NOS Bike Thread Week 2
This is the quote for the week.
We will be pushing some limits this week for sure. How do you feel after a week so far? If you feel like it has been easy, enjoy that feeling, the Training Stress build will have you feeling it soon enough. If it felt hard, that is OK, get used to that feeling and redefine your definition of "hard".
Tuesday has 2 x zone 3 (90%) intervals that build to zone 4 (120%)
Thursday has 2 longer zone 3 intervals steady at 90%
Saturday is 2-2.5 hours at Zone 3 with 10 min at zone 4.
In case you were reading last weeks thread and noticed that I am not following exactly the prescribed weekend workout plan, I though a comment of explanation might be in order. As I am no longer racing long course triathlon, my need for steady state endurance is less. So, I have decided to concentrate on increasing my FTP just to see how high a 56 year old dude can go. I am planning to do the Team Sat and Sun rides on Zwift to get my 2 hours and will occasionally race the Sunday bump race in lieu of formal FTP testing. If you have been with the team for a while, you probably also "roll your own" OS plan to a certain extent based on your individual goals for the upcoming year. If this is your first year in the OS, I encourage you to consult Coach Patrick before you go too far off of the plan as it is time-proven for those racing triathlon.
Also, the local cyclocross races were right down the street from my house today and did I say that I want a gravel bike? I want a gravel bike.
Now, Go out there and do stuff that you didn't know that you could do.
Comments
Because of schedule I have to switch Monday for Tuesday, so did the Tuesday bike session today. Got myself an ass whooping to some degree with today’s bike intervals. During my 12min of easy pedaling warm up my quads were feeling it ever so. Not a good sign when one’s quads are already giving you a hint that today’s session may offer a greater challenge than you were anticipating. That said , my two intervals (via erg) were programmed as 12min at 80%-95% and 12min at 90%-110%. First interval went well, tough and felt relieved when the rest period came after the first interval. Second interval started ok, definitely feeling the increasing effort necessary as minutes clicked off. With three minutes left I was breathing very hard, dropping sweat like a bucket of water on my head, and my mind was telling me to “stop, 9min on this last interval is fine”.
Gosh, I forgot about the need to build mental toughness (a mental six pack) as one progresses though EN workouts. Fortunately I did not cave into the mental suggestions and pushed through. At two minutes to go mark, my eyes closed cause I got tired of watching the timer barely count down down ( 5 seconds felt like 30 seconds) and I felt like I was going to flop off the bike. Persistence prevailed, but boy legs were jello getting off the bike.
Work Works! Ride hard everyone.
I completed today's Zwift workout. Now I have a question.
Final Surge says
-Level 2: 2 x 12' (4') @ Zone 3 (80% - 85%) to @ Zone 4 (95% - 100%), then @ Zone 4 (95% - 100%) to Best Effort.
Zwift 2020_OS_L2_BF_Wk02_Tue had 12 minutes at 90% FTP, 12 minutes at 110% FTP, 8 minutes at 82% FTP
I figured just go with the Zwift workout and any differences between the text and the workout are minor and @Coach Patrick approved. Correct?
@Ralph Moore Get the gravel bike! Super versatile!
Got the wko done tonight but it was a struggle. My “best effort” was basically the low end of Z4. Legs still a bit sore from Saturday CX race and Sunday ABP ride. I did realize that the prior training I was doing was way too easy and unstructured at least I know why I wasn’t improving the way I felt I should have been...
Hope I read the wko right 2 x 10’ @Z3 to Z4, then z4 to best. I did the first interval at Z3 building to Z4 and the second at low Z4 building to “best effort”. Did I read that right?
Similar Question on thursdays wko. Says 2x12’ @ Zone 3 to Zone 4.
Does that mean each interval starts in Z3 and builds to Z4? Or first one is Z3 and 2nd in Z4?
@David Ambrose Strong Work! Mental toughness is an element for sure. I too was challenged by today's workout (see below)
@Janyne Kizer You are correct. Basically, the differences in the Final Surge workout and the workout in Zwift are that the Final surge workouts are written as guides to follow if you are doing the workout outside or on a "dumb" trainer and the Zwift workouts are more specific since it exactly controls your trainer resistance in ERG mode.
@Kim DuBord I think you did the intervals correctly. The wiki guidance on FTP testing suggests a build across a long interval so that seems like good practice.
Well, I did today's workout and although it was a bit of a fail, it may have some teaching points to share with regards to intervals in ERG mode on a smart trainer and ways to salvage a workout as it starts to go bad.
First of all, I am doing the level 3 workouts because I did them last year and seemed to do OK so these were 15 min intervals. Perhaps I am being over ambitious but time will tell. The first interval was at 240 watts (90% of FTP). It went pretty smoothly although it seemed long. As a practice, I tend to go very easy for the recovery intervals between efforts. The only problem with this in Zwift in ERG mode is that the interval called for 175 watts and I was doing 135 so it kept trying to make the trainer harder to pedal. When faced with this, the phone companion app is your friend. If you click on the button circled below (It will say ERG) then it will turn off ERG mode and go back to regular incline mode.
Changing out of ERG mode for the recovery is useful but the only problem is that when the next hard interval starts, you have to switch back to ERG mode or shift gears and increase your wattage the old fashioned way. I turned ERG mode back on for the second interval (110% of FTP). If you look at the graph above, you will see that I had some trouble about 5 min in. Intervals in ERG mode keep your wattage constant so the faster you pedal, the less resistance you have on the pedals and the slower that you pedal, the harder it is to turn the pedals. I tend to pedal slower as I tire during hard intervals and in ERG mode, sometimes, this causes me to become unable to continue to pedal in ERG mode. When you stop pedalling, it is basically impossible to restart. In order to restart, you have to go back to our little button friend above and turn off the ERG mode. This happened at about 5 min into my second interval. that blue section is where I had to turn off the ERG so I could restart pedalling. I almost gave up but got going again and then switched on ERG mode but DECREASED the bias to lessen the resistance so that I could finish the remainder of the workout.
Lessons Learned:
Now, I am going to replace a toilet and go to bed to rest up for Thursday's workout.
Plenty of discussion regarding ERG mode. Work is work, and it is my personal training preference. Smart trainers always have a lag that is most noticeable with short max intervals, so that may be an exception. Skill at efficient shifting is essential on some race courses, requires much practice, and is certainly achieved by Zwift Racing. I enjoy The Sufferfest videos,,, but the attacks are pretty superficial in ERG ;-)
Thanks for the clarifications, @Ralph Moore!
Regarding ERG mode, I did have to switch out of it for one interval because either something was off and it increased tension too quickly or I lost concentration but my cadence dropped, I switched out for one minute and got myself (and the trainer) to "reset."
Question for the peanut gallery: I am using the power from my PowerTap pedals in Zwift, rather than from my trainer. I have done that mostly so that I have some semblance of consistency in my power numbers. Since I am likely to be indoor more often than not for the next little bit, should I be using the power readings from my Kickr Snap?
@Janyne Kizer I am in the same boat as you, have a Quarq and power from the trainer. The advice I have typically gotten on this, is to just pick one and stay with it. I tend to use my trainer since I dont have to remember to zero it out, and then as I get closer to the season I do a few workouts with both (aka run Zwift to the trainer and my watch to the pedals, etc.). Then you can see if there are any differences in the numbers and adjust accordingly. I also found my trainer had a bit better signal strength vs pedal/cranks so I didnt have dropouts as often with it.
@John Culberson I have been enjoying my Kickr with the auto resistance adjustment, however, I have had a challenge counteracting my natural inclination to slow down with increasing load. When I am not in ERG mode, my power tends to fluctuate more near the end of a long interval as I push on different parts of the stroke (and lose my pedal smoothness). Since my resistance does not change, I can adjust my cadence without my resistance changing. It seems like ERG mode is very cool but I may just have to get used to it.
@Janyne Kizer @Patrick Hayden I also use my powermeter power for consistency sake.
Unlike many of you...I'm an outside rider. I don't have Zwift or a smart trainer and do all my intervals out on the trails or roads or an aqua duct that has no lights or traffic !! Yesterday went out with a couple of friends and got my intervals in on some rollers. Was using heart rate as don't have my tri bike dialed in yet and it has the power meter. Thought I was gonna hurl! It was hard, but felt great afterwards. Because I did a bit over 2 hours I bagged the run.
@Jennifer Eckert Do what works for you. After a pretty solid wreck in the middle of a group riding in the dark at 5:30 AM a few years ago, I upped my trainer game. While it does lack the outdoors, it also lacks the road rash (unless I really get out of hand). Zwift at least does give you a (virtual) competitive aspect and riding with teammates while chatting on Discord is a whole new level of fun.
Intervals today at 90% of FTP. This should be EASY Right? We will see how it goes after work. The worst thing is that my 6:00 AM teaching conference cancelled and I didn't know so went anyways and missed racing with the Team on Zwift for no reason. Well, the race certainly would not have been at 90% of FTP so I guess I get to stick to the plan as prescribed until Sat AM "Hang on" Ride.
I
completedsurvived the Thursday ride.For Saturday, if we Zwift, are most of you doing the Hang on Ride? My watts/kg is a bit iffy for that ride if they go by the description 😕 OK, more than a bit iffy considering the state of my FTP after 2.5 months of run focus.
Where on the EN site can I find the other team rides?
Found it: https://www.endurancenation.us/teamen-on-zwift/
@Janyne Kizer it is perfectly fine to "weight dope" for that ride. figure out what wattage you can hold and adjust your weight in the ZWIFT profile until you are in the correct ballpark for the ride. I personally get dropped about 30-45 min in even if I am holding 3.2 watts/kg so shooting for 3.5 w/kg would probably be a pretty good bet. I really have not adjusted my weight often, I just know I am going to get dropped and try to see how long I can stick with the pack each week.
Pro tip : do whatever you can to stay in the pack because there is a definite advantage to "drafting" other riders. When you fall off the back, you will fall way behind really quickly. (and thus end up hanging out with me)
PSA, we don't weight dope for actual races, just pick your category based on your w/kg. Hence the prominent "C" in my zwift identifier.
Thanks, @Ralph Moore !
One more question about the Hang on Ride tomorrow. I have set up Discord on my phone and joined the EN group. Is hte "Public All Welcome" channel the one to use for this ride?
So I’m just getting back into OS after a few years and the intervals seem pretty hard considering that they’re easier than they used to be at 95-100%. Am I the only one? Zone 3 building to Zone 4 shouldn’t feel as hard as it does. Or should it?
Theres the possibility my estimated FTP is off. It’s been awhile since I tested officially but my Garmin 1030 so kindly gives me an estimated FTP after some rides and I feel like it was pretty accurate based on a time where it was close to a more official FTP but maybe not. Anyone have any thoughts on this?
@Janyne Kizer I saw you on Discord but you had muted yourself. Try again tomorrow for the cruise and crush at 7:50 Eastern. THat is a fun ride too.
@Kim DuBord I find that the intervals seem very hard after a period of not riding to a specific power. Keep at it, it will get better.
I missed Thursday due to work so I did the Thursday workout on Friday AM.
After all of my smacktalk, I overslept and missed the hang on ride so I rode with the meetup ride at 8 AM today. It was a fun crowd as always. There were a couple of nice (short) sprints in there. Also (my favorite) five climbs up the hill in Innsbruck and 5 sprints.
Planning on the Cruise and Crush ride tomorrow at 7:50. Be there or be square.
OK, after yesterday, this hurt
Yeah, I was on Discord on Saturday and there was not talking at all while we were in the pen or first the first 10-15 minutes of the ride so I powered off my headset and tossed it aside. I didn't exit the app on my phone though so I guess it looked like I was still on? Anyway, good to know that I at least did the first part right. Thanks for looking out for me!
Had to shuffle my bike test to today. Glad that is done!!