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Jeff Horn Wisconsin Overview

So if you were tracking the race didn't go real well for me. Lots of dark places on that course. Overall was glad to do this race. I got to hang out with some very cool people from EN and also got to spend some quality time with my niece who goes to school at UW.

Thursday get into town after long car ride went out to eat and then headed back to our BNB. We were right on the mendota lake about a mile from the finish. Very convenient.

Friday woke up and did a shake out run. Legs felt good after being in the car so long. Checked into race then checked out the town. Had a good EN team meal and met several people from the Zwiftverse.

Saturday small shake out bike to make sure all the parts were working and shifting and did the transition set up thing. No real issues here. At a real good breakfast this day and a smaller lunch.

Sunday: Awoke at 3am and ate oatmeal, apple sauce, sports drink. About 5-600 calories. Drove to race and got set up, team photo etc. No bad nerves. Felt fairly confident about the day. Lined up in the 1:21-1:30 corral, just because there were so many people didn't feel the need to cram up any further.

Swim: Started real smooth along the shore. My sighting, breathing, turnover were all in check with minimal contact to first turn. Only focused on keeping form. As I turned second buoy my form started to falter...mainly due to the chop. Kept swallowing water about every third stroke. Had trouble sighting buoys. I had a better time visualizing the kayaks, so just stayed out close to them. I'm typically a 1:10-1:15 ish swimmer, but knew I was going a bit slower. Just tryied to stay settled and not panic. Had a calf cramp after last turn but didn't bother me much. 1:18 on swim....thats fine, not too much damage done.

T1: Ran up the helix...wow what energy!! Had to be careful not to overdo it. I had planned on biking in long sleeve compression shirt and bike bibs and jersey (start temp was in high 50s). It was in the plan. Knew it would be hard to get that shit on while wet, but had a towel to make the best of it. Was still a slow struggle to get it on. On way to bike running on parking deck I was already hot so took another minute to take undershirt off in the parking lot next to my bike. 12:07....way too long. Next race, plan for trisuit.

Bike: Started off at reasonable pace and effort level. My HR was already back down in the 130's. I started the sipping about 10 minutes into the ride. Pavement was terrible for me within 10 miles. Knew the bone jarring expansion cracks would kill me in about 3-4 hrs. Stayed on my nutrition plan of Skratch bottle every 45 minutes, as well as a bar and pack of chews before special needs. I saw @Brian Hagan on first lap and watched him ride the hills...smoothing them out. I took notes and tried to follow suit. I realized early on this ride that I was overgeared (even though I read @Coach Patrick recs to get 50/34...just didn't have the $$ to swap out cranks and switch from quarq to power tap pedals). Many of the hills I found myself standing up grinding because I just didn't have the seated power to motor up. Tried to not burn too many watts or matches going up these burners...but it was inevitable. After first loop I stopped at SN, got off bike refilled everything and peed / re-lubed. Got back on bike pretty quick and rode with Brian again (saw his draft box duck tape job). Second lap got dark for me pretty close to mile 80. Just felt terrible, stomach shutting down, mild nausea. Watts were going down and wind was depressing. Got to a point where I just got off the bike and took a grass nap. A few minutes was all I needed to stretch the back and legs. I did this a couple more times on way in. Also stopped at mile 85 or so for a crash victim at bottom of timber maybe? (bomb descent into the sweeping left turn). Eventually made it back to T2 a wreck mentally and physically. Official time 7:01. Moving time 6:34. Overall: NP 165 TSS 246 VI 1.16, IF 0.62. First half: 173, 132, 1.12, 0.65; Second half: 155, 114, 1.20, 0.58

T2: Sat next to a guy who was dressed and ready to run, but not moving. He said "I'm done." That sounded like a great idea. I knew that my stomach was kaput and that I would be walking a lot. Not looking forward to that. So I changed into run gear and then found a place on carpet to sprawl out and decide if I want to continue. Finally got off my ass and started to walk. My motto for this run became the slogan from the Charley Berens Wisconsin videos..."Keep'er movin!". 14:16

Run: Stomach felt like shit for 7 long miles. This was dark spot #1 on the run. Kept telling myself...no more ironman races. Not doing Louisville in 5 weeks. Selling my bike. Felt like hot garbage. Finally got a cup of chicken broth in and started to perk up. Was able to run and run pretty good for next 14 miles. Then I found dark spot #2. Low energy and horrible nausea. After walking a bit it got dark literally. I had a long sleeve hoodie in SN and glad I had it. From there all I wanted to do was find nice spots to take naps....hammocks, chairs, park benches, grass. I laid out about 3 times. Tried to puke at mile 21 but nothing there. Finally walked it on in. Crossed with a buddy from home that I traveled with. We commiserated for the last 4 miles. 6:10

Summary: I knew coming in that I had missed a bunch of training due to family / work at critical portions of the race build after week 14. So expectations were pretty low. But not 14:57 low. Nutrition still sucks, even though I thought I'd worked it out. Despite all of my research and experimenting with intake, it still doesn't work well. I thought the hypo-osmolar Skratch plan would work better. Maybe less solids next race but not sure where to go. Enjoyed meeting a racing with a lot of you on here. I'm doing Louisville in 5 weeks, so time to jump back on the horse for a few hard weeks preparation. I think I've got the bad mental energy turned around.

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Comments

  • @Jeff Horn, way to power through and not be negatively influenced by that guy in T2!! I felt every up and down in your race report. I think we have all been on that roller coaster before where we experience the dark side multiple times during a race. I'm sure looking back you are glad you finished even with a slower than expected time rather than with a DNF. I wish you all the best at Lou! You will do great!

  • @Jeff Horn - Yes, everyone I saw was mashing up the hills and completely stopped pedaling at the top to coast down. I did notice you were doing this as well. The compact crank would have helped get you up the hill, but EN guidance say to keep pedaling until you spin out. If you can swing it, I'd recommend the compact for Louisville as well. I believe the course is similar to Wisconsin with less turns and maybe about 500 less feet in gain.

    I know you were in trouble when I saw you coming out of porto at the bike aid station, but I did appreciate the dance as I was getting really sick of the bike by then. I know you don't talk about it much in your report, but that was so cool of you to stop and help the cyclist with the broken collarbone. I guess that what happens when you are a doctor.

    I imagine Louisville is going to be a great race for you! Rest up and hopefully take your lessons learned from here. I have no idea what to tell you about nutrition, as I think I am back to square one as well.

  • Ouch those transitions. Bone jarring pavement ( I read that and rule out races) what was your tire PSI ? There are many that still believe more psi is faster, the correct PSI is just as fast and a bit more comfy. Love the grass nap, hey whatever it takes to keep moving. The chicken broth perk up may have meant you needed more sodium? Nutrition is difficult stick with practice you’ll figure it out. Glad your over all those negative thoughts IMLOU comeback!

  • Thanks @Sabra Gonzalez !

    Thanks @Brian Hagan . It was funny when you said look at how stupidly a lot of these people are riding this course...had a feeling you were telling me LOL.

    @tim cronk had my tire PSI at 85 front and rear. The rear disc was less compliant than reg rear and was probably transmitting all the bumps straight to my back and neck. On the way back I was secretly hoping my front wheel would collapse from the road trauma.

  • edited September 14, 2018 10:56AM

    Jeff, sorry about your really tough day at IMWI. That course is no joke. I'm looking forward to racing IMKY with you in a few weeks!

    I have had many issues with the gut in my 8 IM. I *think* I have it figured out, but we shall see. Maybe @Sheila Leard can help you puzzle it out???

    Recover hard and see you in Lou in a month!

  • "nutrition plan of Skratch bottle every 45 minutes, as well as a bar and pack of chews "

    @Jeff Horn First of all , you did a heroic gesture helping a fellow athlete during a race. Paying it forward.

    Your gut issues are puzzling. Some questions below. Trying to get a sense of calories and sodium intake.

    -What kind of bars and how many were you eating? Skratch bars?

    -How many chews/hr?

    -How many scoops of Skratch were in each bottle?

    -From a recent CBC do you know what your blood sodium levels are?

    -Do you always train with Applesauce before a long workout. I know applesauce has been in the EN Sphere for awhile but I'm not a fan. It's a lot of fructose which for many athletes it can cause problems.

    IM Louisville is an awesome course. I did it in 2015. The roads are good and the hills are sweeping . It can be chilly in the morning. The run is flat.



  • @Jeff Horn First, congrat's on sticking with it and getting to the finish after such a tough day! I am sure there are some folks would be pretty happy with a 7 hr bike that included a "grass nap"! I find the IMLOU bike to be quite similar to IMWI, so you should be well prepared. As @Sheila Leard says, the run is very flat. There is a team wiki on 2 IM's in one season, "revenge protocol", link below, worth reading. I look forward to racing with you in LOU next month!


  • Thanks @Trish Marshall look forward to meeting you as well!

    @Alan Brown I will be looking for revenge and seeing you in Lou as well!

    @Sheila Leard My training was as much as one bar or pack of chews per hour ( I alternated). Since I didn't have much of a need for solids in a decent70.3 race in Ohio, I rounded down to one bar and one pack of chews per 56 miles on the bike. I took in one bar and chews on first loop at Wisc. On second loop I got in one bar before the shutdown, didn't get in the last pack of chews. I was also taking one bottle skratch per 45 minutes. Each serving was 1.5 scoops or 120 calories. I took 2 hits of base salt every hour starting at mile 20. I don't have recent lab work, but I guess that should be done. I did pee quite a bit at 56mile SN, then peed again at mile 2 of run.

  • Jeff,

    Sorry you had a rough day but so impressed that you chose to keep pushing and finish. You are a winner for helping your fellow athlete. That is that EN goodwill. Wishing you happy, healthy guts at your upcoming race!

  • @Jeff Horn If you were eating Skratch bars the fat may have gotten in the way of absorption. Since you were pushing the hills and all the jarring may have added to the problem. It looks like you can get to about 6-7 hours of racing before it all starts.

    Another angle is to look at endotoxemia. With endurance exercise if the gut becomes too permeable then endotoxins or lipopolysaccharides are released and cause nausea. Do you feel like you have good gut? Any kind of stress can cause gut issues.

    You're calories seem low. It appears you were hydrated. Hard to say about Na since Base can't be measured. You Skratch bottles gave you 570 mg Na.

    I think IM Lou will be good to you.

  • It was great to get to meet you. Ironman nutrition is a tough nut to crack. One thing I did that helped was to keep a spreadsheet to track what I did on long rides. Now that I know what works for me I just follow the plan.

  • Don't know if they still do this at the IM pre-race banquets (I stopped going years ago)...they would call up the oldest and the youngest competitors, and ask the oldest what advice he has for the youngest. 9/10 times, it was a variation on "Keep Moving Forward." When you get to Louisville, channel your inner Shaughn Simmons, and just KMF, man. You've had your race where you stopped the forward progress, let's hope you got that out of your system.

    But, respect for your perseverance. The two times I've sat/laid down in an IM, that was the end of the race for me, @ mile 10/11 of the run.

  • Congratulations! You fought through severe nutritional issues and multiple dark places and still finished. Very rough day but something in your brain kept you going. Not everyone have that kind of mental strength. Impressive. I hope you get the nutrition thing figured out...some good advice above. Best of skill at Louisville!

  • OK here goes @Jeff Horn . There are many studies looking at endotoxemia in endurance athletes. The cause is hard to pinpoint At the top is dehydration, NSAIDS, stress and leaky gut. During long or intense events the gut becomes ischemic. The lining of the gut increases permeability and bacteria (LPS) gets out causing nausea. Athletes call it 'gut shut down". It happens the most in hot and humid race conditions. I like pictures to explain things:

    • So how do you fix this. Any signs of gut malabsorption, gas, bloating, can be addressed with a plant focused diet. You want lots of fiber to improve the biome. Kombucha and Greek yogurt everyday. You can also start on Glutamine powder, 5 gm twice day. It can help with improving the health of the lining of the gut. https://firstendurance.com/the-key-amino-acids-for-endurance-athletes/
    • Another easy tactic is to drink a quality undenatured whey protein isolate everyday, 25 gm. It has immuniglobulins and it helps make glutathione - a powerful antioxidant.
    • Race day - Stay with Skratch, chews and one bar during bike. Here is an insider idea to try right away. Get some High Branched Chain Dextrin, HCBD. It's the carb used in EFS Pro. High molecular weight so it does not cause a high osmotic load getting into small intestine. Read page 7& 8 of this article. https://firstendurance.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/EFS-PRO_Research_Packet-
    • Buy here or Amazon https://www.nutrabio.com/product/SCARB/, You can put one scoop, 100 calories, into all of your Skratch bottles. Sometimes it clumps so shake it hard. I've used it many times. Very easy to digest and I have the gut of Princess Fairy. ☺️ Easy way to get 200 calories/hour and then nibble on another 100 ... you're done.
    • Two days before low fat and really low fiber.
    • Race morning change oatmeal to Cream of Wheat or Rice (no fiber). Do you need applesauce? It's a lot of fructose. Get some protein instead.
    • Last thing. How much sodium are you taking per hour? Some athletes are taking too much.

    I really want to help you. Take this for what it's worth. Need to come at this from all angles. 😎

  • @Sheila Leard you are my hero. I certainly don't have a plant focused diet, so I can change that up this week. Any references to good meals that are plant based for athletes? I'm also gonna add probiotic to all of this. I think that the gut is probably incompletely healed after Wisc and Barkley. Sodium was calculated on my EN nutrition excel sheet as around 950 / hour if I recall.

  • @Jeff Horn

    You could start with ideas from Matt Frazier, The No Meat Athlete https://www.nomeatathlete.com/

    You don't have to be 100% no animal protein, but it is certainly a way to guarantee more fiber. Also, some good information on his web site.

  • Sheila and Jeff, I was reading THIS article about the benefits of serum-bovine immunoglobulins in autoimmune disease related to leaky gut. This is an area of interest for me because I have several patients with intractable Crohn's disease. Mainstream medicine just doesn't seem to have anything to offer them. It's very discouraging. I wonder if this product SBI Protect would have any utility here? Jeff, please DO NOT try this stuff based on my mentioning it here. Sheila has all the practical experience. The only other thing I will add is that I am seeing gastroenterologists refer to leaky gut in consult notes. This LINK was also good. Very interesting information.

  • @Brian Quarton Great input on leaky gut. It is very real and even more real with endurance athletes. This product just came a out. https://microbiomelabs.com/products/megamucosa/ Have used and suggested this company's products many times.

    Don't mean to hijack your thread Jeff. We should start a thread on leaky gut.

  • Tough day @Jeff Horn. I knew it was tough when tracking you but not like that. Way to keep going. I'm glad you had at least those 14 miles in the run that were OK and got you near the end. Awesome that you stopped to help. Another cool thing that came out of this race was your ability to do Barkleys a week later!

  • @Jeff Horn

    I have lot's of respect for you and the way you got yourself across that finish line. Brutal day, but the alternative of a DNF was not in your play book!

    Re-defined "KMF" on this one bro!

    What are the two biggest changes you will make for IMLV?

    You have some fitness going into this one and you are smarter now. Wishing you a great day out there!

    I'll be tracking!

    SS

  • Thanks @Tim Sullivan and @Shaughn Simmons . I think that Sheila Leard has some suggestions for nutrition that I'm following for the next few weeks. Is it leaky gut/endotoxemia? We will find out. Doing some probiotics / gut healing regimen to seal up the leaks. I have a couple rides this week that I am altering the intake just a bit. Less bars/solids. I have no expectations on the race, I know the fitness is there just don't want to feel terrible like the last few races. No more laying down in this one (several grass naps at Wisc). Gotta KMF through this course. I had a calf tear the last time I was here in 2012 (from a race 8 weeks prior)and basically had to limp for 6 hrs after the bike. Not doing that this time. Finish the year strong.

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