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NovOS Week 10 - Bike thread

Sheila LeardSheila Leard
in General Training Discussions
Test week! #10.

We've arrived to another week of creating benchmarks. Not all of us will test the run and bike. I personally can't put that strain on my legs yet. 

For the Zwift riders I read in their blog that you can get a pretty good look at your FTP wen doing a race. 

Coach P also has in the plan if you are not testing than just do last weeks intervals. "Work is Work".

Okay Nov OS Peeps - we're charging ahead with only 4 weeks to go! 

Have fun testing! And I hope you have clear skies to enjoy today's Super Moon. Happy New Year!!


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Comments

  • Shaughn SimmonsShaughn Simmons
    Happy New Year!  Thx @Sheila Leard

    3 X 10' for me this morning.  Tested about 10 days ago and got a brand new shiny FTP.

    .95, .96, .97 was a challenge when 300 watts is .95 and you ran 41+ miles last week......

    https://www.strava.com/activities/1337284769

    Time to pull up our Big Boy pants for we are in Week 10.

    SS
  • Al TruscottAl Truscott
    edited January 2, 2018 8:55PM
    I'm starting Week 8 of my disjointed OS...I don't count the two weeks I went not-skiing in early Dec, although I did slide on man made snow for 4 days, and swam and ran a bit then as well.

    But today, I'm taking the day "off", which means I canceled the morning's planned swim and will only do short 20-30 minute recovery ride and run this PM. While I can tell full well I need this just from how I feel, the PMC in WKO4 tells the tale:



    A lot of data here. At the top, the two #s on the left in Red are key. While my TSB is "only"  minus 33, the Ramp, or rate of rise of my Acute Training Load over the past 7 days, is 8.7, more than double what I normally would do. The small #s immediately above the graph are from yesterday; subtracting the ATL from the CTL gives this morning's TSB. On a positive note, my Time To Exhaustion is 54 minutes, pretty good even for mid-season. Note in the graph that 2.5 weeks ago, my TSB was at + 32, so it has been a sustained significant rise in daily workload since I got back. While I stopped my run streak @ 94 days, I've still been doing a fair amount of running, 5-6 x/week, and have done a lot of extra credit Zwift rides, along with swimming 50 minutes 3 x/week.

    I post this as a reminder to myself, and others, that 8-10 weeks into the OS is when a lot of people start to step up to and occasionally over the edge of excessive training, which is easy to do when focusing on higher intensity. Then we wonder why we can't keep doing workouts at the same effort level, or why our testing shows a decrease, not an increase in FTP or VDOT. Since I did increase my FTP by 4% on Sunday, and have a 5K VDOT test coming up on Saturday, I want to make sure I can sustain and take full advantage of the OS work. So, better to step back for a day than plow ahead at this point.
  • Shaughn SimmonsShaughn Simmons
    edited January 2, 2018 4:56PM
    @Al Truscott - great timing for a coaching session on the value of the PMC chart.  Thank you for taking the time to lay it out there for all of us.

    One thing we all naturally try to do is to compare to others.  It is human nature, but the devil is always in the details.  The amount of work you or another is doing on the Strava leaderboard is always relative to your fitness level or your CTL.  The resulting fatigue load or TSB which is CTL less ATL has a lot to do with your CTL.  Those with a higher CTL can manage more load and run with a more positive TSB because they can carry more training or ATL than those with a lower fitness level or CTL.  This morning my TSB was a +6 with a 124 ATL given I have a 135 CTL.  I did nothing but run 4 miles yesterday which helped.  The downside to a high CTL is, "Do you really want to carry a 100+ CTL and the work required to maintain that for a long time?"  Or, is it more wise to have a buildup over time which peaks at your "A" race?  I would argue the latter is more sustainable and wiser.........  I just enjoy the training for the most part.


  • Sheila LeardSheila Leard
    @Al Truscott  Such a good reminder to chill out.

    You pulled off a lot with adding in Christmas! That's a big ramp rate. I also have a disjointed hybrid OS. My focus is to be better at RDP. When I do too many Zwifts I get sucked in and my legs don't feel good to run. I need a new bike fit because I'm getting too much knee pain after riding which makes running difficult.

    I'm starting three rounds of Synvisc injections this week. I've got residual knee injuries that keep me from running hard.  I just need to run slow and consistent. The glute activation exercises are also key. It's humbling,  but better than not running at all. I like your previous idea of getting intensity training on the bike and hopefully that transfers over to the run. 

    @Shaughn Simmons Your durability and consistency is commendable.
  • Sheila LeardSheila Leard
    @Al Truscott  @Shaughn Simmons .... thanks.

    Be Patient not a Patient ... Alberto Salazar. My A race is in 22 weeks. I need to remember that. It's so easy to chase bigger Ramp rates and CTL!

    I like the advice here and Alan Couzens is smart.
    https://www.alancouzens.com/blog/CTLramp.html


  • Mark MooreMark Moore
    Ride test done. It sure feels good when it is over, but do I hate it when I'm riding. I used Zwift and the week 10 FTP test. The program told me what power to ride at for each interval. I am assuming that is based on my FTP and the recommended % over that to shoot for. When I hit the 20min test it said to ride at 210. So, I just tried to keep over that without killing my self. I ended with an average 216 and a new FTP of 205. That is up from 190. I think things are on track. Run Test tomorow. This will be my first real run test the one I used to set my TRP was 5 mile run and hopefully slower than what I can do on a 5k.

    Love reading everyones posts. Even when I don't understand some of the technical talk, but I am learning.

    Thanks for the support and keep up the good work everyone!
  • Sheila LeardSheila Leard
    @markmoore Are you using Training Peaks? Good explanations on all the technical stuff on their site.

     Good work Devil Dog. My Hubs is a former Marine - :) Semper Fi. 


  • Shaughn SimmonsShaughn Simmons
    @markmoore - strong work getting the testing done!  Keep leading!
  • Shaughn SimmonsShaughn Simmons
    Rough 24 hours here trying to balance work issues.  Could not fall asleep until ~ 1 a.m. while I solved a few problems in my head last night.  I am sure you have all been there.  Got up early but then had to cover a few bases.  Finally made it to a Zwift Volcano race at 8:05 a.m. CST after a 30 min WU.  Complete two of three laps with the lead "A" group then had to call it.  Came up with 1 X 34' @ .94 which is much better than logging a big zero....still fighting here...

    https://www.strava.com/activities/1340470111

    SS
  • Mark MooreMark Moore
    @sheilaleard thanks for the info. I don't, but my wife does so I have to get her to help me check it out.
  • Shaughn SimmonsShaughn Simmons
    Friday morning FTP work on Zwift: https://www.strava.com/activities/1341966957

    Definitely would not have made that happen today without the Zwift wko push....

    Have a great weekend all!

    SS
  • Mark ThomaMark Thoma
    Been a bit off the grid with some late OS wear and tear.  This is my first OS (first serious consistent training of any sort) in a while.  A cold, Christmas week (and all its indulgences), a birthday, and that massage really set me back.  I tried the bike test over the weekend and after I killed the 5 kin test I bombed the 20 min.  So I took a few days off and let the CTL drift. Relaxed on the diet and am diving back in. 

    5k Test moved me from a VDOT of 40.2 to 41.5. I’m down in San Diego this weekend with my son for a lacrosse tournament but brought my bike. Got a good hilly run yesterday and a gorgeous 2 hour ride today. Will ride again tomorrow w a run on Sunday. 

    Im a little bummed I lost some fitness and put a few pounds on, but the reset was needed. 

  • Gary LewisGary Lewis
    Took this week off because my back has been hurting since last Sunday.  I think it was the biking on Zwift last Saturday that did it.  I don't like the fact that I can't see the elevation profile in Zwift, so on a smart trainer, its like riding your bike up a wall with no warning.  Very hard on your body.  I need to figure that out.

    I did my usual volunteer work yesterday hiking water 8.5 miles to an aid station for the Xterra trail race with my Boy Scout Troop.  I'm going to race the 7K this morning, then play a golf tournament (my previous sport before Tri).  Lets see how my back feels after that.  I'm ready to get back to training next week, if my back cooperates.

    On the weight management side, I did manage to escape Nov and Dec at the same weight as I started, so that's a win.

    @Al Truscott is WKO worth the money or does the current TP website provide the same info?  What is the major benefit?
  • Al TruscottAl Truscott
    @Gary Lewis I've never used Training Peaks Premium. I was using WKO earlier versions on a PC, but being a Mac ecosystem person since 1984, that was problematic. So when my little PC died and WKO4 came out for Mac, I went all in there for continuity. What I like and don't like about it is the ability to make literally any mash-up of my data that I want - lots of flexibility, but very poor in terms of teaching how to use that flexibility. Also, I have a thing about wanting to keep my data under my own control (not a privacy freak, just someone who doesn't always have easy access to the internet), and also not paying a monthly subscription fee forever, just to play with my own data. WKO was pay once, and it's mine.

    There is a small elevation profile in Zwift, at the bottom of the mini-map in the upper right corner? At least on the tablet and computer versions I use.

  • Gary LewisGary Lewis
    @Al Truscott I haven't tried TP premium.  I agree 100% on the understanding and utilization of the mounds of data I keep collecting.  I do learn a lot from you WSMs on here.  Normally I would agree with having my own data, but with Garmin automatically syncing it to my Connect, Strava, TP, etc it does make things nice.

    The Zwift elevation profile is so small on my laptop screen that it doesn't provide enough visible info.  They consume a ton of screen space with stuff I don't care about.  A strip on the bottom would be great.  With the smart trainer on Zwift and I have also tried Rouvy, its like hitting a brick wall on resistance.  I'm not sure if its just my Elite trainer or if they are all like that, but its tough on my back.  Since I'm not an experienced roadie, Zwift doesn't wow me that much.  Virtual riding with ENers does interest me, since its better than doing all of my training solo, so I keep testing the waters.  If I tweak my back again, I will be done with it.
  • Al TruscottAl Truscott
    Gary Lewis said:
    ...With the smart trainer on Zwift and I have also tried Rouvy, its like hitting a brick wall on resistance.  I'm not sure if its just my Elite trainer or if they are all like that, but its tough on my back.  ...Virtual riding with ENers does interest me, since its better than doing all of my training solo, so I keep testing the waters. ...
    @Gary Lewis Don't know about Rouvy, but in Zwift, you can alter the sensitivity of the resistance in the smart trainer to the terrain changes. (This option won't appear if you are in "Erg Mode".) Access that when in the game, out on the road, via the Menu button. Then, lower right, the Settings (gears) button brings up a screen with a slide bar for "Trainer Difficulty". I keep mine about 45% (closer to the left than the right). You can play with it when you are on a hill, and find out what works best for you. I shift gears on longer and steeper climbs, but no longer come to complete stops in my smallest gear.

    The multi-player nature of the Zwift game is what attracts me as well, whether it's riding with people I already know, of don't know at all. I think as social beings, we just perform better (or at least try harder) when we think we're being watched.

  • Shaughn SimmonsShaughn Simmons
    Happy Wednesday NOV OS'ers!

    Travel/work this week so rented a bike for the hotel room and brought my trainer in my suitcase.

    Forgot my PT pedals so am using zPower (not accurate) and primary metric is HR/RPE.

    Tuesday V02: https://www.strava.com/activities/1348337994

    This morning Z2/Z3 work: https://www.strava.com/activities/1349961025

    Some pics of my hotel rm set up in the first link......not ideal but better than logging a zero.

    Hotel TM has no fan......brutal.

    Keep plugging all!

    SS
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