How can I make dramatic swim improvements?
Looking forward to my next battle with Ironman next summer, I would really like to improve my swim so that I am not already out of the race by the time I exit the water. I've done 8 Ironman's with times varying from 1:25-1:17. My most recent outing was Arizona in 1:24. I realize the EN mantra is to focus on the bike, etc; but moving from a BOP swimmer to the "solid" range of 1:05 would not be inconsequential in terms of return on investment. It would also make me a lot happier in shorter, local races where I routinely "lose" the race in the swim.
Some observations:
During the last 8-years, I am a better pool swimmer, having dropped my T-1000yard time from 18:00 down to 16:00 just prior to Arizona, but have not seen any improvement in open water.
I'm not flailing in the IM swim, I usually finish feeling pretty relaxed (maybe I should be going harder, but I do only seem to have 2 gears, sprint and slow)
I've done Total Immersion and spent a lot of time on drills. They have definitely allowed me to be able to swim forever, they just don't seem to be making me much faster.
I would love to hear from anyone who has made the leap up in terms of swim times and whatever they thought was the magic "aha" moment.
Comments
Just a thought........Im a 30'HIM and 1:02IM swimmer.....last winter I went from 15:43/1000m to 15:19/1000m doing the drills that I bought from Swimsmooth.com.....you can buy a video, very detailed plan and drills......it's what helped me.
Find a reputable instructor/coach who does video stroke analysis, preferably from multiple angles above and below the water. Work with them over a period of time. Go back periodically for follow up video sessions.
What Matt said ... although expensive and not sexy like bike bling this was some of the best money I have spend on the sport. About $500 total this year and I dropped over 6 minutes off my HIM swim from 37-31.
For the record Matt was telling me to do this for a while, and I finally listened this year and went to the best instructor in the area. Previous years I went to the less expensive coachs and got what I paid for.
No question that coaching with stroke analysis will help you. But the above numbers and comment suggest there may be a race execution issue as well.
I routinely do IM swims these days in 69-70 minutes (including the last two IM AZs.) My T 1000 time is 15:29 - and that's done with a pull buoy; if I had to actually swim the thing, I would be closer to 20 minutes than 15 I suspect.
There may be some free speed awaiting you by learning how to race in the swim better. "The only way to find your limits is to go past them". You need to get more tired while swimming in a race situation, so tired that you feel you need to slow down every now and then to, say do 10 strokes of breast stroke. Then, you'll get a feel for where the edge of the envelope is, and what it takes to stay there. Swim at an effort level just below that edge. I think that's what Rich means by advising us to swim at an effort level that allows you to hold form. It's harder than easy/relaxed - you want to race just BELOW the effort level at which you start to lose form. An Olympic distance swim is long enough to be such a learning environment. And, surprisingly, you can probably go almost as fast in an IM swim as you can for 15-1900 meters. You can really tire yourself on the swim without jeopardizing your bike or run.
A good pair of feet to follow also helps, as well as the abilities to swim straight and not get freaked out in a pack.
@Matt and Matt: I would love to find a good coach to do this with. Any suggestions on how to locate one? I've tried masters which didn't seem to do the trick and most other "coaches" seem more interested in just e-mailing a swim set to you. TI has a list of coaches so I might start there, but I don't want to just be limited to TI drills which sometimes I think TI is a little too focused on. [Don't get me wrong, the TI drllls really helped me swim easier, but they just haven't made me any faster and I don't think they are really likely to do so by themselves.]
@Al: I think you are probably right. I really only have 2 gears for the swim. My "fast" speed is about 1:30 for a 100 and I can hold that range up to about a 1000. My next gear, what I swim IM at is much slower. I don't seem to be able to swim at some type of "in between pace" like I would in biking or running.
@ the Matts... what's a good time of year to do a swim instruction cycle?
William,
I think that depends on your swimming plans. You definitely want to pick a time when you will carry it through for a prolonged period of time in order for the changes to really be incorporated. So, if you're going to take the OS off from swimming, don't do it before that. You would want to give yourself enough time before the next racing cycle. Maybe late winter or early spring.
My concern about TI is that they really emphasize take as few a strokes as possible per the distance but if you look carefully at their videos the swimmers seem to kick alot to accomplish this. I would think that in tri swimming you really want to deemphasize swimming to save your legs. In fact my thought on an IM swim is not kicking too much..Saving the legs. Just a thought.
I learned, or re-learned, how to swim from the same coach Mancona went to for video. He took me throught the TI drills in private lessons and I feel that learned how to swim well. Oddly, he has been moving away from TI drills in masters practice. Haven't had a chance to ask. I would not say that kicking is focused upon to acheive fewer strokes at all. Actually, body rotation is the key focal point for propulsion with TI. I am a weak kicker as evidenced by the "real" swimmers kicking my ass in kick sets at practice. I have gotten down as low as 10 strokes for a 25.
This is always such a tough question. The OS isn't a great time because we are working so hard on improving bike/run speed and you body needs the recovery. As you get really close to race prep, that becomes a tough time too because you have to start building your endurance for race day. I know some folks have done the OS and then taken their "transition" time between the OS and Race Prep to do a few weeks of swim focus. That to me seems to be a great option because you get the mental and physical break from the OS but you are still working on improving one area of your skillset. I'd love to hear how others have handled this- every time I say "THIS YEAR is the year I do a swim focus and fix my stroke" I have always managed to fail at finding time to make it happen.
www.chicagobluedolphins.com/about_cbd_swim.html
The head coach is John Fitzppatrick. He does the stroke analysis. He shares his swim studio space with Vision Quest Cycling.
I actually found the OS to be the perfect time for me for a swim focus. This is because I did not need a lot of yardage, I just needed help with my form.
I felt no pressure at all during the OS to get any amount of yardage in or intervals, so I was able to truly focus on drills and form without worrying about anything else. This gave me a solid 3 months of focused drill swiming and lessons before I started to increase the volume and attempt to get ready for a race. I was told that if my form every started to fall apart or I was tired, to just stop swimming and not force it.
In the past my attempts to improve my swim were always short lived as I did them during race prep and attempted both improve my form and do the volume at the same time... what happened was that as soon as I got tired the bad habits came back and the new form never really stuck.
My experience has been that sometimes changes to my swimming actually slow me down at first, but if I trust the instructure and stick with it for a few weeks I make big improvement.
YMMV.
Same here.
The most difficult part for me has been FINDING somebody to do this kind of thing. I've spent the past two OS's actively looking for this type of swim instruction. Being in the Washington DC area (which has a fairly high triathlete population) I would have thought this to be easy. But the number of times I've encountered responses like "Sure I can train you, but I don't have a pool so we need to meet up at this county/city pool and pretend to just be friends and then you can pay me outside the building since they don't allow instruction at the pool...." or "I'll have a pool soon and I'll email you when I do" (still waiting for callbacks from those folks). Honestly it makes me feel that if I had the experience myself to offer instruction I should just drop $20K on an Endless Pool and make bank teaching people like me. We'll see how the search goes this fall and OS, maybe somebody's finally managed to get pool access or an Endless Pool - but like any good swimmer
(yeah right!) I'm not going to hold my breath.
Not sure this is an actual option but you could try a local university or college swim program for stroke analysis.
Great input. Not much to add here, just to say the the words "dramatic improvement" jump out at me. While I am no swimmer of any note myself, 3 of 4 of my boys are competitive swimmers of high rank. My 3rd son will swim Div I next year as a recrutied swimmer. Long way of saying I have been in the swim world for eons, and have come to see it as a sport unlike any other. I have never seen anything "dramatic" happen in terms of sudden, huge improvements that happen quickly. It's inch by inch in swimming. Drill by drill, tenacious lap after tenacious lap working on form, form, form and technique. My boys will say that you start seeing the times come down after tons of hard work, then things begin to come together in competition. I put this up as encouragement to not give up. Take some lessons in technique, then go back again and build on that in a few months. The progress isn't like with running or biking, so a more zen-like, long-term outlook with swimming is the way to go. Good luck and happy laps!
This is interesting. My coach, who taught me with TI, worked with me to correct this last year. That was one of the first signs I saw of him moving away from TI. I noticed a big improvement in my swim when I started reaching further.
Rich always talks about having to do what he calls "TI exorcisms."
Always makes me laugh.
@Linda: I agree, dramatic doesn't necessarily mean instantaneous. I've been flatlined though now for 8-years so I think it's time to call in reinforcements.
Wow, this is really fascinating and somewhat disturbing. As I mentioned I reached out to some local "coaches" today. I received a very enthusiastic reply that sounded quite reasonable. I had found this coach through the TI website. This evening out of curiosity, I googled her. It turns out she just started swimming 2-years ago through TI (my first workout I couldn't even swim 25 yards her blog said). So surely she must be a total phenom to be a TI certified coach? Well, her 2-mile swim in Mirror Lake along the cable last summer was 1:25 (a distant last in the race she had entered which was won in about :48 for her age group). Now I'm not hacking on the poor woman, but it seems to me to be a bit of a stretch to hold oneself out as an expert/coach based on these credentials. It also seems pretty weak of TI to "certify" someone and put them forward on their website. I will have to let her down gently.
Caveat Swimtor (Let the swimmer beware).