INPUT REQUESTED - Road to a sub 6 70.3 (it's long)
So I’ve decided that I’m tired of taking too much time off,
spending all my time in come back mode rather than getting faster. Below is my thinking on how I want to get
from a 15:42:49 in Lake Placid this year to a sub 6 hour 70.3. Thanks in advance for taking the time to read and comment on this long post. If you have limited time read the opening goals section, look at the block i-v to provide any macro comments then look at Block i in more detail.
Tell me I'm crazy, tell me what to do, where to go and how to do it. Just don't tell me it can't be done, well actually do that it will push me a little harder! In the end there are some definite challenges but I've got lots of time and will be pushing for the 5:59:59 until the taper. Then I need to be smart and race what I brought.
I'll follow up this thread with a mirco discussion with Coach P I just wanted to get the teams thoughts on this.
Goals for next year’s 70.3 in July are as follows:
Swim 42’ Bike 2:59:00 Run 2:10 - 8’ transitions
Swim 42’ = 2:13/100M
Bike 3 hours = 18.67MPH Calgary 70.3 has 870 feet of climbing so relatively flat compared to Lake Placid, numbers from 2017 below.
Run – 9’54” miles – a 42 VDot ~ 1:46 stand alone half, not sure this is fast enough but this leave a 24’ slower off the predicted stand alone ½ marathon at that VDOT. I know I should shoot for 43 or even 44 but from where I’m coming from 42 is a great improvement.
Current metrics from Lake Placid
IM swim 1:36:00 - lap one average 2:28/100M lap two average 2:31/100M;
3 - 1000M TT leading up to IM plan 25:07; 24:22 (2:26) and 24:30.
FTP 238 - weight 225lbs w/kg = 2.33 IM time 7:50:40 @.64 IF or 14.28mph. 55miles in 3:43:XX.
https://www.strava.com/activities/1109182614
Run – No VDOT IM run 6:01:32 = 13:48’ miles - ~2 hour 55’ to cover the first 13 miles at
Lake Placid.
https://www.strava.com/activities/1109182548
My one 1/2 IM in 2005 was in 7:08:07.
Questions for the crowd:
1) Should I do more of the focus work now pre OS or post 2018? That is NOS or JOS I’m leaning towards pre 2018 as I can follow up the JOS with the get faster plan (GFP) rather than worrying about trying to maintain a sport with a focus block pos OS. It’s also been some time since I’ve done any kind of single sport focus so should I do anything stupid I have time to recover/fix the problem I created.
2) Any thoughts or changes to big picture/training blocks?
3) Any direction for the specific training blocks, i.e. at a micro week level.
4) What type of swimming should I do for maintenance in the early weeks of the OS?
5) Is swimming 2X/week worth it or should I just redistribute this effort to cycling? I realize I should be getting more metres in the water but don’t always see the availability for that. Prior to October and after April perhaps as I tend to hit the pool before work with limited repercussions to family life.
Training Blocks
i)Aug 14-Oct 8th 8 weeks – Run focus (durability 4weeks /speed 4weeks) with a side of swim focus
ii) *Oct 9th-Dec 10th 9 weeks - More run durability/speed and a little less swim 2-3Xweek
iii) Dec 11-Jan 7th – 4 weeks pre OS
iv) **Jan 8th-April 29 - 14 weeks OS + 2 weeks swim camp
v) April 30 – July 22nd 2018 – 12 weeks as 5 GFP, 7 weeks ½ IM Plan which includes a flex week for family summer trip to the lake
*Note as of Oct 9th I go on parental leave and will be the primary caregiver of a 6 month old. Logistics may limit swimming at this point but I’m still looking in to this.
** April 9th 2018 back to work full time.
How do I get there:
Block i Aug 14-Oct 8th
Run focus, simply due to my rekindled joy for running I’m starting here. That is limited admin time and it will get me out the door.
Plan is to run 4-5X week 30-60’; swim 3-4X ~2500M bike 1X FTP/Vo2 work 60’.
Swim – Tue/Thus/ Sat/Sun Bike – Wed Run Mon/Tue/ Th/Fri/Sat
Run – My weekly mileage going in to LP was 20,21, 23 max so pick up around there trying to build to mid 20’s to close to 30 miles/ week. Weeks 1-4 mostly durability z1/z2 stuff with strides. One run some zn3, 10-15’ max. Weeks 5-8 I’ll incorporated more z4 running, like the old os workouts (3-4X.5 mile or 2-3X1 mile @z4). This would be once or twice a week (Mon/Sat). I’ve responded to this quite well to the zn4 run work in a couple OS’ I’ve come in to and could run. If I had to guess my VDOT is maybe 31-32. The plan is to do a test week in week 3 or 4.
End of block goal 34 VDOT – I’ve got 7-8 points in the OS previously with this kind of work. Oct 9th Turkey Trot would be ideal or just head out for a 5k test.
Swim 4X week with my target is 4 weeks of mostly drills 2500M per session like the week 11-15 OS stuff. I was seeing advances this year but as I lengthened out the workouts for my IM training my form broke down and I actually lost a little speed. 2nd 4 weeks, drills 2X and 2X more shorter speed stuff to keep form (50’s, 100’s, 200’s). One day would have a benchmark 6-X100’s.
Goal 1000M TT 2:20/100 after 4 weeks and 2:18 at completion. This might be a little aggressive particularly the 2:20 but we will see.
Bike – Just a dust off once a week to keep rolling, this is not make or break as I typically take 4-6 months off and I know the watts will come back. 60’ FTP something 8’(4’);10’(4’);8 (4’). Maybe every 3 or 4 week a Vo2 session 5X1’(1’) with some .8-.85 stuff.
If I need some additional family bandwidth I’ll drop the bike go down to 3, and 2 swim sessions per week. If I’m getting Z4 run work I’m okay dropping the bike for a few weeks totally.
Weight <220
Block ii Oct 9-Dec 10th
Note I’m on parental leave starting this weeks, swimming is manageable as they do have child care in hour blocks but this may limit my swimming to around 1500-2000M per session during the week and require SAU’s for 2X 1.5 hour weekend swims (2hours with admin time).
Run – more of the same 2-3X durability z1/z2 30-60’ and 2 sessions 60’ with z4 work (2X.5 mile, 1X 1 mile, 2X .5 (3’)) again similar to old OS workouts. Weekly structure like the previous block but I might be able to squeeze one longer run 90’ in here say on Friday. I will keep the mileage in the high 20’s and may slowly push than to low 30’s per week as speed increases.
Goal Dec 10th VDot 37
Swim 2-3X – Continue 2X drills 1 swim for 4 weeks then 1 drills and 2 swims. If at all possible squeeze in a 4th swim but may cut out of weekend swim
Goal 1000M TT 2:15/100
Bike – Again 1X week FTP with Vo2 every 3rd or 4th week. I’m getting less inclined to skip this particularly on the back end in Nov/Dec.
Weight <212
Block iii – pre os 4 weeks
If feeling good I’ll roll in to this with the intention of 3 weeks of pre-os work and one easy or down week so that I’m ready to push hard through the 14 weeks of the OS. If feeling tired I may take a week on either side and 2 weeks of pre-OS prep. The goal here is to get the bike on track 3X/week starting as close to last year’s high,238 as possible.
Weight <210
Block iv –OS and swim camp
Intermediate or Advanced plan, perhaps a mix with advanced bike and intermediate run. I’m not planning anything flashy just following the plan.
Goals
Swim – maintain 2:15/100 form for the 1000TT 2 X week 2500-3000M. Utilize the 2 week swim camp to kick start the swim.
Bike – FTP to 270 this is 10 points above my all time high of 260 and an aggressive target of 15% of 238. So come as fit as your 2017 self and hammer it.
Run
This is rare territory again as I’ve see a 38 VDOT several years back, I also weighed around 230-235 at the time so believe the goal below is doable. The key to making this easier is the weight loss and consistent workouts.
Goal VDOT 41
Weight <195
Block v –GFP 5 weeks as written
Goals Swim – 2:12 1000MTT, not sure I can hold this for a half but realistically not sure I can ask for more speed gains given my time in the pool.
Bike – FTP 275 W/kg 3.18
Run – VDOT 42
Weight 190.
This gives me 7 weeks ½ plan to consolidate the gains and get swim, bike and run stretched out to maintain my current speeds.
Comments
i am going to do a post in the OS about this, my times have dropped consistently with my weight.
2010 1 IM at 185
2011 2 IMs at 175
2013 NYC Mary at 156
2014 2 IMs at 156
2016 IMLP at 151
2017 IMLP at 147
I am 5'8 and was around 195 (down from 205) when I started training in 2010.
You have laid out a challenging schedule but doable IF you have been honest with yourself.
I personally would maintain a swim at least 3x a week throughout. Even a short 30' swim can be useful if you forgo drills and just do moderate to hard 50s and 100s (with short wu and cd). Even better if you could hit a masters swim once a week. I believe the importance of a good swim leg is understated for long course Tri.
be careful not to go down the injury/overuse path with the running. Make sure your easy runs are EASY and get niggles looked after straight way. With all that running you won't lose much on the bike. I wouldn't worry too much about maintaining or building FTP until late winter/early spring depending on when your race is.
1-a withrowesque slim down. I know YOU know what this means. STRICT diet, 2x a day protein shakes for breakfast & lunch, big ass salad with no cheese, red meat, bacon or anything silly on it for dinner, add a good piece of fish or chicken to top that salad. This alone will allow you to burn fat as fuel for the next 10 weeks. As much as the smart people here will tell you, fast for the 1st 2 hrs of long bikes. that means water and salt pills only, after 2 hours, normal sports drink. I am willing to bet $250 to my charity below that you can lose 15lbs between now and the race. I'll also buy you a steak in lake placid when you come to spectate next year
2-a new approach to body comp in the off season and a new "relationship" with food that gets you on the path to healthy livign (I will be doing this too and plan to lead a thread/ informal non-sanctioned challenge in the OS again.
a great thread on the topic was this one, add to it and revivie it!
https://endurancenation.vanillacommunities.com/discussion/comment/158071#Comment_158071
Here are my thoughts:
- Attitude: this is the starting point. You have to fully believe this is a primary goal in your life. Brody will thank you years later when he has a healthy, trim, long-lived father - start from there, and commit every day from now on to this and other goals you may create along the decades.
- Weight (euphemistically known as body comp): You must re-orient your relationship with food for the rest of your life. I;ve got no specific prescription, other than to say you are not on a diet, or a weight loss program; you are embarking on changing how GC eats FOREVER.
- Process, not Outcome: While having a specific time target for - what, Calgary '18 (I may be there racing with you!) - I believe it's best to look at not only improving the times of each leg, but also adopting the training and discipline needed to continually make improvements in each. EG, as Satish notes, swim throughout the calendar, 3x/week, even if for only 30 minutes. Run 5-6x/week, even if for only 5K at a pop. Hop on the trainer twice a week for short, hard intervals. Achieving those kinds of goals will help take your mind off the very daunting time reduction target you have out there. Just keep doing what needs to be done, and don't worry so much about how fast you are doing it; the speed will come with the weight loss and the training focus.
- Injury-Free: As the Great One might've said (I know Michael Jordan did), "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take". If you are not in the game, you can't affect the outcome. Don't overdo either volume or intensity in the ramp up in any sport, especially running. Patience, discipline, humility.
- Get Faster: No way around it...50s/100s in the pool, VO2 & FTP intervals on the trainer, and 200/400/800/1200 intervals on the track will significantly enhance your chances of going faster over longer distances. It's hard work, but it's also fun to watch the improvements week to week.
EN has a great suite of training plans; consultation with Coach P will help you link them in a logical way towards your goal.There is still an athlete in you wanting to come out; he showed up in Lake Placid, and is ready to take this on.
That's a nice project and pretty sure this team will support you all the way in it. I am not one of those WSM
1) The swim: I dont know if the logistic is complicated for you to get to the pool but if yes, I would look into all the out of the pool wkout you can find in the differents plans within EN. If you are lucky as I am and the pool is 3 doors from your house, then I suggest you go to the pool, thats good workout that will help keep the injuries away.
2) Weight: I dont know what's your height, but your actual weight is the same as when I got back into sports 5 years ago and now I am around 145-165 depending the moment in the year, for me I am really sensitive to alcohol and I love wine soooo much, we were drinking 2-3 bottles of wine per week end, dunno if thats something to look for you ? I know alot of people are sensitive to alcohol. We are now to a bottle per 2 weeks, the bottles can keep aging in the cellar, so we now have that pleasure
3) Attitude: never seen it the as @Al Truscott mentioned but dont understimate this, our daughters love our active lifestyle and they embrassed it, you can help your kid have good life fondation - that should be a great motivation for you !
4) Run durability: start it early, thats one of the best plan you can find within EN, it takes time but from what I've seen of your training you seem really patient.
Keep us posted while embarking into this journey ! I am confident you can do it
@Satish Punna I will definitely work towards the 3X swim workouts and the point is noted on running injury overuse. If needed I plan to step back for a week is needed.
@Jeff Kane There is a common thread of weight and I know its an issue and a limiter. I had considered a run durability challenge of 60 or so days as I've got about 30 weeks of running from the IM, OS and pre os work. As I'm stepping down to 1/2 next year I'll use this block to pick up some speed then move in to the OS and GFP to build more durability. Perhaps block i should be all durability, then move in to some speed work 1/2 times a week in block ii. This will definitely be a discussion I have with Coach P but other's are welcome to chime in.
@Scott Dinhofer Weight is the issue. Honestly I should be around 170 or less. At 25 I was competing at 160 so 20 years later I believe I can get there, with 170 being no issue and 180 is a fat 6 foot triathlete. So there's still work to do even at 190 I listed above. With concerted effort 15lbs can be lost. We will see about spectating at LP next year. I need the healthy living, even the 30 lbs I lost this year was not really clean.
@Al Truscott Spent 12-14 year as a dance pair and also singles competition. I made it further in Dance qualifying for nationals three times.
Attitude - I agree this is a starting point and I just need to be consistent for more than 1/2 a year.
Weight - as mentioned above I do need to re-orient my food choices as I can lose weight and still eat not good. Process, not outcome - I'm okay failing while giving it my best effort the sub hour is supposed to be a tough goal. I'll be setting a series of smaller goals to guide me on my way.
Injury-Free - I'll definitely re-evaluate the run intensity and be watching the volume. I'll have no issues taking a step back week, where I shut things down drastically should issues arise. I did this 3 times over the OS and IM plans for running in particular.
Get Faster - I'm much for akin to doing the faster stuff, I just need to get my body in a position to be able to absorb the level of training. I particularly like Vo2 work on the bike and shorter run intervals. I utilized the 50'/100's in the pool more this year.
@Francis Picard The Swim - It's not really complicated to get to the pool, I'm just so dam slow that 2500-3000M with admin time 25-30 minutes, driving and changing is over to 1.5 hours. An IM length workout 3500-4000M I'll have 1:20-1:of pool time.
Weight - I'm 6'0" (183 CM) so getting to <180 should not be an issue. Honestly if I was a super fit triathlete I figure 155-160 would be my wheelhouse, so 170-175 would be good place to target.
Attitude- As a late coming to the father scene (45) I just want to be able to keep up for a few years. When Brody's 15 I'll be 60 so..
Run Durability - Maybe I'm incorporating too speed work too soon. I know consistency will get me a long way something I've lacked in my almost 8 years at EN.
I like your detailed plan and echo all the above comments. The hardest part is starting, which your doing as you build off of LP fitness. The second hardest part, IMO, is sticking to your plan/schedule when life gets in the way. Most people stop exercising when life gets busy so, having a plan to ramp back on workouts is smart.
4 things.
1. find a tri-focus swim coach for swim lessons. Improving technique comes first. Have you submitted your swim video to the Critique My Swim Thread in the EN Forums?
2. Run durability is king...follow the EN run durability plans; no need to recreate the wheel. Run endurance fitness carries over to swim and bike. Agree with swimming 3x/week during the off season.
3. Recommend including how each day will be structured, IOW, write/schedule when each wko will take place. E.g. Monday: AM swim, lunchtime run 3 miles. This helps me.
4. Keep it fun. Find a running group and swim squad/Masters swim. Great for the social aspect and keeps you accountable. Speaking of accountability, how will you stay accountable?
as per Derrek's comments above, lifestyle is the key. I like the swim 3x a week year round, but that may not be achievable, 2x per week is in the winter. Define what time period that is. The ONE that Tim got me on was run 30 miles per week year in and year out. This is the biggest definer for body comp. PM me your address, I am sending you the gift of "born to run" if you haven't read it. Look at me, after six months of running focus, I am a runner... my best place in AG at LP was my run in relation to the overall AG and I won a local half mary on Saturday...
al's comments on food are best, it's about your "relationship" with food. Lots of resources here in the house to learn where to go and how.. But eat foods that fill you up with the least caloric content and the most nutritional benefit.
I started racing over 6 years ago, mostly sprints. Two years ago I decided to do my first 70.3 and last year my first two attempts at full distance. IMCA with a time of 15:31:42 and IMAZ with 15:20:24. I had some health issues for both races but that doesn't explain the times. After IMAZ I knew something had to change if I wanted to get better at this. I was happy that I could finish the races but I was destroyed with nothing left in the tank and not satisfied with the performance. So much time training, so much commitment but something wasn't there yet.
I issued the 45 IM distances for my 45th birthday challenge this year as a motivation to be more consistent with training. It has helped but more important, I have focused on every session I do. I want to get something out of it. If I am spending the time to do it, lets do it right.
I decided to race Victoria 70.3 this year with no time goal; instead I focused on execution (you can take a peak at my race report if you want to). Part of it was body composition. I lost 10 lbs since the beginning of the year up till race day. Not a diet, just a change in the way I eat.
For Victoria, I never set a time limit, but did set execution goals: 1. Every stroke counts on the swim so stay focused and keep form; 2. Stay in your watts on the bike: very hard for me since this is the only part that I'm competitive at, but managed to do so. I had to exert extreme discipline and avoid chasing the people who passed me at some point; 3. Run the run: I have never been able to run the run. I always end up walking more than half of it.
I managed to execute as planned. I hit all the execution goals and it felt pretty good. Didn't break the 6 hour mark (6:14:41), but that didn't matter because the plan was properly executed.
After that race I have raced three local sprints getting 4th, 2nd, and 3rd on my AG. Never in my wildest dreams should I ever thought I would be on a podium (even in small races like this ones). I was always at the end of the group and it feels good to be on top. Still a lot of work before thinking on an IM top 20 in my AG but one day will come.
All of this is just to say that the time goal might not be that important and you could set up yourself for frustration even if you come at 6:01:00 because it will seem that you didn't hit your goal. Anything can happen on this races, you might get a flat, or another mechanical on the bike that can derail your time so focus on execution; set execution goals and if by the end of the race you are happy with your execution, you win regardless of the time on the clock.
Good luck