VASA - strength vs. cadence trade-off

Jeff Phillips

Hi,

I've got a question for the regular VASA users on what they've found to be the most effective training regime to be -- do you 1) exclusively focus on building strength using the harder damper doors (and potentially sacrifice cadence) or 2) focus on high cadence using easier damper doors or 3) both?

I've been using a harder setting for shorter intervals and an easier door when I do longer sets, but am curious if others have a system they use.

scott dinhofer

@Jeff Phillips f - might give a listen to the podcast @Coach Patrick did with me last summer after IMLP - https://player.fm/series/endurance-nation-podcast-7804/vasa-podcast-swim-hacking-an-ironman-with-scott-dinhofer

I'll try to answer your question.

I am not very strong and the most I have gotten to is door #2 for some 50s. That is the goal. Form shouldn't be totally gone, but it will be much harder. As with swimming, "swim" as fast as you can maintaining form. Your last sentence pretty much sums up what I do when I get back into swim shape.

for me, I find my swim stroke is much different on the Vasa and it will take me a bit of time to get my stroke back when I get in the water to slow down my cadence and get my stroke back, but once I do, no measurable difference in speed vs if I trained all that time in the water.

Tom Glynn

I've had a VASA for a while but haven't used it much until the recent lockdown. My typical workout has just been a continuous 4200 yard swim. Door 4. The typical time comes very close to some of my recent IM times - around 1:10. I've been thinking about how to get the time down; more power, more cadence, better technique???

I'll listen to your podcast @scott dinhofer - thanks for posting the link!

Here is a WKO graph of the data from my last week's "swim". Power drops are typically quick movements to wipe sweat from my forehead :)

Jeff Phillips

Thanks @scott dinhofer and @Tom Glynn , I appreciate it. Scott, I listened to your podcast when it first came out and will do so again.

Tom, 4,200 yards on Door 4?!?!?

Tom Glynn

@Jeff Phillips - swimming a couple of days a week like that just makes me an old slow guy with a sore back! If I thought I could get down to an hour or so IM swim, I'd be "swimming" more with the Vasa. Right now I'm just treating it like I'm in maintenance mode.

I have been taking some video. I think that one of the side benefits of the Vasa is that it's pretty easy to get some video analysis. I think I'm pretty good, but I'll let you (and others) pile on. All thoughts welcome!

https://youtu.be/3ESVQ9eTcM8

Tom

robin sarner

i think i may have gotten the fastest swim from pure vasa training - on the team. though am child onset swimmer.

i have trained purely by feel, for years, on the Vasa just about to install power though.

so basically i start at low settings and work up over time. i have been trying to do half hour three days a week, at least. back to it for about three months now. so am up to 5.5 on the door currently. I don't remember working it over 6.

so I work up to the highest setting I can maintain with reasonable turnover.

and within workouts, I start at low setting and am up to the high setting by the end of the workout.

robin sarner

@Tom Glynn

maybe some real swimmers can chime in :

do you feel like you're fully engaging your core ?

using the lats more than than your arm muscles ?

you might be but not clear to me from the video.

i'll try to do a shirtless video of myself and we can compare and get feedback.

Tom Glynn

@robin sarner

core no.

lats yes.

Funny but I just got back in the pool today for the first time since SiP. Our pool is super restricted, but open. My lats hurt a lot more after a Vasa workout than in the pool.