Colin Turner Official Coach Thread
Here's your updated Season Plan, as promised. This is where you'll return to post all your "coach" questions as responses; I'll see them and reply. This first post is my best outline of how to proceed with your races, but you can ask any / all questions you want. So post away, know that I reply here usually Monday & Friday each week.
Power User Tip: Click the Star icon by the Title of this thread to subscribe, and you'll get email updates when I do reply.
Coach Notes
Colin, here we go! I have added your First plan into Final Surge, and we are ready for your to rock. I have you in the OutSeason® for Runners (which prepares you for a 10k to a 10miler race), as the foundation. This is our main winter program and the prerequisite for a great year...and as this is your first year, it's perfect to get you pointed towards the BAA Half at the end of the year.
Once you move page the OS plan, you'll need to start loading your other plans as listed below, and it will be by inserting specific weeks. Here's how to do that: https://www.endurancenation.us/help/loading-specific-plan-weeks-into-your-final-surge-calendar/ But if you need our help with it, let me know.
Please take a look at the plan and let's start talking here!!!
Your Races
- 04/13/19 (Road Race) BAA 5k
- 06/23/19 (Road Race) BAA 10k
- Other Running Race 10/13/19 - (Road Race) BAA Half Marathon
Season Update
These are your recommended training plans, including the date you should start each one (sometimes you won’t complete a full plan but transition to another one). You can change your plans on within Final Surge by clicking on the Training Plans > View My Plans. If you need help manipulating your plans in Final Surge, be sure to check out our Help Site. Remember, you can learn more about each plan and find related plan resources on the Plan Descriptions and Resources page.
- Last updated by Coach on 03/10/2019
- On 3/11/2019 Load the -- OutSeason for Runners Plan, 14wks to end on 6/16/2019
- On 6/17/2019 Load the -- 5k Plan, 12 wks to end on 7/21/2019
- On 7/22/2019 Load the -- Half Marathon (Balanced) 12 weeks to end on 10/13/2019
- On 10/14/2019 Load the -- Post Marathon / Half Marathon Plan (2wks) to end on 10/27/2019</p>
Your Notes
BAA 10k in June, 2018 - 44:33
BAA Half Marathon, October, 2018 - 1:38, flied and died :(
Trained around 20 miles per week in Summer/Fall 2018
This Winter, doing 1-2 runs per week, between 2 and 5 miles. Maintaining fitness, and building strength and flexibility by cross-training: spinning, lifting, elliptical, and yoga.
Let's get to work!
~ Coach P
Comments
@Coach Patrick
Thanks for the updated season plan! I'm excited to load this up, and map out the year.
I went to schedule my 2-week call with you, but I need to request a different time. I am a teacher, and I have a class of 8th graders in front of my during the available times on the calendar. I can talk between 2:30pm and 4:30pm on the 19th and 21st - do either of those times work for you? I also could talk Thursday 9:30-10:00am.
You'll notice I'm running fewer times per week than the current plan - I'm slowly ramping up to running more frequently, and don't want to push it. I stand up all day as a teacher, and have two young kids at home, so I don't always get good rest and recovery between workouts. I'm having some tightness and pain in the left hamstring and quad that I want to be careful with.
Also, I haven't done my test 5k yet; if I'm feeling up for it, I'll do it this weekend or next. I have a decent sense of my power and HR zones from using Training Peaks and Stryd for the last few years, so I'll input my estimate of my fitness right now, and update it when I've done my test.
Look forward to talking with you, and to a great season!
Colin
@Colin Turner Feel free to just SWAG those zones for now. No need to blitz through a 5k if you have some soreness. I'd rather you were 100 first. Cool?
Yes to another time. This Thursday 9:30 to 10:00am EDT works for me. If you agree...text me at (617) 513-3830 and get me a number we can connect on...okay?
I remember my teaching days in the Peace Corps...my legs were crushed!!!
~ Coach P
@Colin Turner Thanks for chatting today...my apologies for the short call time.
Actions:
I recommend you join our Run Chat Group via GroupMe...sign up via the app, then mute it. The runners check in here daily and it's a great place for quick questions, etc.
~ Coach P
PS - Let's update your profile picture when you get the chance…it really helps the Team to "get to know you" a lot better.
You can do that by following this animated GIF (below)…good luck!
@Colin Turner Here we go post call...
3:10 marathon focus...so:
Coach Homework
Run pace targets for shorter distances
Here is a chart with some comparable numbers for you. These are meant to be targets; not your 5k in a few weeks! But it will tell you where we stand relative to your overall marathon goal.
Once you are through the 5k, we can modify one run a week to have you doing tempo work for the 10k...aka repeat at 6:30 pace. But first the 5k so we have a starting point!
Pacing for the Half Marathon
In terms of race execution for the half (and full), our basic guidance is online here: http://bit.ly/1MjXTCy
Current Training
Mind Set Change To Capture / Continue
@patrick@endurancenation.us
Hi Coach,
I'm feeling good after a 9-mile long run yesterday(!), last 2.5 miles in zone 3, around 8:30 pace. Felt great!
I've been doing around 5-6 miles of brisk walking each week, so I'm not over-doing it with running mileage, but keeping my legs going, and building run durability.
Question: What should my power target be for this Saturday's BAA 5k?
My critical power is around 280 watts. On my 1-mile repeats last week, I was hitting 313 watts, at 6:30 pace.
I'm thinking I'll set my watts for 300-310, stay on the lower end for the first mile, and build from there. It's a nice downhill finish for the last mile.
What do you think?
Colin
I like the idea of the 300 W target. I would strategically recommend you to do 300, 310, 320… As in some kind of build. But I also know that the 1st mile or half-mile of a 5K can be a little fast. I will let you decide. Either way, I want that last mile to be your best.
@Coach Patrick
Ok, that sounds good. I may go out for the first half mile a little over 300, but will dial it back and settle in. Then, build 310 in mile two, and 320 --> kick in mile three. Strong finish! I'd be fine with a finish under 20:30, and I think it's possible to see under 20 minutes if It's a good day. I'll post in the run group.
General note:
The last four weeks, my distances have been: 14, 11.4, 15.5, 14.8. This is the most mileage I've strung together in months; it will be the biggest mileage month I've had in a long time. Feeling great about putting in the distance, and getting stronger and faster because of it. And feeling good about not going crazy and putting 30 miles in(!).
I'm keeping it steady as I get stronger, and will see how it feels to slowly ramp up.
Colin
@Coach Patrick
Had a great 5k race Saturday!
Finishing in 20:48 - not as fast as I'd hoped, but with a crowded course, puddles, and rain, I'm not concerned.
Mile 1 - 6:49, 302 watts
Mile 2 - 6:50, 307 watts
Mile 3 - 6:35, 311 watts
Last 0.11 miles - 354 watts(!) (43 seconds)
Felt so good after the race, I went and ran another mile or so to cool down. Feeling slightly beat up in the lower legs, so took the day off, rolled yesterday. went easy on elliptical and a mile on a treadmill today at the gym. Will try out legs on the road tomorrow with a run/walk.
Also, so was so cool to meet the Boston Marathon runners on Sunday, including Mariah. It feels great to be part of a team!
Colin
@Colin Turner I just wanted to chime in as Coach Patrick is in Mallorca as part of the EN camp going on this week. Nice work on the 5K execution making mile 3 the fastest and still having something for the kick at the end.
It always great to meet team members and @Mariah Bridges is the best.
@Gordon Cherwoniak
Thanks for the note! Got it about the Camp, I won't expect a response until next week. Yes she is!
Colin
@Coach Patrick
Need to make a slight adjustment to my plan - I have an event that conflicts with the BAA 10k on 6/23. I'm moving that race one week up to 6/16, I'll do a Father's Day 10k instead. I'll go into Final Surge and adjust the plan.
Update on training in general:
Had a week off of school last week, and upped the volume quite a bit. Put in 19 miles, 175 TSS, up around 40% from the previous week. I've put in more miles the last 6 weeks than I did all last summer. I only ran about 20 miles in January and February combined, and I've upped that to 54 in March, and 63 so far in April.
I'm taking an easier week this week, more rest days. Had some back and neck pain earlier this week, so doing chiropractic and getting a deep tissue massage later today.
I'm concerned my ramp rate will be too high, so I'm backing off a bit. See images attached.
Any thoughts about how long to back off, and how to moderate the ramp rate?
@Colin Turner no issues with modifying the schedule for your new run. Let me know if you have any questions with that. I hear you are ramping up the volume, and I agree that we want to be safe. One of the key factors for monitoring the ramp rate in terms of its impact on your body is to look at the fatigue number in TrainingPeaks, the one in yellow.
Right now your fatigue is -5 which is pretty low. Overall you may be experiencing some physical fatigue from additional running but it’s not manifesting itself in a combined training load.
For example, in a half marathon plan I expect to see your peak fatigue levels be in the -20 to 25 range, and for a marathon plan closer to -40 for some of those bigger weeks. -5 is pretty minimal.
That said, there’s nothing wrong with taking some organize breaks to make sure that you have enough rest. I don’t mind the weekly volume going up, but it’s OK to have it sit at a certain number for two or three weeks before bumping again. I would start with that first rather than reducing training load especially now that you have time. Another option is to substitute other cardiovascular time for that running time to reduce some of the impact, such as the elliptical or cycling. Let me know what you choose.
@Colin Turner
Welcome to your THIRD MONTH inside Endurance Nation!
This month we focus on helping you become more independent as part of your growth as a Self-Coached Athlete. Whether you are planning your season, preparing to race or transitioning to a new endurance challenge...Team Endurance Nation is ready to help!
If you haven’t done so already, please set up your Month Three Coach Call here.
** Training Focus **
We consider anytime in your season when you are more than 12 weeks away from your event to be a training focus. There are different phases of training (OutSeason®, General Prep, Sport Specific), but they are fall under the same umbrella.
Now that you are through your first two months of Endurance Nation, You have learned a few key “rules” of how we play the game, and you are ready to take charge of your experience.
Training Lesson Recap:
Taking Charge:
** Racing Focus **
Once you are within the final 12 week window to your event, it’s time to really focus. From key workouts to nutrition to logistics, there’s a great deal to cover. There’s a fine line between a great day and a day where you want a total do-over.
Key components of your final push should include:
** Additional Support **
In addition to The Forums and other Team-related support, you still have the chance to connect with Coach Patrick across your first year. Right now it’s time for your three month call with Coach Patrick; and you can book it here.
Tip: Find all your other call windows across your first year, please visit the EN Staff page.
Be sure to check out our Three Year Plan in Resources / Wiki so you can see how we recommend improving from season to season.
Coach Phone Consults
If you are looking for support above and beyond the traditional Endurance Nation experience, you can book a consult with Coach Patrick. These are billed at $100/hour and Can be on almost any training or racing topic. Please click here to learn more / get started.
Congratulations for moving forward with you training as you build to your race goals. We can’t wait to see what you are capable of this season!
@Coach Patrick
A quick note on what's happening - I'm in the most stressful time of my year, with the end of school in June. I have about 2 weeks left, then I'm in the clear for summer training, resting, eating, sleeping (repeat).
I've been nursing my tight left leg to avoid soreness in the left knee for a few weeks now, doing walks, slow running and cross-training to keep fitness up. I'm slowing building back mileage with walk/runs this week. I'm planning to do a few 1-mile repeats this weekend to test it out. If the test goes well, I'll run the 10k next weekend at around 85%, probably aiming for 45-47mins.
I also need to schedule my 3-month call with you, and the times on your calendar won't work for another few weeks. Could you talk Thursday the 13th at 2:40pm?
Thanks
Colin
Thanks for the update. Sounds like there is some good synchronicity between the current state of your knee and two more weeks of minimal training time. I know it’s hard to do, but resting and doing alternate aerobic work like cycling can make a big difference. Remember we have plenty of time left in your year to build, what we’re trying to do now is keep you healthy and effectively bridge what you’ve done early in the season with what we hope to do later.
Yes, I can do this Thursday the 13th at 2:40 PM. I will put it on my calendar, please call me at 617-513-3830. Be prepared to talk about your knee as well as what alternate training modalities you’ll have access to in the summer such as swimming, cycling, Jim a Quitman, etc. Looking forward to it!
@Coach Patrick
Had a great race on Sunday! Ran a 20:40 on a flat course, average of 301 watts. I took it conservative the first two miles, then felt great, so ran the last mile in 6:22. Finished strong and feel great afterward.
This performance is comparable to my 5k in April. If anything, I felt stronger, smoother and more able to push the last mile. I feel I could have run the 10k at around 6:50-7:00 pace.
For the next week or so, I'm taking it easy to recover: cross training, 20-30 mins run/walk, and striders. Then, ready to begin building intensity slowly for the summer.
Here is my current ramp rate on Training Peaks:
Maintained fitness pretty well while recovering from the leg tightness. Still up considerably in my 90-day.
Thanks for the call last week - I'll be in touch when I begin more intensity after next week.
Colin
Awesome!!!! I love the consistency, I agree next time you can build mile 1 -> mile 2 -> mile 3 vs steady then push. You have it in you for sure!!!
Your overall ramp rate looks good, and I like how things have been really stable for the last couple weeks. A nice foundation to build off of. Let’s continue your focus on remaining healthy and get to work!
@Coach Patrick
On some forced rest this week due to a minor surgery - went ahead and got a vasectomy last Thursday (no more kids!). I'm resting and stretching this week, and will start building easy mileage next week. It's the perfect way to keep me from building too fast this summer!
I'll keep you posted as I start putting in miles, and doing the 400m repeats on the 5k training plan I loaded. Also looking into more cushioned shoes, as we spoke about. Probably a Hoka shoe, or something like a Nike Pegasus.
Until next week!
Colin
Congratulations on taking the big step. I remember mine, first couple days were the worst but then I was back at it. Let me know what shoes you decide to go with, super curious!
@Coach Patrick
Back in the running/training saddle the last few weeks! Put in around 10 miles the last 2 weeks, will be around 14 miles this week, with a race tomorrow (Sunday) - a 4 mile fun run here in Cleveland at the football stadium. Good test of my critical power and fitness at this stage.
I am 11 weeks from the BAA Half Marathon. Have lots of time to train between now and the first week of September, so plan on taking advantage, while being smart about mileage.
I got new shoes - went with the Karhu Ikoni's after they were recommended by a sports chiropractor here in Cleveland. Put about 15 miles in them so far and really like them. Definitely will allow me to train more, with less impact, and stabilize my form a bit.
Speaking of, I had a full gait analysis done by this sports Chiro in Cle. The insights are excellent about where my weaknesses are, and what I need to do to avoid injury as I ramp up mileage. Here are the links to the four videos (for when you're recovering from the IronMan this weekend!)
1. Squat test https://www.coachseye.com/v/813fbdb993794a1abf6be81d6da82c92
2. Treadmill Rear View https://www.coachseye.com/v/d9fe8baf73324067b78c57df23c5a351
3. Outdoors Front View https://www.coachseye.com/v/5fe82bcc16ac442eb806442a73bf1f7b
4. Treadmill Side/Front View https://www.coachseye.com/v/e91fc5551bb04537869903b7bc0d7dc9
I'll update after tomorrow's 4-miler. Planning on hitting around 300-310 watts for the first two miles, and building for a strong finish.
Colin
I really like how you were leaving no stone on turned in your preparation for the BAA half.
New shoes always make running more fun; I hope they continue to work for you through this build
I will say that there’s a lot of information to cover there from all of those tips. Can you give me a sense of how you going to prioritize them so that we can be successful? With all of those things to work on it can be difficult to find a signal thru the noise.
@Coach Patrick
Yep, It's a lot. Here's my distilled take-aways:
Had a great run this morning; did a mile warm-up, 4 tempo miles - average 267 watts, then a mile cool-down. At that wattage, I averaged 7:41 pace, a huge improvement from last year, when that wattage was well over 8 mins/mile. And it was a hilly, gravelly course. Psyched!
I'm now following the 12-week balanced Half Marathon plan from Final Surge. Incorporating cross-training on the bike (but not swim), and yoga. Going for between 15-20 miles for the next couple weeks, then will build to 20-25 as long as I'm feeling healthy.
Racing: My primary race, the BAA Half, is a hilly, tough course in October. I'm seeing the Cambridge Half Marathon in early November (3 weeks later) is a flat, fast course. I'm inclined to see how I feel after BAA, take a week's rest, analyze my race, do some targeted training, and then run Cambridge. What do you think?
Colin
@Colin Turner that’s perfect! Thank you for restructuring of the back so that I can see how your processing it. Knowledge is one thing, being able to proactively use that knowledge to create change to another. I think you are in the right place.
I particularly like the difference in shoe types for the runs are doing, and I agree with him 100%.
That’s great news on your critical run, you have made great strides through proper recovery and been really focused with your workouts. I only expect this to improve.
One of the nuances we will have to add in as your training builds his nutrition during your runs as well. What do you typically do for that?
I agree that you can do that race three weeks after the half. It really depends on how tired your legs are, assuming that you are functionally healthy at that time we can definitely make it work. It’s nice to capitalize on your summer and early fall training with two races like that.
@Coach Patrick
Thank you! I'm continuing to see gains and improvement in my wattage vs. pace. Just did a 4.5 mile Zone 1 run: 240 watts, at 8:20-8:40 pace. That pace was well over 9 minutes this past winter.
I think you're right that part of the gains I'm seeing are due to smart rest. I credit the run durability program, combined with my strength training and key periods of rest, including about 10 days off after the vasectomy. It was tough at the time, but it let my body rest, and I'm coming back stronger.
Nutrition is a great question - I have no adequate plan for this, and need to make one. The BAA offers Clif Goo at one spot: between 8 and 9 miles into the race. Last year, I took one and downed it. I've never had issues with consuming Goo or Gel during a long race. I hydrate before racing with Shaklee Performance, a science-tested electrolyte hydration drink. It's great, and my body is used to it after 20 years. I usually just do water during races, but I'm open to grabbing the Gatorade if you recommend it.
I'm planning a long run this Sunday around 8-9 miles. I can bring some Clif Goo with me and do it around mile 5-6 to see how my body handles it.
I also loved the Pre-mortem podcast you just posted. I plan to do one of those before the Half to make sure I've thought of everything.
I also want to add a 10k to my plan some time in late August or early September. It'll be a good training run for the Half Marathon, and will test my critical power. Any recommendations for when/how to make the most of that?
Colin
Specifically when I say Nutrition) I mean eating a Joe 15 minutes before the race and then another one around the halfway point. This is because your breakfast will be three hours before the race starts and you will likely be hungry. We have more information under the learning/nutrition section of the site.
Personally, I would pick the September 8 because we wanted to be a little bit cooler like the half marathon self. I know things are unreasonably cool right now but that’s just atypical. Put it in your Final Surge calendar when you pick one as a race and let me know.
@Coach Patrick
Gotcha - I will do some research a make a plan. I usually do a small protein bar about an hour before, but definitely willing to modify and try out new strategies.
I've added the 10k on September 8th to the Final Surge calendar. Will aim to PR at that race, which is sub-42:00.
I'm feeling a bit beat-up this week after some tough workouts. Will be resting and light running this week to get ready for the race. Then, I think it's 1-2 more long runs to condition the body for the last few miles of the half marathon, some tempo miles to keep me fast, and a taper beforehand.
I'm heading back into school next week, so need to be careful about workout intensity and volume. The last three years in a row I've experienced some form of injury in the first two weeks of September because increased stress and time on my feet all day. I will be vigilant and not make the same mistake again!
Colin
I’m not sure what your gym access is like, but I have no problem with you substituting time on the elliptical or stairmaster for an easy aerobic run during these first two weeks. Perhaps even the stationary bike. We want to keep your aerobic level high just at the same time as we protect your body. Also, total random thought but have you considered some special cushy insoles for your work shoes? Just wondering if something like superfeet could make a difference in your work experience.
For me the key about the half marathon is continuing to rent the effort from miles eight to the finish. That’s 5 miles of incrementally harder work. Anybody can run fast at the start but if you can be smart enough to set a pace upon which they can build over the last portion of the event. With that in mind, you can begin to focus a little bit on negative splitting those longer sessions. Specifically pushing the last 3 miles at an increasing pace to replicate the mental focus required On race day!
@Coach Patrick
Good idea on doing more elliptical, bike, and stairmaster. I do have gym access, and we have an elliptical in our house, so that's definitely an option. I have some good work shoes I got last Spring that are making a difference. I'll take a look at "Superfeet."
Changed plan today, going conservative. I didn't do the 10k race, just did 8.25 miles, with easy mile warmup, around 4-5 tempo miles, negative split, then easy cooldown. Heart rate stayed down in the 150's even as I got moving at 7:35 pace, which is great for me. Power looked good; around 265-270 at that pace.
I'm having a few tweaks and aches around the legs, I think due to stress, sleep pattern change (now alarm at 5:45am each morning, from sleeping until 8am), and accumulated stress from a big August. I'll take a light week, treat myself well, and keep low-impact aerobic exercise going.
5 weeks until race day!
Colin
Good call on the later week, and skipping that race. Additional work doesn’t make sense if it’s going to have a negative training affect. Man if I could bottle up some of that commonsense you have and give it to your teammates I would! 😂
It’s important to remember that the time you are spending on your feet is also strengthening your legs as well. Which is why I like the idea of the elliptical since it’s the aerobic time we are looking for. Even if you warm-up on the elliptical for 10 or 15 minutes before your run, that can accumulate more aerobic time without the total stress of running.
Keep me posted!
@Coach Patrick
Hello Coach! Been a while; I've been in recovery mode, and starting to be ready to look ahead at next season. Was inspired watching your Kona race; followed you on the app (until my bedtime).
I did a full post-mortem of my 1/2 Marathon with friends, my Dad, and on my own using TrainingPeaks. Here are key points from that race:
My takeaways for future are:
What's next for me:
I'm looking ahead at the Winter/Spring:
Curious your thoughts,
Colin