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swim seeding thoughts

Hi all, just wanted to get peoples thoughts on where to appropriately seed oneself for a rolling swim start.  I'll be doing Boulder and lets just say swimming is a supreme weakness.  Literally was last in the water during my attempt (failed 2/2 slow swim) at Ironman 70.3 Placid.  on the one hand thought to once again seed in the very back (while better, still thinking i'm looking at best at a 2hr swim) alternately, thought to seed 1 group higher kinda as a pacer to not let me drift to much on pace and as a way to maybe use "group energy" to keep me going hopefully at a rate that gets me out of the water in a time that allows me to continue the quest!


???
any thoughts appreciated.
NP
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Comments

  • The swim is where drafting is legal. So, you should try and get on the toes (or hip) of a slightly faster swimmer than you.
  • I agree with what Peter said, but...

    Seeding in the next to last group is okay because those will be swimmers who are a bit faster than you but not the super aggressive types.  Draft as much as you can and use them to motivate you to keep pushing and obviously stay on toes whenever you can. But also swim your own swim, try to relax and if you're in clean water, just keep swimming.  Sight often (even if you are following others) because swimming off course will cost you a ton of extra time and wasted energy.  

    There is a limit to the above however...  Do NOT seed yourself in the front groups with the really fast swimmers.  If you do this, you will get mauled as the super fast type-A people continually swim right over top of you.  And you will be just catching your breath as the medium fast swimmers also swim right over top of you.
  • As a lifelong poor swimmer, I can tell you that mas starts and getting run over on the swim are one of the more traumatic things to happen to me :).  I will always give away some time on the swim to feel more comfortable and reduce stress.

    For me, it's more important to avoid most contact, so regardless of how I seed myself, I always swim slightly wider than the main pack.  It's free and clear typically.  I'll also swim wide around the buoys.

    I've found the seeding times to be pretty good at the last few races, so if you are a 1:20 swimmer, pick a spot right around that time.  Poor swimmers should never get aggressive on assessing swim times in my opinion.  It only adds unnecessary stress.
  • Last summer at HIM Maine, Ironman had a self seeded rolling start and literally it was like swimming in a washing machine! There is no way to tell who swims at what pace you literally have to just guess. I seeded in the middle to back of the pack and still got swam over, kicked and people just swam really close the entire way. I suggest just going in knowing it could get a little crazy, stay wide, hold your own, focus on the buoys, and try your best to relax and enjoy it.  This type of swim will go by super fast!! Enjoy it and relax you got it :) 
  • As pointed out you don't want people swimming over you and honestly as a 1:30 IM swimmer I don't want to be holding faster swimmers up.  Having said that if you are on the edge of a DNF moving to the front of the last or second last group could get you a few extra minutes to finish the swim.  You have 2:20 after the last swimmer enters the water.  So if you can handle some possible contact or just start a little wider on the first leg I'd say move up a little to get yourself 5-10 extra minutes.

    Not having done boulder I've never found the swim too bad in the 1:30 finish time at Lake Placid or Canada.

    Note Tom Glynn's warning about being aggressive and adding in stress.   It won't help if you get out of rhythm and have to grab a kayak.

  • In addition to where to start (I agree with others to start just ahead of the 2:00 group), is the imperative to keep both your mind and effort under control in the first 5-10 minutes of the swim. There is a LOT of energy from the swimmers around you, and it's very easy to fall in with that. You must learn to totally ignore all that energy and effort and thrashing around of others and just swim YOUR RACE, not someone else's. There are no prizes for beating the guy beside you to the next buoy...
  • Thanks all for the input: seems like it'll be front of last group (unless really small then I'll move up to back of second to last) and staying a little wide. And to Al's point, the last race I did the first 5-10 minutes were nuts and spent to first 500meters convinced I was just going to drown.. wasn't until bouy turn that things started settling down and by that time It was as good as a lost cause...Goal for this race is to finish (first race) and really don't want to let the day be over before a good fight on the run appreciate all the help on this albatross....
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