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What to do - run paces seem slow.

BenBen
in General Training Discussions

This has probably been addressed already, but I haven't been able to find it.  I'm only in week 2 of my first ever OS (or any EN plan for that matter), but my run training paces seem slow to me.  My 5k test was 19:01, this gives me a z4 pace of 6:32.  I've run several 800 and mile repeats in the past and usually do the 800s just under 6min pace and the mile repeats 6-6:10.  The z4 run work feels slow right now. 

I guess my question for the EN vets is this:  Since this is my first go at an OS should I just relax and trust the system or make some changes? 

Comments

  • mgraffeomgraffeo
    Yes. Relax. Trust the system. It works.

    The Z4 intervals are not designed to feel like track repeats from high school track. It's part of an integrated, hard program that keeps you at it 5 days out of every 7. It works.

    Give it 8+ weeks before starting to ask yourself whether you think it needs some changes.
  • BenBen

    Thanks Mike, I guess that's the advice I thought I'd get.  I was just afraid of waiting 8 wks and then realizing I've left some speed on the table.  I'm definately going to follow the plan and see where it takes me.  Chalk it up as a beginner trying to get used to the EN philosophy, I guess.

    I have sort of a follow up question then:  I'm sort of on the bubble between the Int and Adv plans so I went with the Intermediate.  Overall, that's probably where I belong, but my run is my strongest event.  Is it logical to incorporate some of the Adv run workouts into my plan?  I haven't looked at any of them and really don't know how different they are anyway.

  • Chris GChris G
    Have you read Daniels book? He gives a good explanation of why those paces are a good thing and better than pushing harder.
  • BenBen

    Hey Chris-

    I have not read Daniels' book.  I guess with this low volume plan I'll have more time for reading now!  Another plus! 

    I will trust the system to get me to a PR this summer! 

  • Jeff UnruhJeff Unruh
    Ben,

    Running intervals at Tempo pace (i.e., slower than 10K pace) will certainly feel easier than "normal" intervals (typically run at 5K pace). I am waiting for the hammer to come later so not eager to over run them. As you will read in Daniels with T running as the goal, you will fall short of achieving the desired outcomes by repeatedly running them too fast.

    Only other comment would be if you knew you test time was soft it might be worth tweaking the paces a tad faster. I would do that with extreme caution, however.
  • Brian Quarton [OLD]Brian Quarton [OLD]

    I am in the same predicament. (I actually ran my 1.5 miles faster than 5K pace without much trouble. I think I underperformed on the 5K test.) One of Matt Fitzgerald's books, I think Brain Training?, talks about gray zones, the pace in between zones. Running at this speed doesn' train the target energy system optimally. The VO2max pace work comes later. Not that I was a good example of what to do.

  • ironmtngrlironmtngrl
    I asked whether I could substitute a 5K for a run workout on the weekend and got the answer from Rich, "sure - as often as you like." So if I were you I'd either do a local 5K race, or my own test 5K again and earn the right to faster training paces. It's totally possible you just didn't drink enough caffeine the day of your first test. If you can't do the 5K faster though - stick to the prescribed paced. Daniels method is very highly regarded.
  • Coach PatrickCoach Patrick
    The system works, and we are working to a week 20 outcome. image That said, if you bolloxed the week 1 test, then throwing in a 5k on the weekend of week 4 as a re-test is fine. Note, no real rest there. image Speed on the table in week 2 of 20 is more subjective than objective, if you follow...keep up the good work!

    As for the Adv vs INT plans, the Adv have more+harder running, the bikes are pretty similar. You can certainly try toggling over to Adv if you think that'll do you right...just be wary of your recovery!
  • BenBen

    Everyone-

    Thanks for the good advice / info.  I think my test was pretty close.  I think part of the problem is that previously my intervals were really more like VO2 work when I thought I was running at LT.  I think it is just going to take time to get used to a new "interval" pace.  The other thing I've noticed is that I'm doing a lot more running at the EN z4 pace.  Previously I would usually do intervals once / week.  This pace will allow me to do more per week.  I may, however, take a peek at the Adv. running plan as I've always been more of a "runner" (relatively speaking here) and been able to handle more volume. 

    I didn't want to sound skeptical, I do believe in the plan and intend to follow it as closely as possible.  Being new, I just wanted to make sure this is what the pace is supposed to feel like. 

    For now I think I'll stick with the Int plan for a couple more weeks before I consider the Adv.

    Thanks again!

  • Beth_SBeth_S

    +2 on reading Daniel's Running Formula. It is like getting the decoder ring to EN run workouts. Daniels is of the opinion we should know why we do every workout, and, thus is VERY GOOD at explaining paces, workouts, etc.

    Note: It will involve math.

     

  • BenBen

    I've now got a book to put on my xmas list!  Maybe I should go for my Bday instead.  That's sooner.

    Note:  I like that kind of math.  I'm geeky like that.

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