To Tubie or not to tubie that is the question?

vrk3ds

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  Hey Team,
   
  Just wanted to get opinions and advice on haus members take on the whole racing/training on tubulars?
   
  Here's my situation. I have a 32 hole mavic pro with powertap 2.4+ but currently no front wheel for my tri-bike. 
  Just sold my older tri bike which will help fund a set of racing/ training wheels. A used set of zips/heds with powertap are in budget but most are tubies. How do people feel about training and racing on them vs clinchers?
  

William Jenks

I have never done tubies, but with recent advances in tires and rims I see no reason to switch to tubies except in very specific circumstances. I would be curious to find out what percentage of IM-distance pros use clinchers now, but I bet it's higher than it once was. I would surely not want to go into a situation where I had to carry both a spare tube and a spare (whole) tubie. :-)

Paul Hough

No tubies. They are overrated and carbon clincher technology has all but erased any remaining pseudo advantage. With tubulars, rolling resistance is directly related to the quality of the gluing job. And if they are glued too well, your race may be over if you flat and can't get it off the wheel (although they are less prone to flat). I always slow down and offer a tube or CO2 when I see a rider with a flat well out of town on the Suncoast Trail. I remember one guy sitting on the side in the heat...I couldn't help him because he had blown a tubular and wasn't carrying a spare. He had to wait for the cavalry.

Kitboo

I run tubulars on my race wheels and use clinchers for my training wheels. I bought my race wheels back in the day when the argument for tubulars beening lighter, having less rolling resistance and a more plush ride seemed very compelling. The debate over all those points between tubulars vs. clinchers rages today; and I won't get into it. I can say that I think the ride quality of my tubulars is more comfortable than my clinchers. My tubulars are lighter than my clinchers but they are also a narrower tire. I learned how to glue tubulars when I got my wheels----it's not a difficult task, but it does require more patience with the glueing than just slapping an inner tube into a clincher tire. Good tubular tires are expensive which is why I don't train on them as I tend to get alot of flats. I have ridden on cheap tubulars and the ride quality compared to the more expensive tires is very noticeable. So given the expense, the whole glueing process I'm not so sure that the weight savings and plush ride are really worth it. The arguments for which type of tire has the least amount of rolling resistance are equivocal.

For simplicity's sake, I would recommend that you get a wheel cover for your rear wheel (if you want to run a disc in the rear) and a clincher front race wheel. Racing with one wheel clincher and the other tubular means bringing a spare tube and tubular during a race which is cumbersome.

talltim

I tend to agree that the performance benefit isn't worth it --Esp for just training. I suppose if you had loads of spare cash and spare time to deal with and underwrite it you could both train and race on tubular wheels, but my candid view is it isnt worth it. (and RnP will tell you to spend the time and money on higher ROI items).

At one point when I was just a cyclist, I tried this approach for about 2yrs and it wasn't worth it for me overall. Eventually sold the tubular trainers and raced on a set of GL330s and also a pair of HED 90s. After flatting 2x on the HEDs in two HIM races and losing too much time changing them, dealing w valve extenders while pouring sweat w a high hr, etc., I sold them on EBay.

If you just want them and are willing to make the investments, it's up to you, but I wouldn't recommend this approach for a performance benefit. As others have rightly noted racing or training on a mixed set of wheels is just a pain.

As others have noted, if you justbwant

J.T. Thompson

I went thru this same question a couple of season ago - what did I want for racing wheels?...In the end, I decided to go with carbon clinchers for a few reasons..1. Much easier to fix when flat and generally find spare tubes from others when in a real bind....2. Carbon Clinchers narrowed the performance gap between the wheels to the point where it won't make that much difference for me...Once they are rolling...? Besides - if Chrissie can win on clinchers (now that she knows how to use her spare CO2 cartridges) I figure that's good enough for me....

ps...I've also known a number of riders thru the years with tubulars that also had to call the cavalry to bail them out when they couldn't fix a flat....Just not worth it in my opinion....

gopetego

I agree with overall concensus and last fall got carbon clinchers on new tri-bike. At the time I asked just about everyone I know which they preferred. I think those who have been on tubulars for years - stick by them and are comfortable w/them. In fact, last year while fixing my 2nd clincher flat in a HIM another guy was walking his bike w/ flatted tubulars (and he had a looong walk back). In talking to him he said it was the first time he flatted w/tubies in 100 races !! Heck, I've flatted in 4 races in about 36. So I was definitely thinking about tubies at that time. But flats occur and I wanted the security in knowing I can finish what I started w/o any issues ....

kjanracing

I've raced on both and now have carbon clinchers. For tris, it's a pain to carry a tubluar spare and CO2, much easier to carry a tube and CO2. I don't think there is THAT much difference anymore.

Bomber

I've raced both.. In fact, I have a tubular disc which I never use...I just prefer to put a wheelcover on my 404 training wheel (clincher). The time it takes to put on a new tube..and the fact that I won't push as hard on a newly installed tube means that I just prefeto use clinchers..tubes just aren't worth it..

John Withrow

FWIW, I had a somewhat similar situation last yr. I wanted a Powertap, but was also considering future race wheels. I decided to kill 2 birds with 1 stone and bought a set of Zipp 404 Tubulars with a Powertap SL+ on eBay. I must say, I didn't notice any ride quality difference. And I'm a bit nervous every time I go out because after 9 months of riding on them for every single ride, I have still never changed one. It's a bit of a pain to take an old pre-glued tire with me every time I ride, but I just leave it strapped up under my seat, so it's not all that bad. I'm sure the first flat I get will be in my A-race, but I guess I'll deal with that when it comes. My project for this winter "should" be learning how to fix one... With all that said, I'd rather have clinchers but as your original post pointed out, the clinchers are A LOT more expensive and aren't even available on eBay if you're trying to get a good deal. As a data point, I got what I thought was a great price for the exact same set of Zipp Tubies with a powertap a few months back on eBay for ~$1,300 for my wife to have power... A clincher set traded the day before for ~$2,200. So I had a similar situation and went with the tubies. Do I love my decision, no... Did I like it enough to make the same decision again, yes. Will I regret it later, I sure hope not...

[Deleted User]

My experience with tubulars is very limited.  I rode them in one HIM hoped I would not get a flat (thankfully I didn't).  I will say that I didn't consider them feeling any better than my usual clincher race wheels.  I'm a big fan of the HED C2 clinchers and would recommend them to anybody. 

It seems like you have several options if you want to stick with clinchers:

1. Go with a used set of zips/heds with a PT, likely tubular, unless you wait long enough and find clinchers
2. Spend more $ and not wait to find a used set of clinchers
3. Get a disc cover for your mavic and just buy a front wheel for racing

#2 might not be as bad as you think if you end up getting something you can train and race with (e.g., with a disc cover).  This is assuming you would no longer have a need for the mavic wheel and sell it.  Or, heck, I don't even know if this is possible or cost-efficient, but can you take your current PT from the mavic wheel and have a new wheel built using it?  Build up some wheels with a nice set of HED C2 rims, order a disc cover, and you are set!

kjanracing

Another think to keep in mind is if you only race a few times/year on tubulars, be sure to check the bonding of the tire to the rim. The glue will dry out and the tire ain't held on too good then. Bad for going around corners!

Chris G

Not a tubbie fan. I could not get mine off for about 20 minutes in my basement using all my tools. No way i could have done it on the road. If you leave a section unglued or do not use lots of glue then you will lose a ton of crr goodness and might as well be on clinchers which will be faster, easier and cheaper. I was also not that easy to glue them on really straight. Maybe with more practice, certainly do not want to practice on the side of a road in a race. I am buying some tubbie wheels for my cx bike but that is another animal entirely.

On a related note i am welling an 808 clincher if anyone wants one. Have to have the new all carbon clincher...just cause...

grosso27

I have Open Pros with powertap for training & Zipp Sub9/808 tubie PT for racing.

If I could find a trade or upgrade for a reasonable price, I'd get the new carbon clinchers.

I personally wouldn't do the older model, aluminum brake track clincher, but those aren't awful either.

In my experience the old clinchers were nearly impossible to get a tire on.  Tubies are not hard, but they are more of a hassle than clinchers, and cost more to run & maintain, for probably no difference at this point.

Tubie tires cost a lot, gluing can be tricky, race emergencies can be sticky, etc....

I do think they ride a touch softer, which might be nice over a full IM distance, but the FireCrest CC are supposed to be great as well.