Crossfit (Endurance) and Tri training
I just saw an interesting aritcle over on that OTHER tri forum about Crossfit Endurance ("CFE") and tri training.
forum.slowtwitch.com/gforum.cgi
I've done a few Crossfit workouts at a local gym. They're fantastic workouts, don't get me wrong, but only some of it (mostly core and explosive/plyometric) workouts would benefit tri training, IMHO. Especially given RnP's specificity and weight training arguments. In the EN OS, any workout that impacts another downstream workout is bad.
But the CFE workouts seem more like track workouts. They do seem to follow the high-intensity EN method vs the LSD training method that others espouse. Granted, while crossfit has a national "model", from what I understand, each gym is allowed and encouraged to come up with their own program, so a lot of variance can exist.
I just wanted to get your feedback. Anyone else ever done it?
Comments
Never done it but there at least a small handful of these...gigs...squads...gyms...(?) in my area. First the fitness bootcamp thing and now some of them have been morphed into these, I get a kick out of what appear to be former military types in fatigue pants and black t-shirts kinda yelling a people in the grass early in the morning
.
Anyway, I'm highly suspect of CFE's role in proper endurance training, but if I had to make a choice between what I do now and something else, I'd probably do some combination of running, cycling, and P90X, Crossfit type training. My personal definition of fitness has always been the ability to go "that way" for a long time, while still being able to carry heavy loads, do lots of body weight stuff, things like that. I guess run 6-8 miles, hump a pack, and smoke the obstacle course like back in the day.
That said, I jumped on my pullup bar and hit the floor last night for some pushups and would be embarrased to report the numbers...but I'm a good sore right now.
Scott:
don't get me started on cross fit, man...mainly i really don't like the vibe. lots of posturing , etc. blah blah blah.
from a strictly training perspective for triathlon, however, if your tri preference is sprint distance or olympic, then some of the explosive stuff can help.
however, when you study what our bodies were designed to do, endurance is what we are all about. yes, we need basic strength, but with proper leverage, we can be strong enough for most tasks that fall within the realm of what we were designed to do. i can carry a fallen friend with the right technique and definitely don't need to powerlift him/her home. etc. etc.
as you point out, core work is key for our ability to execute any movement efficiently, especially swim, bike and run. so is flexibility, which is why any strength training needs to be combined with flexibility, which almost never happens. it's rare to go to cross fit class and then go to yoga class and find the same people!
i like to study what movements will make me a better swimmer biker and runner, then i go out and try to practice those movements, all the while making sure that it fits with what our bodies were designed to do, in order to avoid injury and illness. so, you won't necessarily find it all in one cross fit class. you'll probably have to think up a custom plan that is fun for you and useful for your racing and takes into account the areas where you need to improve..
a sort of cross training long course tri-jitsu (bruce lee took the best from many different forms of martial arts to make his own and called it ju-jitsu):
My cross training tri-jitsu, specific to my limitations, is still being developed, but here are some examples:
swim: my cross training for this is a bunch of shoulder centered yoga, since i stiffen up when i try to get my arms and shoulders to enter the water and pull properly. i am smooth up to a point and then my lack of flexibility kicks in and i tighten up. also i do core work for good body position.
bike: core core core. allows me to keep pressure on the pedals smoothly and efficiently. one of the most sport specific core exercises for aero position is the plank position from pilates. have you seen this one? it's a great one. i just close my eyes and imagine i am riding in the aerobars. also, i do road riding and NOT ONLY in the seated position and not only at one speed. i sprint during a session, i climb standing during a session, i ride with no hands for a part of the session, etc. etc. just to get skills and overall neuromuscular connections firing and oiled.
run: itb stretching; core again; minimalist shoes for a strong foot, proper technique and prevent injuries; trail running is what i am most excited about this year (requires high rpms, never boring, lots of ups and downs/changes in pace); and track middle distance running with fast guys for speed; also, to warm up on the trails, i've started kicking a rock or rocks down the path, while keeping my stride--> not my invention, took it from the raramuri in the book, "born to run", but it keeps my center of gravity centered over my non kicking foot (good endurance running posture), keeps my stride at an efficient endurance length because otherwise i'll lose my balance when kicking.
so far so good with this approach in terms of performance progress, but for sure it's made the whole process fun for me.
i vote for you to create your own tri-jitsu vs. cross fit, more fun and best use of your time!
GH
scott: i did not mention explicitly the 'endurance' part of the cross fit you were referring to, but it's basically 'endurance' for people who do cross fit and not endurance in the way we think about it at EN. sorry for not being clear. the OS is the foundation for us and the tri-jitsu is the personal touch to get the most out of the OS.
gh
Semper Fi, Rich. USMC bought hook, line, and sinker into CF for a while but seems to have backed off a bit recently. Had an almost opportunity (that life box got in the way) to attend a CF Instructor clinic on the USMC dime. Did some research ahead of time and I've done several CF workouts, both with and without trainers. My take is that the bar is set too low to get qualified as a CF instructor. Don't get me wrong, there are some great ones out there and I love the "functional" approach to fitness. But multi-joint, multi-planar moves require very good technique or you are absolutely asking to get injured. Too many times the CF model is the dude in cammies yelling "faster!" with little regard for the biomechanics (usually poor) and compensation (usually extreme) that the poor bastard getting yelled at is using. I've had several friends get hurt playing around with CF. I also did some diving into CFE and they seem to be proponents of the Pose method of running. From what I can tell, Chi, Pose, Evo are all slightly different slices of the same cake. I have not had the opportunity to do an actual CFE workout so I can't comment on how well they stick to good form coaching vs. yelling "Faster!" You can get qualified as either a CF or CFE instructor in a weekend. I put that in comparison to my wife who is a PT, CSCS, TRX Instructor, and Stott Pilates instructor. Discount the college degree and years of experience as a PT and she still has hundreds of hours of training to get her other qualifications and fairly high ConEd requirements to maintain them (CF does mandate ConEd).
I will admit that I do frequently disregard RnP's advice (sorry, Rich) and do strength training. But, it is based on my 20 years of racing triathlon and knowing my own body. Strength training (a combo of TRX, functional/metabolic/CF-like work, and Yoga) helps keep me from getting injured. If I lose a little oomph on the next bike/run workout but am healthy enough to make it through the season, then I'm better off than killing that next workout only to find myself hurt and training at 0 mph the following week. Oh and Rich, I hit 20 pullups like it's cool at the age of 40. (Full disclosure: I only weigh a 120# so it is a little bit like clubbing baby seals.) But I'm with you, fitness is the ability to climb a mountain, rock a mogul run, surf big waves for an hour, or hump a pack (as an aviator I don't really do that...) for a long way. Or race Ironman.
Scott: one more thing, now that i think about it and follows logan's point of getting qualified coaching. should you decide that you need track style middle distance sessions to work on speed, then do them with actual running groups, with pure runners or supervised by pure runners/coaches. they know how to gear these sessions properly and they often follow very closely to the EN OS, just broken down a bit. like instead of 3x 1mile, you'll do the 3 miles but broken up in to 400/800/1200, etc. repeats.
good luck!
gh