Why does my power still suck?!
I'm a lurker on here, started a couple weeks late because of an injury so I'm on week 10. I'm rehabbing a running injury so I'm ignoring the fact that my run is not where it should be, doing all the work, and hoping to make major improvements on the bike. My frustration is that while everyone else seemed to report all kinds of improvements in their FTP at the test, and doing awesome on the painful vo2 stuff... I feel like I'm living on a power plateau. Doing intervals last Thursday damn near killed me... by the last couple couldn't even hit them. Most Tuesdays I don't follow the plan to the letter, I'll admit--- I do hill repeats with a bunch of peeps and I'm a little mad that my time up that hill is not improving, and I can't get my power up the hill to budge... the last two weeks I've had to shove my ego in my jersey pocket as I chase friends... 
Anyone else have anything similar?! What's up? Will I ever snap out of this...? I'm doing the work.
Shannon
Comments
Some people have rapid improvement because of where they started. If you started in more or less high fitness, then it's harder for you to make rapid, large gains...because part of what people are getting is just "back in shape" more than improving where they were last year at peak. So people that detrained a lot due to not working very much for a while make gains.
On the other hand, it's my understanding the people who haven't taken a couple of weeks (at least) break in the time leading up to their OS also have a harder time improving just because the body needs a bit of time to rest and reset periodically, and those OS is some serious no-joke work.
You'll need to decide for yourself how much the off-script stuff on your Tuesdays is affecting the plan and your execution of it. Rich has said he doesn't follow the plans as written...but he knows what he's doing in terms of getting in his FTP time, etc etc better than I would without the guidance.
At week 10, you've gone through the first FTP cycle, and now you're struggling hitting the VO2s. It would seem like that (in a sense) validates the FTP number you're working from...if it were artificially low for some reason, you would have less difficulty getting the 120% intervals done.
I wish I had a more concrete answer, but I hope those are some things to think about. I'm sure some other folks will jump in too.
I typically see three reason why folks here have really big gains:
- They are new FTP testing and simply learning to suffer more and test better give a huge gain in the 2nd and 3rd tests
- They are new to interval training and working hard (instead of going long) therefore their body responses quickly to the FTP work and they see a big bump quickly
- They lost a bit of fitness from their peak in the previous season and it's easy to get that back. For example my best FTT last season as 284, I only took 3 weeks off but still dropped to 270, however within 8 weeks I was easily up to 285 as it was just getting back what I already had...my net gain is only 1.
From this point on every watt a gain is going to take a ton of effort but I just keep pushing forward and eventually the gains come.
If you don't fall into one of these three scenarios, it becomes more difficult and takes longer to see improvements. You will still see them, you just have to work harder for them. Typically there are people that fit into 2 or 3 of these situations in each OS group and they see huge improvements in the first 8-14 weeks.
A few things to that might help us to discuss this more with you:
What was you injury and are you really recovered and ready to be training again?
How does your current FTP relate to your highest FTP ever?
How strong are you on the bike already? Closer to 2 w/kg or 4 w/kg?
How long have you been doing training similar to the EN OS workouts?
How is your overall fatigue right now?
Are you doing significantly more work on the Tuesday group rides and burning yourself out before the Thursday EN workout?
Do you find either the VO2 or FTP work significantly more difficult than the other?
I obviously don't know a lot, but the "off-script" stuff, at least for the first half of the OS, was essentially long (20 min) intervals in high Z4/low Z5. It seemed reasonably compatible with the workout goals... or maybe I'm just kidding myself. Either way you'd think I'd see SOME improvement?????
So yes, struggling with the Vo2s does show me that the FTP I'm working from is really true... and really lower than I want it to be.
I had an IT injury that affected my running but never my ride. Honestly, I'm not ready to be training at 100% for the run yet. I've been, on MD/PT orders taking it easier on the run (no big hills, etc., etc.)
I don't know what my highest FTP was ever--- got a powertap last spring, played with it last season, first formally tested this year. My FTP is about 3.6/kg right now
I've been doing somewhat similar training off-and-on for years, but not... Meaning that while I would intermittently do track workouts, interval bikes, etc., a lot of my training was "go run/bike however I feel like it or however my buddies are doing it/lots o volume"
My fatigue is pretty high-- higher than I feel like it should be.
I don't think I'm doing more on Tues than I would as written...
The Vo2 work (though I'm in week 10 and so have only been at it for a bit) is a lot harder for me.
@Shannon
I don't have an answer but I am in the same situation. My FTP pretty much stayed the same for the first 8-10 weeks of this OS. I had been doing 2x20's with a power meter for a while so there was no chance of me getting a bump by learning how to test better but still, I was hoping for a little something. On the other hand, I have never done regular VO2 sessions and think that "raising my attic" may lead to something positive. I've been nailing the intervals on the flat and am able to exceed them easily if I do them while climbing.
I am planning to do a double a week after the end of the OS with my wife. She has been riding between 150 and 200 miles a week while I've been "mostly" holding back and trying to stick to the OS plan. I am doing the outdoor option so my Tue and Thu rides are closer to 90 minutes and my weekend rides are closer to 3.5 hrs. I've also squeezed in a few longer rides and have another century coming up in 3 weeks. I'm blaming the over distance rides for my lack of cycling results because there is obviously more fatigue.
For me, long weekend rides are a lifestyle thing. It's been hard to give up riding with my Monday morning hill group and my Saturday long ride group. It is even scarier when they warn me of how I am going to feel at mile 150 if I don't start cranking up the volume! I am trying to stay the course in the interest of getting faster.
On the run side of things, I have followed the program more closely. My vdot has gone up by 2!
We have another test coming up in a few weeks. I'll bet we both show improvement!
The great news is that at week 10 of the OS the V02Max focus has the potential to explode your roof. If I were you, I'd start the V02max work at a level at which you can finish all the intervals consistently (like start @ 115% and see if at that level you nail them) and then work your way up to 120%. I would really focus on every aspect of recovery to make sure you're reaping all the potential gains from that work. Sleep as much as you possibly can, eat a really good diet with plenty of veggies/protein, de-stress, etc.
Good luck!
You are already a very strong cyclist, started the OS with a good bit of fitness already, and have already done this type of work.
All of this means that you don't have as much low hanging fruit that you can easily get in the first 10 weeks like others.
I absolutely know that my VO2max / 5min power is my weakness. The VO2 work is significantly harder for me each year. Plus when I test both 5' and 20' power my ratio is very low and indications that I don't have much of an attic.
The good news is the VO2 work helps me the most, so as horrible as it is, I love it as I know that I will survive and get stronger because of it.
I would suggest sticking to the plan through week 14 and seeing what happens after the V02 work. Also, be very carefull as the VO2 work doesn't feel like a lot of work but it hits people like a ton of bricks later. Read forward to the week 11 and 12 treads and you will see many people that can no longer do the 2.5's or are completely exhausted.
Hey Shannon,
Good to see you on the hill this morning and good on Nicole for getting out there also! My notes:
I'm with Matt, specifically on the Vo2 stuff. I felt fine in weeks 9 and 10. Weeks 11 and 12 have thrown me into the pits of despair. While I walk around and feel completely normal...not tired and wasted like the high volume work leaves me. The difference is that I look at my bike now and think "this sucks!". I get on the bike and know it sucks. The 2.5s are about 45 seconds too long. I no longer even get close to 120% and sit around 110-115% because its all I can manage. Week 14 can't come soon enough!!
Don't discount the amount of fatigue that may be in your legs. I am getting enough sleep. I am eating properly. I am not doing any extra work other than core work and easy swimming. And since the Vo2 work began I have not even come close to the wattage I hit in week 8 or my 5k times. And to top it off, I've been in complete denial about the fatigue.
This last Saturday I could only hit 1 of the 2x20 without falling apart. Go read my thread from the other day about fatigue. Coach Pat had some very accurate words that I won't forget.....He pointed out that I was picking a random time in the OS to do a race and then wanting to use that as a guage of my fitness without regard for the work I was doing or the fatigue I was accumulating. That's not how it works. In week 8 I was rested. My leges have not felt rested since that day. I feel fine since we're only doing 8-10 hours. But my legs have zero snap. My point being...don't discount the fatigue in your legs from the Vo2. I didn't believe it. Guys like Mancona warned me...I scoffed. Now I know better.
I've been through 2 full OS cycles and never gotten great gains during the actual OS. The real benefit came later, during the actual race/event season, when it really counted. Be patient! It'll come!