Hi @Sid Wavrin! No need for a new thread - this one had gone quit.
It's an interesting question - one that I don't have the expertise to answer. Alex Hutchinson wrote an Outside Magazine article on the subject called "Are Endurance Athletes More Susceptible to Diabetes" (https://www.outsideonline.com/2201466/are-endurance-athletes-more-susceptible-getting-diabetes). The one sentence summary is "But while there may be some benefit to monitoring insulin levels, there's no need to cut out all carbs quite yet." He refers to studies that elite endurance athletes generally improve their insulin sensitivity as needed to cover the excess carb consumption. That said, he also gives some examples of elite endurance athletes that have developed type II diabetes in spite of their endurance training. There is no way of knowing if the is because of the sugary sports nutrition or just bad genes. It's worth reading. Perhaps EN could get a Continuous Blood Glucose Monitor sponsor. ;-)
I suspect that I'm one of those with bad genes (I've had two doctors independently suggest this is the case). I've backed away from the low carb diet for the most part. I'm avoiding processed and sugary foods, but I am consuming complex carbs. Like your doctor, I avoid consuming sugary nutrition on all but the longest or most intense workouts. Instead I use the Nuun electrolytes which have virtually no carbs. Honestly, I haven't really found myself bonking on any rides of four hours or less and I don't have any GI distress.
@Sid Wavrin you are correct. During exercise insulin response is blunted and other hormones take over to keep blood sugar balanced. One of the many reasons for consuming carbs during ex is to keep cortisol down. After exercise, consuming protein and carbs is to blunt cortisol and start repair.
@Scott Imlay you may have a greater predisposition to insulin resistance. Protein and carbs with fiber when not exercising are your friends
@Scott Imlay enjoyed finding this thread and interested to see your journey. I was a sugarholic up until recently and went keto for a bit, trying to lose weight and thinking that I can up my fat burning metabolism to "preserve more glycogen" during long distance races (I've had some splendid bonks of late). While I felt great, had better sleep, less stomach and intestinal irritation, better mood, focus etc, I had terrible workouts with zero ability to complete anything over 60% of maximal effort or more than 30 minutes (even after 4 weeks of "adaptation"). My carb intake was < 50g /day. Obviously this didn't work for me. I've since trickled in more carbs so that I am around 100g/day during week and 150g/day on weekends. I'm also timing the majority of my carbs before important sessions. This seems to be working better of late. I haven't checked any of my lab work since instituting changes, but am down 14lb overall. I worry daily about diabetes and prediabetes due to past dietary habits (and the enormous amount of patients i see with it), so that will be checked on lab work. I have actually been eating cleaner and being more cognizant of what goes on my plate (even if it does include red meat).
@Sid Wavrin I will say that Time Noakes (I hear most of you groaning already) and Phil Maffetone make interesting arguments about insulin sensitivity and the effects of carbohydrate metabolism byproducts on the development of diabetes (and other chronic conditions) in athletes. There is probably something to the oxidative stress that gets created in the jet fuel carbs some of us burn during exercise.
I've also read some interesting books in the last three months that were helpful in my understanding of nutrition in general: Good Calories, Bad Calories by Gary Taubes, The Big Fat Mistake by Nina Teicholz, and Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance (and Living) by Volek and Phinney. My biggest takeaway from this was: Nobody know what the hell to eat and most "expert" recommendations are based on weak data and are biased from food industry support. No matter what diet you look at, there are plenty of experts and amazing data to support it and refute the other ways to eat. I think that optimal nutrition will eventually will be nutrigenomics based....put your blood in this machine, it will analyze your gene array, active enzyme levels and say here you go, you need to eat 16% carbs/40% protein/44% fat ...or... Bill you eat plant based, Sara needs low carb, Brian eats whatever he wants etc. I wish I were Brian, but as I age, realize I need to watch it carefully.
Comments
Hi @Sid Wavrin! No need for a new thread - this one had gone quit.
It's an interesting question - one that I don't have the expertise to answer. Alex Hutchinson wrote an Outside Magazine article on the subject called "Are Endurance Athletes More Susceptible to Diabetes" (https://www.outsideonline.com/2201466/are-endurance-athletes-more-susceptible-getting-diabetes). The one sentence summary is "But while there may be some benefit to monitoring insulin levels, there's no need to cut out all carbs quite yet." He refers to studies that elite endurance athletes generally improve their insulin sensitivity as needed to cover the excess carb consumption. That said, he also gives some examples of elite endurance athletes that have developed type II diabetes in spite of their endurance training. There is no way of knowing if the is because of the sugary sports nutrition or just bad genes. It's worth reading. Perhaps EN could get a Continuous Blood Glucose Monitor sponsor. ;-)
I suspect that I'm one of those with bad genes (I've had two doctors independently suggest this is the case). I've backed away from the low carb diet for the most part. I'm avoiding processed and sugary foods, but I am consuming complex carbs. Like your doctor, I avoid consuming sugary nutrition on all but the longest or most intense workouts. Instead I use the Nuun electrolytes which have virtually no carbs. Honestly, I haven't really found myself bonking on any rides of four hours or less and I don't have any GI distress.
@Sid Wavrin you are correct. During exercise insulin response is blunted and other hormones take over to keep blood sugar balanced. One of the many reasons for consuming carbs during ex is to keep cortisol down. After exercise, consuming protein and carbs is to blunt cortisol and start repair.
@Scott Imlay you may have a greater predisposition to insulin resistance. Protein and carbs with fiber when not exercising are your friends
@Scott Imlay enjoyed finding this thread and interested to see your journey. I was a sugarholic up until recently and went keto for a bit, trying to lose weight and thinking that I can up my fat burning metabolism to "preserve more glycogen" during long distance races (I've had some splendid bonks of late). While I felt great, had better sleep, less stomach and intestinal irritation, better mood, focus etc, I had terrible workouts with zero ability to complete anything over 60% of maximal effort or more than 30 minutes (even after 4 weeks of "adaptation"). My carb intake was < 50g /day. Obviously this didn't work for me. I've since trickled in more carbs so that I am around 100g/day during week and 150g/day on weekends. I'm also timing the majority of my carbs before important sessions. This seems to be working better of late. I haven't checked any of my lab work since instituting changes, but am down 14lb overall. I worry daily about diabetes and prediabetes due to past dietary habits (and the enormous amount of patients i see with it), so that will be checked on lab work. I have actually been eating cleaner and being more cognizant of what goes on my plate (even if it does include red meat).
@Sid Wavrin I will say that Time Noakes (I hear most of you groaning already) and Phil Maffetone make interesting arguments about insulin sensitivity and the effects of carbohydrate metabolism byproducts on the development of diabetes (and other chronic conditions) in athletes. There is probably something to the oxidative stress that gets created in the jet fuel carbs some of us burn during exercise.
I've also read some interesting books in the last three months that were helpful in my understanding of nutrition in general: Good Calories, Bad Calories by Gary Taubes, The Big Fat Mistake by Nina Teicholz, and Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance (and Living) by Volek and Phinney. My biggest takeaway from this was: Nobody know what the hell to eat and most "expert" recommendations are based on weak data and are biased from food industry support. No matter what diet you look at, there are plenty of experts and amazing data to support it and refute the other ways to eat. I think that optimal nutrition will eventually will be nutrigenomics based....put your blood in this machine, it will analyze your gene array, active enzyme levels and say here you go, you need to eat 16% carbs/40% protein/44% fat ...or... Bill you eat plant based, Sara needs low carb, Brian eats whatever he wants etc. I wish I were Brian, but as I age, realize I need to watch it carefully.