Incorporating EN plans into TrainingPeaks ATP/season plan and managing TSS/CTL
Bit of background - I'm just starting my second season being back in triathlon. Last season I did RDP, followed by Jan OS, and then the HIM bike focus plan leading up to 70.3 CdA. I logged my data in TrainingPeaks but didn't really manage my training at all using TP data. I basically followed the 'prescription' as outlined in the EN plans (to the best of my ability).
Now that I'm entering my second season, I'm wondering if/how I could get a bit more sophisticated in how I manage weekly TSS, ramp rates, and target CTL. I've read some of the TP articles on their "ATP" functionality and tried creating an ATP in TP using a target weekly TSS. However, it generates a generic annual plan that doesn't really align with the EN plans I'll be using in the coming season (RDP, Nov OS, HIM plan). I don't see a way to import plans from Final Surge into Training Peaks, so I'm wondering if it's worth the effort to manually create the workouts as outlined in FS in TP and then modify them (tweak time and IF) to target a particular weekly TSS? Or is there some other better way to be going about this?
Thanks,
John
Comments
This seems to be two topics...Using the TrainingPeaks ATP function; and using the TP Performance Management Chart (PMC, which incorporates ATL, CTL, TSS, ramp rate.) I'll focus just on the first for now, as the other is, well, a whole other topic IMO. My observations and opinion:
For the past 10+ years, the EN Coaches have been annually refining the EN training plans, paying particular attention to the progression of work from week to week, and the impact on a daily basis of the exact order of workouts. Conclusion...you already have an Annual Training Plan which has been vetted, tested, and repeatedly refined. You don't need to complicate your life by trying to cross check it in Training Peaks. If you do the work in the order prescribed, and at the level indicated, you will find using the PMC that your metrics like ATL, CTL, TSS, and ramp rate all change within a reasonable range. Do extra credit workouts (harder, longer, more often), and you'll find your ramp rate getting too high, your TSB getting too low, and your body heading towards over-training. Shirk your work, and the numbers won't look very good.
My conclusion: I'm paying EN big bucks to do my thinking for me, so I don't have to worry about whether my ATP is progressing properly...
@Al Truscott Thanks for the reply! You make some very valid points. It's entirely possible (in fact probable) that my question comes from a lack of understanding of what is a 'reasonable' ramp rate to expect at various points in the season, and whether it's by design that there's a net zero or negative ramp in some phases. There's no question that when I'm in the big blocks of training in the HIM plan, for example, that the plan is pushing me about as hard as I can be pushed, and the ramp rate and CTL data shows that. There have also been points in some plans, such as RDP for example, where run CTL is ramping slightly but bike and overall CTL is dropping, and that's worrisome to see at face value. It may be entirely by design, so again it may just be unreasonable expectations on my part, but it's tempting to want to throw in an extra bike ride and swim or two to keep CTL moving in the right direction. So, being able to see the 'big picture' (i.e., having the various plans mapped out in TP and seeing the overall effect on CTL across the season) might provide some level of comfort.
That's not to say that I don't trust the coaches or the plans, it's just that it seems to me that some of these variables and their effect on TSS/CTL are somewhat dependent on each individual's current fitness. You and I could do the same effective workout (i.e., same TSS) and my CTL may go up while yours goes down because you're already more fit than me. CTL is just a 42-day weighted avg. of TSS's, so if your CTL is 100 and mine is 50, a workout with a TSS of 75, for example, will drop your CTL, while it will raise mine.
So, this is all a long and convoluted way of getting back to my main question, which is - is there guidance on what's a reasonable expectation of CTL ramp rate in the various blocks of training?
I think @John Katsoudas , the answer here is don't expect to start an EN training plan or any other for that matter without having built a base beforehand. I am recovering from an accident, starting from zero and have goals in mind that will allow me to begin the November OS. I am essentially trying to bike 3x per week and run 5-7x per week, with a ramp of mileage goals.
When I get to the OS and begin the workouts, I know from my past experience that i can start an advanced plan and do the work every week. but the differenc you allude to different CTLs will likely also express itself in the intensity of a workout for you vs me, vs @Al Truscott, in other words, the pace you run at and the FTP you bike at.
As someone that went through a lighter version of coach training, it's clear that the EN plans follow a good philosophy of building upon each other in mesocycles, if the work is too hard, you will feel it right away, you can always drop your workout to the beginner or Intermediate plan for that week and see if that is a better place for you. Again, you will see this in the form metric on your PMC.
just my $.02
@Scott Dinhofer thanks for the feedback. Yes, I read about your accident. Glad to hear that you're on the road to recovery. Scary stuff.
I totally understand and agree with the assumption that there's a decent base in place before starting a EN training plan. In my case, I"m coming off of year one of HIM-focused training so it's not a huge base, but I've got a solid 12 months of training in the legs at the moment. I guess to get really specific with my question. as I'm rolling out of the HIM plan and into RDP, I'm seeing bike, swim, and overall CTL dropping while run CTL continues to go up. The logical part of me expects to hear that this is by design.. RDP is, after all, a run-focused plan. And the logical side of me is OK with that answer. The emotional part of me thinks that cycling is my strength and I've put in a ton of work on the bike over the past year so I'm wondering if throwing in a few extra bike workouts or lengthening the existing ones to hold bike CTL at least flat is a bad idea. Then there's the cumulative impact of all of this on total CTL, and whether it's by design that it drops during the lower volume/intensity periods like RDP, or whether I could/should be tailoring TSS of individual workouts to at least hold total CTL flat?
As I type this, I can hear that it sounds like I'm doubting the coaching, so I want to convey that that's not the case at all. I'm simply the kid that would take the toaster apart to see how it worked (literally).