OWS swims were in similar conditions). From my Garmin, I can see I lost some speed around 2 buoys where girls were in panic and just hanging on the buoy (poor things). I think I was kicking more than I should have, but I was trying to always get away from these groups of girls from previous ways (the slower ones who were going left and right). Bike - way too excited to get on it. There were still a lot of bikes on the rack after my swim so I was a little surprised. I felt great. I started eating after 20mins and drinking. No issues at all. I kept passing a ton of people and was thinking if I should slow down. My HR was around 160 so I let it drop to 155 or so. It felt very comfortable. From my previous races I ride around 156 avg HR and then I can keep the run around 166 or higher (I know this seems high, but I have no explanation for that). Power was a tiny bit higher, but I was trying to use the "free speed" on the fast flats and then really watch it on the hills. I ate all my calories and salt pills on the bike as planned, but had to grab another bottle of gatorade since it was hot and I needed more. This bottle flew out so then I had to grab another one. I was pacing myself on the hills and I think that was executed well....I let crazy people pass me in a big gear shaking all over the place, yikes. The only thing that I have noticed closer to the end of my bike was that my left leg was having a slight pain from my glutes all the way to my knee. I've experienced this in my training, but I would always stretch it, roll it etc. Nothing major, but very annoying. It was just that annoying pain that caused me to move around the seat a bit. I was happy with my bike, but really did not want to start a half marathon after that, which made me think if I should have rather under-performed a bit. Run - I really watched my HR here since this is where it was already pretty hot out there. I took the first 3 miles pretty easy and it felt comfortable. I thought to myself I could keep up this pace easily and then pick it up later. The first 6 miles I just stayed around 160 with my HR. I knew I would normally be able to push a little bit more, but my legs started to hurt a tiny bit around my hips. Not sure what that was about, but I just wasn't ready to push more than what I was running. HR-wise I think I could have pushed more, but the legs didn't think so. One big difference that I've never done in my other 3 races is that I stopped for a drink at every single mile and walked a bit. I know I lost some time there, but I had to drink. 2013 St. George and 2014 Mt. Tremblant were in May and Sep so definitely not as hot as August in Boulder. Also, 2014 Boulder was in June so I can't compare those two as far as the temperatures go. I was pouring water over my head after mile 6 and putting ice in my shirt at every mile. I kept chasing all the girls within my age group after mile 10 (checking out every calf for a number) and passed about 9 more, but I guess they were still on their first lap. The second time we hit the "small hill" I walked a bit as well and that's where my pace dropped quite a bit too. I picked it up a bit the last 3 miles, but I was just ready to be done. Only after I finished I realized my left leg hurt like crazy. Maybe that's what I was feeling when "my hips" were hurting and just didn't realize that was the same pain from the bike, but worse. I don't know if that had any impact or not, but the heat did for sure. And if I can run around 8:40 or so under 80 degrees I'm pretty happy with 9:28 pace in the heat. Overall I'm very happy to be under 5:30 with this being my first race after 3 years. So much room for improvement, that's for sure Let me know your thoughts!
@Daria Matthews - I really appreciate you taking the time to give me some perspective. As a coach of hundreds of athletes I tend to draw the straightest line between two points and clearly I missed a few key parts about this race for us the others… So thank you!
I agree 100%, putting up that kind of time in these conditions versus your prior Races is definitely an improvement. And the fact that you were so much faster on the bike it's legit. 12 minutes faster and 56 miles is no small feat!
When the temperature is that high on the run, your top priority is staying hydrated and cool. Definitely want to make sure your bottle set up is fixed so you don't lose any more of them on race day. That is something easy to fix. It is also nice to have an extra cage on the bike for a bottle of water – when needed – so you can stay cool while riding.
When the heat is on it's easy for lots of little things to start to get in your way like your hips. I am very curious to hear about this left side pain when cycling in your glutes and how that translated to your run.
It sounds like maybe There could be some structural weakness there? It might be nice to not only review your fit if that's an option, but put a little checkmark in there to have some strength work in the out season so we can get ahead of this problem next time.
@Coach Patrick - thank you for your input. I will burst your bubble in regards to my bike split since back in 2014 I lost 10 minutes due to my flat tire. So technically, I didn't improve 12 minutes this year, but I was right on the money. Yes, the course is a bit different now, but the elevation gain I think is about the same. Temperature on the run still an issue this year, that's for sure.
I do completely agree that the leg pain (or hips) will need some strength work. This is the same leg where I had my plantar fasciitis in 2014 so I think this year it's again some kind of an imbalance. Like I said, my HR was much lower on my run this year, but it's the legs that didn't want to push and I do believe this could have been the reason. But you don't think about where the pain is coming from during a race since you just want to keep going and are in denial of anything hurting. Since it hurt a lot after I was done I realized that I just pushed through it without paying much attention during the run.
I did have a retul bike fit done so that's good. My bottle only flew out since I ran over a train track super fast so that's not an issue, but thank you for addressing it.
I have decided to do another 70.3 on September 17, which is also in Boulder on a very similar course. I just want to see what I can tweak. I will take this week a little easier and then follow the same plan and see what happens.
@Daria Matthews I would rather you be honest then let me live in a made-up world. I had no idea about the flat tire so thanks for keeping me in the loop.
I think you don't have to follow the same training plan for the next month. You have a great deal of fitness centers for a little fine-tuning we need to do. Here are my suggestions:
* start by prioritizing the strength and flexibility work on your hip. That should be 2 to 3 times a week, maybe one good yoga session as well.
*You don't need very much swimming. If time is an issue, you could keep it as low as two swims a week where one as speed working on it and the other is just a long 2000 yard timed swim.
* let's dial in the bike. Tuesday and Thursday intervals with Saturday three hours that he rides and just the last hour pushing it at race watts. Tuesday is FTP, Thursday is your choice… I say do the 110% hack (that's four minutes at 110% effort TP with six minutes of recovery, four times).
* there's really not a lot of running to be done here. I will keep it mostly a TRP pace with some strides for speed. But you literally are almost supposed to start tapering it now so it's more about recovery and getting your stride back. Thoughts?
@Coach Patrick - thank you so much for the above. I have started some strength training specific to my issue and I will follow your advice in regards to bike/run/swim. I will not bug you much now since you have your race this weekend! Best of luck and have fun!
Hi @Coach Patrick! I'm ready to start working on my run durability since I am not doing any other races this season, but when does your official outseason start? I'm thinking about doing a June 70.3. Thank you!
@Daria Matthews - there are two outs seasons, the end of October and the beginning of January. You can learn more about how everything connects in this post here on our fall running protocol: http://bit.ly/2fj3saP
@Coach Patrick - thank you! That's a great detail about the RDP and I just loaded RDP 1. This will be a great start for 2018. Thank you and happy training!
Hi @Coach Patrick - according to your guidance if I have an "A" race before July 1st I should start the OutSeason today. I'm trying to do the math - 10/30/17 start 14 weeks of the OutSeason and then 12 weeks of the EN Half plan. That would be the end of April so would I just extend the OutSeason? Also, I'm not sure if I should do run or bike focused OutSeason. I'm leaning towards the run, but not sure if you would agree. Thank you!
@Coach Patrick - if everything goes as planned it would be the 70.3 Hawaii June 2 and if things fall through then it would most likely be 70.3 Buffalo Springs June 24 or 70.3 Boulder in August. It may all change since I'm not registered yet
@Daria Matthews - Remember after the outs season, we typically have a one or two week “break” we’re people to swim camp. Or perhaps he put you in a bike or run focus plan as part of the tradition.
Bottom line, we don’t have to solve the end of your Outseason until you are… Close to the end of your outseason!
We can figure out a way to transition you through there, it’s more important that we focus on now and getting you into the best workouts, with the best recovery, etc. I hope that makes sense!
Hi @Coach Patrick - yes, that makes sense and I totally forgot about the swim camp. Not sure what you meant by "he put you" since I chose the run focused plan for this outseason. I'm in week 5 now and I am not too sure about the testing part. I may skip it for now since I have a good feel about my FTP and also my running (filling up the frequency bucket with lower intensity). I am thinking about starting to work on my swim and making it to the pool at least twice a week while dropping my weekly run mileage to maybe 36 or so....since I'm such a crappy swimmer.
Sorry for the mixup, Siri totally hates me right now.
I like where you are at right now. Before you jump in the pool, remind me again what it is you’re trying to improve specifically with your swim. What that is determines how I feel about you sooner.
My swimming has the most room for improvement. I could definitely use more speed and overall swim endurance. I'd love to find out how it feels to be chased after the swim leg versus me trying to chase everyone else. I'm confident in my bike and my run is also getting to where it used to be. My problem is also my constant ROI view where I don't see the swim portion as valuable as run/bike. I'd love to find that happy medium where I continue working on my bike/run, but am also investing time into my swim. And with family and kids' activities I will always lean towards bike/run. Thank you!
I hear you. Let me think think on this a little bit… I have an idea of how we can make it work in a coordinated manner. Please give me until early January!
Here's your updated Season Plan, as promised. This is where you'll return to post all your "coach" questions as responses; I'll see them and reply. This first post is my best outline of how to proceed with your races, but you can ask any / all questions you want. So post away, know that I reply here usually M/W/F each week.
Power User Tip: Click the Star icon by the Title of this thread to subscribe, and you'll get email updates when I do reply.
Your Races
IM Boulder 6/10/2018
Season Update
These are your recommended training plans, including the date you should start each one (sometimes you won’t complete a full plan but transition to another one). You can change your plans on the Training Plan page by clicking the Move / Change button. Learn more about each plan on the Training Plan Central Page.
Last updated by Coach on 02/14/2018
On 2/5/2018 Load the OutSeason (Bike Focus) Plan, 14wks to end on 5/13/2018
>> Transition Early <<
On 3/26/2018 Load the EN*Full to end on 6/10/2018
On 6/11/2018 Load the -- Post Ironman Transition Plan, All Levels (4wks) to end on 7/8/2018
Coach Notes
You are a bit behind in terms of the "plan" process, so you can jump into the OutSeason Plan using Level 2 workouts. We'll squeeze as much of that in as possible before we head over to the EN*Full Plan into Boulder. I am sure you'll have other races / events / trips, so please let me know here so I can take it all into account!
Thank you @Coach Patrick! I'm super excited and scared at the same time about my first full IM! I do have a few questions. Why do you think I'm a bit behind in terms of the plan process? Before I finally decided on the race I was doing the Run focus outseason and averaging between 30-40 miles of running per week and doing the bike workouts as planned. Also, why not jump into the EN Full Plan now - I am only assuming that the outseason will make me stronger/faster at this point? Would it also be beneficial to do one 70.3 before the full IM this year or there isn't really much time for that? Can I jump into some Level 3 workouts if I'm feeling good? Thank you!
Comments
Next week my daughter is swimming at State (prelims/finals so all day) so I will be swamped Friday, Sat, Sun. I will have to do the rehearsal on another day that week. I don't even know how I will get it all done, but I'll do what I can. Also, what workouts should I scratch if timewise I won't be able to get it all done? Week 18 Adv Half Plan.
Thank you!
that means that Monday would be your long run for the week, and Tuesday would be your bike intervals national with the brick run. Unless you can do the long run later in the week early in the morning before the meet starts, this seems like the best plan.
If you have an option to do the long run over the weekend, then I would make Monday your long swim day!
I hope that helps, let's plan on checking in during week 19...and good luck to your daughter.
Thank you so much for all your help and your advice. Also, thank you @Francis Picard, @Paul Curtin, @Gabe Peterson, @Doug Sutherland, @Larry Steinberg, @Sabra Gonzalez, @Jenn Edwards for all your kudos on Strava. You guys are major super stars!
I will be canceling my membership before the next billing hits, but as soon as I decide on my next race I will be back.
Cheers!
We will miss you! Remember you don't just have to cancel… You can go into maintenance mode which allows you to still stay connected to the team and have a basic training plan. It's an opportunity for you to still receive some guidance and support even when you aren't full on training.
Over the years we have found that even smaller levels of support consistently distribute across a year can Have A positive affect on your total progression as an endurance athlete.
if that interest you you're funny information under the my account tab at the top of the Endurance Nation members site. See you on GroupMe!
I'll definitely check out the maintenance mode, but for now I'm all focused on Saturday!
Have a good one!
You've had a great year so far given all the challenges, so let's wrap this up right!!
Swim - to be honest I was very pleased with that time considering not swimming in the outseason, being a pretty weak swimmer, and not swimming 8-9K/week. It was very choppy and chaotic as expected, but I felt strong and had no issues with the crazy waves (thank god all my OWS swims were in similar conditions). From my Garmin, I can see I lost some speed around 2 buoys where girls were in panic and just hanging on the buoy (poor things). I think I was kicking more than I should have, but I was trying to always get away from these groups of girls from previous ways (the slower ones who were going left and right).
Bike - way too excited to get on it. There were still a lot of bikes on the rack after my swim so I was a little surprised. I felt great. I started eating after 20mins and drinking. No issues at all. I kept passing a ton of people and was thinking if I should slow down. My HR was around 160 so I let it drop to 155 or so. It felt very comfortable. From my previous races I ride around 156 avg HR and then I can keep the run around 166 or higher (I know this seems high, but I have no explanation for that). Power was a tiny bit higher, but I was trying to use the "free speed" on the fast flats and then really watch it on the hills. I ate all my calories and salt pills on the bike as planned, but had to grab another bottle of gatorade since it was hot and I needed more. This bottle flew out so then I had to grab another one. I was pacing myself on the hills and I think that was executed well....I let crazy people pass me in a big gear shaking all over the place, yikes. The only thing that I have noticed closer to the end of my bike was that my left leg was having a slight pain from my glutes all the way to my knee. I've experienced this in my training, but I would always stretch it, roll it etc. Nothing major, but very annoying. It was just that annoying pain that caused me to move around the seat a bit. I was happy with my bike, but really did not want to start a half marathon after that, which made me think if I should have rather under-performed a bit.
Run - I really watched my HR here since this is where it was already pretty hot out there. I took the first 3 miles pretty easy and it felt comfortable. I thought to myself I could keep up this pace easily and then pick it up later. The first 6 miles I just stayed around 160 with my HR. I knew I would normally be able to push a little bit more, but my legs started to hurt a tiny bit around my hips. Not sure what that was about, but I just wasn't ready to push more than what I was running. HR-wise I think I could have pushed more, but the legs didn't think so. One big difference that I've never done in my other 3 races is that I stopped for a drink at every single mile and walked a bit. I know I lost some time there, but I had to drink. 2013 St. George and 2014 Mt. Tremblant were in May and Sep so definitely not as hot as August in Boulder. Also, 2014 Boulder was in June so I can't compare those two as far as the temperatures go. I was pouring water over my head after mile 6 and putting ice in my shirt at every mile. I kept chasing all the girls within my age group after mile 10 (checking out every calf for a number) and passed about 9 more, but I guess they were still on their first lap. The second time we hit the "small hill" I walked a bit as well and that's where my pace dropped quite a bit too. I picked it up a bit the last 3 miles, but I was just ready to be done. Only after I finished I realized my left leg hurt like crazy. Maybe that's what I was feeling when "my hips" were hurting and just didn't realize that was the same pain from the bike, but worse. I don't know if that had any impact or not, but the heat did for sure. And if I can run around 8:40 or so under 80 degrees I'm pretty happy with 9:28 pace in the heat.
Overall I'm very happy to be under 5:30 with this being my first race after 3 years. So much room for improvement, that's for sure
Let me know your thoughts!
When the heat is on it's easy for lots of little things to start to get in your way like your hips. I am very curious to hear about this left side pain when cycling in your glutes and how that translated to your run.
I do completely agree that the leg pain (or hips) will need some strength work. This is the same leg where I had my plantar fasciitis in 2014 so I think this year it's again some kind of an imbalance. Like I said, my HR was much lower on my run this year, but it's the legs that didn't want to push and I do believe this could have been the reason. But you don't think about where the pain is coming from during a race since you just want to keep going and are in denial of anything hurting. Since it hurt a lot after I was done I realized that I just pushed through it without paying much attention during the run.
I did have a retul bike fit done so that's good. My bottle only flew out since I ran over a train track super fast so that's not an issue, but thank you for addressing it.
I have decided to do another 70.3 on September 17, which is also in Boulder on a very similar course. I just want to see what I can tweak. I will take this week a little easier and then follow the same plan and see what happens.
Thank you!
* there's really not a lot of running to be done here. I will keep it mostly a TRP pace with some strides for speed. But you literally are almost supposed to start tapering it now so it's more about recovery and getting your stride back. Thoughts?
Thank you!
Run Durability Program is the way to go!!!
Thank you!
We can figure out a way to transition you through there, it’s more important that we focus on now and getting you into the best workouts, with the best recovery, etc. I hope that makes sense!
Thoughts?
Thank you!
My swimming has the most room for improvement. I could definitely use more speed and overall swim endurance. I'd love to find out how it feels to be chased after the swim leg versus me trying to chase everyone else. I'm confident in my bike and my run is also getting to where it used to be. My problem is also my constant ROI view where I don't see the swim portion as valuable as run/bike. I'd love to find that happy medium where I continue working on my bike/run, but am also investing time into my swim. And with family and kids' activities I will always lean towards bike/run.
Thank you!
Here's your updated Season Plan, as promised. This is where you'll return to post all your "coach" questions as responses; I'll see them and reply. This first post is my best outline of how to proceed with your races, but you can ask any / all questions you want. So post away, know that I reply here usually M/W/F each week.
Power User Tip: Click the Star icon by the Title of this thread to subscribe, and you'll get email updates when I do reply.
Your Races
Season Update
These are your recommended training plans, including the date you should start each one (sometimes you won’t complete a full plan but transition to another one). You can change your plans on the Training Plan page by clicking the Move / Change button. Learn more about each plan on the Training Plan Central Page.
Coach Notes
You are a bit behind in terms of the "plan" process, so you can jump into the OutSeason Plan using Level 2 workouts. We'll squeeze as much of that in as possible before we head over to the EN*Full Plan into Boulder. I am sure you'll have other races / events / trips, so please let me know here so I can take it all into account!
Let's get to work!
~ Coach P
I do have a few questions. Why do you think I'm a bit behind in terms of the plan process? Before I finally decided on the race I was doing the Run focus outseason and averaging between 30-40 miles of running per week and doing the bike workouts as planned. Also, why not jump into the EN Full Plan now - I am only assuming that the outseason will make me stronger/faster at this point? Would it also be beneficial to do one 70.3 before the full IM this year or there isn't really much time for that? Can I jump into some Level 3 workouts if I'm feeling good?
Thank you!