New multi-purpose wheelset for road bike - Considering Zipp 202s or Zipp 303s. Thoughts?

Patrick Marsh

I am in the market to buy new road-bike wheels and am looking for recommendations. 

Bike:
- I have an old road-bike frame (2012 Giant Defy) with high-end components (Campagnola drive-train and brakes).  My current Mavic Kysyrium wheels are ready for retirement.  

New Wheel Criteria:
- I want to buy an "all-around" wheel-set that I can keep when I eventually upgrade my bike frame.  
- Ideally, I want to get wheels that are light, aerodynamic and durable enough for everyday use. 
- The terrain around my house is filled with short, punchy climbs and there are lots of rollers.  There are shortcuts with dirt/gravel.  Occasionally, I drive to where there are long climbs.  Wind is rarely an issue.  
- I mainly use my road bike for group rides with friends, as well as for centuries, fondos and maybe one hometown race a year.  In April, I am doing Battenkill, which consists of 75 miles of steep hills and long dirt/gravel sections.  The dirt roads are very bumpy, but it is not a cyclocross course.  
- Usage will probably by 1-1.5k miles per annum.  (I ride my TT to prepare for triathlons and my Kickr gets a lot of use because the winters are long in Connecticut.)

Potential Choices:
- After doing some homework, I am coming down to Zipp 202s v. Zipp 303s.  The 202s are ostensibly climbing wheels, so they are light.  However, the reviews indicate that they are stiff, stable in the wind, durable and aerodynamic.  The 303s are more aerodynamic and similarly stiff and durable.  The price difference is not significant.  
- Both are compatible with a Campy cassette, which is A hating item. 
- On my TT bike, I have Zipp 404s, which have been great.  Thus, I am inclined to buy Zipps again. 
- Over the past week, I have also done research on Reynolds, Hed and Enve.  But I am ending up with Zipps at the top of my list.  

Mike Westover

Flo 45 might be another option to consider, at half the price of the Zipps.

Stephen Cogger

I second Flo. I got some a few years ago and they have been great. My only experience with Zipps was with a rental in a thunderstorm at IMLP, but I do believe my Flos are just as good.

John Withrow

I race triathlon on either Zipp FC808's or an 808/disc combo.  I like their wheels.

I recently got a good deal on a used set of 303's and am very happy with them.  They are a great "All Arounders" and give you decent aero effects if you're alone or in a break-away, but are also fairly light for climbing.  202's are even a bit lighter, but you give up a bit more of the aero.

A set of 202's would also compliment your 404's as the differences between each increment are actually quite small, so there really isn't an exact right or wrong answer.  I just personally like the slightly deeper 303's, but I have no good rationale other than they look cooler.

Any of the wheels will be fine for Battankill (which is an awesome race).  You'll see people on everything from Ksyriums to 202's, 303's and 404's...  I'd argue that lighter is better than aero in that race as aero means much less in the group (you should never ever be closer to the front than 4th wheel anyways).  And there are a few killer climbs.

Paul Hough

When I had my last bike built I selected every component.  I made my wheel choice based on an article that evaluated all-around wheels.  The 303s FC were the absolute best.  I chose the Dura Ace C35s which won the "best alternative" rating because I wanted aluminum rims tor technical descending.  Here is the article with the evaluations: https://intheknowcycling.com/2015/05/01/best-all-around-road-bike-wheels-2015/#Zipp 

That article has been updated and the 303 NSW is now the best performer for all around wheels.  https://intheknowcycling.com/2017/03/14/zipp-303-nsw-all-around-best-road-bike-wheels/

Brian Quarton

 Consider trickling the 404's down and getting new race wheels (maybe 303 NSWor 404 NSW)? You are a triathlete. Why take your newest stuff out to train with? Fell free to ignore this free opinion.

Patrick Marsh

@Mike Westover and @Stephen Cogger - I forgot about Flo wheels.  One of my friends in my town uses them on his TT bike and raves about them.  I did some homework, and they offer a lot of value for the money.  Do they brake well?  That will be important to me given what I want to use these for.  If I don't go with a Flo now, I think when I get a rear disc wheel, I will go with Flo.  Here is a good article on the new Flo wheels:  http://aerogeeks.com/2016/03/01/flo-cycling-2016-wheel-line-first-look/    I could pay for new Vector 3 pedals from what I could save from buying Flo wheels versus Zipps.  

@John Withrow and @Paul Hough - Thanks for feedback.  It does look like the 303s are the better value relative to the 202s.  The 303s seem to be the best reviewed road-bike wheels out there.   Here is a comprehensive review for the Zipps: http://www.zipp.com/_media/productreviews/VeloSept14[1].pdf   

@IMBQMD - You raise a good point about the tri-bike.  However, I spent most of 2017 getting my tri-bike set up with a hub-based Powertap meter and new drive train.  I don't want to rock that boat just yet.  Also, I am not sure that 404s are good for dirt roads and gravel.

Thanks for all the feedback.  So far, it looks like the 303s are the best all around wheel, and will retain their value if I need to sell them.  However, if I can find something significantly cheaper that is as well-rounded as the Zipps, I will have to give them a serious look.  

I am almost done with my homework, and will post when I pull the trigger.  

Patrick Marsh

I am doing my homework on the braking performance for Flo wheels.  While I do that, here is the other set of wheels that are in contention: 2018 Reynolds Assault.  These wheels score on par with the Zipp 202s.  But the Zipp 303s score better, but are $700 more expensive.  Ho  wever, I am sure that the 303s will retain their value better.

https://www.feedthehabit.com/gear-reviews/2018-reynolds-assault-slg-carbon-wheelset-review/  

Mike Westover

@Patrick Marsh I have 3000+ miles on my Flo 30s (which have an aluminum brake track), much of that on hills and in the rain, and I’ve been very happy with the braking. The 45 is all carbon, but Flo says they get similar braking to aluminum using their proprietary brake pads. 

One thing to consider is is that same-brand wheel sets may make it easier to swap race wheels on and off. I think all the Flos have similar brake track positioning and angles, and the Zipps may be similar. So no need to adjust the pads each time. 

John Withrow

It depends on how big of a hurry you're in, but I think I paid $900 for my set of 303s.

Here's a set for more than that, but substantially less than new...  https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/202195002440

scott dinhofer

@Patrick Marsh - just built my dream road bike last year. have to look up what I did, but I went with the Enve 2/3 (or was it 1/2) they do the rear wheel as a slightly deeper profile than the front. mine are probably a 202 1/2 and a 303 by comparison. the 3/4 wasn't right as it looked like the 404s which are too deep for a road bike. same for the Flo 45s.. poke around the groups on facebook (online swap meet & Tri'n sell it) as well as ST, you;ll likely find a good value as @John Withrow did. 

Dave Campbell

Love my 202's.  Bought them mainly for climbing.  Probably would go 303's if I had it to do over.  Had Wheelbuilder do a custom build on Chris King Hubs.  They are the bomb!  Have had no braking problems running the Swiss Stop Black Prince pads recommended by Wheelbuilder.

Jorge Duque

@Patrick Marsh, I don't know how much you weight but that should be included in you analysis. I am on the heavier side of the equation at @200+ lbs so max weight is something I have to look for also.

According to your criteria you need a bomb proof, all terrain wheel. In my personal experience Mavic is the best all rounder bomb proof wheel. I use Cosmic for my rain/commuter bike, Ksyrium for my road bike, and another set of Cosmic for training rides on the tri bike. Never had a problem with them.

I used to have an old set of Sram S40's and gave them away since they gave me so much trouble. Still racing with Sram S80's but looking to upgrade those.

Patrick Marsh

@Dave Campbell - The 202s look like terrific wheels - light, aero and durable.  
@Jorge Duque - Thanks.  I have used Mavics for the past six years and love them.

Thanks to everyone for the advice.  I ended up buying Flo 45s 

http://www.flocycling.com/wheels_front_flo_45_cc.php

These seem comparable to the 303s with respect to weight (the Flo 45s are ~100 grams lighter at 1537 grams), and rim depth (~45 mm).  However, it looks like the Zipp 303s would be more durable and aero.
 
What led me to buy the Flos were the solid reviews and lower price.  The Flo 45s were ~$1,200 for the wheelset, versus $2,300 for the Zipps.  However, the Zipp 303s were consistently the best reviewed road bike wheels that I could find. Nevertheless, I am sure that losing five pounds would be more beneficial than the marginal gains the Zipp 303s would provide.   

Also, I ended up using my budgeted cash to buy a pair Assiomo Duo power-meter pedals.  To the point made @Brian Quarton [OLD] , we are all trying to be faster triathletes here.  The power-meter pedals should improve my riding efficiency and help me stick to my training plans when I cannot ride my tri-bike and am on my road-bike.  Here's a review of the pedals from DC Rainmaker: 

https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2017/09/favero-assioma-in-depth-review.html

Good luck with everyone's gear choices.  Once it gets warmer here in the Northeast, I will post to this thread to let people know how the new wheels and power-meter pedals are.