Home Group Discussion-OutSeason November 2010

Week 4 Run thread

 Well, I end up switching a lot of workouts around due to my work schedule.  I did the Wednesday workout

2x1.5 miles 

8:47, 8:45

I crank it up a little more on the longer intervals.

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Comments

  •  Got it down 2 X 1.5m @ 6:44 pace on the tmill with 1% grade. I think just under 7 miles total. 

  • I am off at my son's house in Tucson. My game plan for running is Tuesday light run--which I did at a lake around near the house. Wed will be the normal track workout. Thusday will be pop the the Truduckhen into the oven and then look for a turkey trot. If not, maybe more track workout. Friday will be another light run. Saturday will be a travel day. Sunday will be one bike session, may be two.
  • Was feeling good after 1 mile into the first 1.5mile interval so made it 1X2mile, 1X1mile as 12:04 for the 2 mile and 5:58 for the 1 mile. Total of 8.5 miles in 58:14.

    Bad part is left lower calf tightness that I've never felt before developed quickly after done. Been neglecting the roller, stretching, etc... time to get back on the schedule of doing this or I'll pay later.
  • You're getting faster every week, Trent!

  • Posted By Dan Gilliatt on 23 Nov 2010 04:24 PM

     Well, I end up switching a lot of workouts around due to my work schedule.  I did the Wednesday workout

    2x1.5 miles 

    8:47, 8:45

    I crank it up a little more on the longer intervals.

    Same here.  2x1 yesterday @ 6:40 and 6:25.  Off today (at work), doing Saturday's workout tomorrow, and Thursday's on Friday, off Saturday (work), and will do Sunday as normal.  

  • Trent you are crushing it
    Chris have a good shift, we always seem to be busy today and friday.
  • Target paces Z4 6:51, Z3 6:59. I seem to be terrible at hitting target paces even wearing a Garmin; I did the 1m intervals at Z5 instead of Z4, and the remainder at Z2 instead of Z3. I'm running on roads and bike paths, not on a track. Is this poor pacing something I need to fix in order to successfully execute long-course races? And if so, how do I fix it?
    10' warmup
    1m @ 6:37, NGP 6:27 (0.99), cadence 92, HR 160
    1m @ 6:23, NGP 6:20 (1.00), cadence 92, HR 162
    20' @ 7:22, NGP 7:17 (0.88), cadence 89, HR 157
    Total 47', TSS 67.7 (0.88)
  • Posted By Kevin Mepham on 24 Nov 2010 08:28 AM

    Target paces Z4 6:51, Z3 6:59. I seem to be terrible at hitting target paces even wearing a Garmin; I did the 1m intervals at Z5 instead of Z4, and the remainder at Z2 instead of Z3. I'm running on roads and bike paths, not on a track. Is this poor pacing something I need to fix in order to successfully execute long-course races? And if so, how do I fix it?

    10' warmup

    1m @ 6:37, NGP 6:27 (0.99), cadence 92, HR 160

    1m @ 6:23, NGP 6:20 (1.00), cadence 92, HR 162

    20' @ 7:22, NGP 7:17 (0.88), cadence 89, HR 157

    Total 47', TSS 67.7 (0.88)





     

    Yes, you'll want to learn how to slow yourself down, as the IM run is all about how you pace it, and it's much to easy to come out fast.  Generally, when I find that I'm running just a bit too fast I concentrate on continuing to turn my legs over quickly, but focus on more of an up and down (bouncing-ish) movement than as much forward propulsion as I was doing before.  I hope that explanation isn't totally confusing- it's the best way I can think to describe it this morning!

     

  • Sluggish run today...legs feel like concrete. Pacing all to hell, first interval too fast, right hammy tightened up for the second mile. Must work on trusting the Garmin.
  • Struggled with my run this morning. my 2x1.5 miles were just hard. I didn't finish them. I cut them short. I think I am coming down with a bit of a cold. I just couldn't seem to push myself this morning. Oh well: Another day tommorow.
  • @ Trent - Holy Crap!

    @ Kevin - Textbook run today bro - you are staying incredibly consistent every day!  Nice work!

    Still fighting what I believe is the stomach flu here and doing the best I can with it:

    This was basically an exercise practicing mental focus/toughness today – quite grueling for me.  The last ¾ miles I had spent everything in the tank and was just trying to hobble back in.  Not the best stats for me but better that missing the run.

    connect.garmin.com/activity/57779712

    Main issue is that I cannot hold calories down very well and am running a deficit.  I hoping that after enough En workouts this week I will have killed this virus if it does not kill me first!

     

  •  It was a crisp cool morning here. The ground was soft from yesterday's light rain. Instead of heading to the track or the bike trail, I went to the park and ran on my pre-EN long run course. It is on a trail and hilly. I programmed the Garmin for 2x1 mile (2') at Z4 pace. With the hills, I kept getting the warning that I needed to speed up. Oh, well. I did not hit the paces but it was indeed Z4. Even better, it was lots of fun. Next time, though, I'll pick a flatter course when I need to hit my paces.

  • I've been running outdoors mostly, but there was pea-sized hail today, so I took it inside to the track.

    2 x 1.5 mi at 6:37, 6:46 pace, so that hit the main set pretty well.

    Total 8.03 miles in 61 minutes

    I'm still at a point  where HMP (7:00/mi) doesn't feel too much easier than TP (6:50).  As long as I'm reasonably fresh, it doesn't "cost" me much in RPE for anything roughly 8:30 - 7:30.  But from there it's pretty steep RPE until you get close to 7:00, e.g., the difference between 7:15 and 7:00 feels bigger than 7:05 to 6:50.

    In other words, after two pretty hard intervals at TP (or as it turned out just a few seconds faster), it's pretty darn hard to run just 10 sec/mile slower!  I gave it a pretty good effort, but in the end kept drifting back down to ~7:30 pace...firmly in Zone 3 by HR.

    My vague recollection is that last year, as I got fitter, my "Z3 HR pace" got faster relative to my other paces..and I'm hoping that's right.  Does this sound familiar to anyone else?

  • BTW, Gilliat... oh my....
  • Posted By Jon Bergmann on 24 Nov 2010 10:58 AM

    Struggled with my run this morning. my 2x1.5 miles were just hard. I didn't finish them. I cut them short. I think I am coming down with a bit of a cold. I just couldn't seem to push myself this morning. Oh well: Another day tommorow.
    Jon - right behind you on the struggle part. The first run, I hit my Z4  pace (7:19) but was at the low end of my Z3 HR. For the second, I hit both pace (6:55) and AVHR at Z4. I ended up with 6 mi total. I'm hoping the extra rest this week will get me back to form. Just did not have that "zing" like the last several weeks.





     

  • I took advantage of a short workday and hit the local track during daylight hours this afternoon. 2 x 1.5 at 9:40 and 9:49. Finished up with a total time of 1:08. I'm enjoying the track while it is still nice. I have got into the trap of spending too much time on the treadmill in the past.
  • You guys are really bringing it... Awesome job everyone!



    Well, Sunday's MS on the deadmill caused me some issues with my right hammy. Nothing bad, but it's not great. Tuesday I did 15' easy on the DM - still OK but I could feel it by the end. So today I vowed to run outside no matter what - and I did.



    Cold and windy night, 29* NW@16, G to 25, wind chill @ 18*.



    WU for about 12' then MS of 2x1 @ 7:23/7:17; Cd 89/89

    Total run 48:09 for 6 miles @ 8:03; rTSS 68.3 (0.879)



    Was able to hit my paces pretty well with only a few looks at my Garmin. No true zone 3 stuff, just my regular mid-distance pace. Didn't want to tweak my hammy any more than necessary.  Cold wasn't a factor, but the wind was less than pleasant.



    WAY BETTER THAN THE DEADMILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • I think I'm at almost the exact same VDOT as Kevin and William. I did 2x1.5@6:44 and 6:50...target was 6:50. I COMPLETELY agree with you William, that "backing down" from 6:50 to 6:59 doesn't seem a whole lot easier, so that whole, "try to accumulate more time in Z3" was a little tricky. I ended up doing 2x1mile at 6:55 and 6:59...total of ~7.5 in 1:01. Hard but good!

    Nice job everyone.
  • Hit my pace for the 2 X 1 mile but it was work. Did total of 5.43 mi. It was nice finishing in daylight. I'm going to miss this daylight stuff next month when I'm done PICU and am back at my home hospital.

    Lynne
  • Posted By Kevin Mepham on 24 Nov 2010 08:28 AM

    Target paces Z4 6:51, Z3 6:59. I seem to be terrible at hitting target paces even wearing a Garmin; I did the 1m intervals at Z5 instead of Z4, and the remainder at Z2 instead of Z3. I'm running on roads and bike paths, not on a track. Is this poor pacing something I need to fix in order to successfully execute long-course races? And if so, how do I fix it?

    10' warmup

    1m @ 6:37, NGP 6:27 (0.99), cadence 92, HR 160

    1m @ 6:23, NGP 6:20 (1.00), cadence 92, HR 162

    20' @ 7:22, NGP 7:17 (0.88), cadence 89, HR 157

    Total 47', TSS 67.7 (0.88)



    Kevin,     You will be doing 2 race rehersals as you get closer to your IM. You want to hit your race pace ( 1st 6 miles will be LRP(zone 1) + 30 secs.) right on pace.  I can gaurentee your body will want to run faster than that off the bike.

     

    If you do not obey this guidance you will most likely slow down and experience some pretty good suffering at the end of the marathon.  So like everything else, how do you do it, practice, practice, practice.

    As for running above pace at this time of the year the concerns are overtraining and injury.   The paces are what they are for a reason, just because we can faster does not mean we should.   Be very careful, all of as type 'A' athletes that have been in this game for a while have overcooked ourselves because of doing just this.

  • late posting, yesterday's run went pretty good.

    w/u for 20' with some accels
    2 x 1 mile building to the target pace, slowly, 1' at a time. NOT the OS plan, but recommended by physical therapist. And hamstring wasn't an issue AT ALL!!!!
    then 20' at z2/z3.

    60' total, no aches or pains!

    PT says we'll do this for another 2 weeks, then build faster to hold the OS target pace longer. Hopefully, I'll be hitting the OS as prescribed by end of December.

    Hope I'm not wasting my time. Blending the OS plan with rehab ain't ez.
  • And how bout this for the leg injury gettin' better....I had left my shoes at the house and had to do this run in my 5 year old Mizzuno's. Only one step up from barefoot running.

    made me focus on running with a quick cadence and soft (rolling ?) landing.
  • I did my run yesterday and had a bit of a problem. My left foot has been a little sore for a few days. Haven't been worried. I pinpointed the problem yesterday during my run. It's the joint of my left big toe. I had surgery on it 10 years ago and haven't had any issues beyond a little arthritis. I got through my first 1.5 at 6:30 pace and then backed off.  Finished for a total of 6 miles. Not overly concerned at this point. I'm going to the podiatrist on Thursday.

    My guess is that it's the increased intensity. I also need my orthotics refreshed. They are designed to take pressure off the toe joint. Did my bike intervals this morning and rest tomorrow. We'll see about running on Saturday.

  • Turkey Trot 10k this morning. 43:31 for Garmin 6.3mi. PR and negative split.

    6:54, 7:02, 7:02, 6:57, 6:54, 6:46, .2mi 6:27 min/mi



     

    Happy Thanksgiving!!

  • Was going to do we'd run today, but ended up at a turkey race where you had to guess your time for an estimated distance of 5 miles. Started out without a warmup and felt good. Ended up just running the whole thing at a little faster thanTP. Legs felt real good. Will see if data supports this when I get home Sunday.
  • Well, I did a 5k this morning and have mixed thoughts...

    On the positive, I improved over a minute and 5 vdot points from my test during week 1. However now I know my vdot did drop off a bit so I just have to accept it and start building back up.

    Anyway, after 3 great runs last week I thought I had my running legs back and went into this race over confident. Plan was to run 5:30, 5:25 and then see what I had for the final 1.1. My goal was to go under 17 and I told myself if I didn't I had to do todays bike workout after the race.

    Mile 1 - 5:30 - I felt great and actually held back a little to stick with the plan. I was in second place.
    Mile 2 - 5:33 - First half felt decent, then it started to get hard. Effort went way up and I started to slow down.
    Mile 3 - 5:41 - ouch, I was in a world of pain and just went as hard as I could as I knew every second faster I ran the faster I would be done.

    17:11 total and 4th overall. This earns me a vdot of 59.3 and therefore I beat Coach P's goal but I have 5.7 more vdot points to get back and gain in the next 10 months.

    The bike after the 5k was tough. I did pull off the 2 x 12 at 1.00 and also had 3 x 2' at FTP as a warmup for 30' of FTP work total. It sure is a lto harder after running an all out 5k. remind me not to make that deal with myself again next year.
  • Did a 50' run today to test out the legs. Hamstring didn't give me a whisper of trouble. Ready to rumble.
  • @Matt S - I'm with you on those little foot problems. Good luck on that. Right now, I'm doing well, but I hear you!

    @Mancona - From here, it just looks like you're slightly mortal... rounded out a long tough season not too long ago and you had to back off...and now it's starting to come back. Good work - we all know you'll come flying through!
  •  ran off some of the pumpkin pie today - 6mi with 2x1.5@z4.

  • Did my run yesterday as a turkey trot.  way too hilly for a 5k in my opinion.  405 feet of gain.  Had a side bet going with P and would have lost for sure if he did not bag it all together.  First mile was all uphill, 140 feet up and 10 down [yes I ran the corrections] came through the first mile in 6:02 which I later learned was a sub 5:30 NGP which I likely paid for later].  Was abotu 35 degrees and I never felt like I really warmed up at all.  There was a sharp downhill in the second mile that almost seemed scary.  The little kids were flying by me like I was not there.  The second mile was 6:10.  The last one had another nasty hill and then turned down toward the finish luckily.  Felt like I had no kick left and really just did not care that much as my goals were all long gone.  Finished in 18:53.  28/2400, 2nd AG.  Only got beat by one person older than me.  Did get beat by a 12 year old and a couple 14 year olds. 

     

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