Home Ironman Coeur d'Alene 2011 Group Discussion-Ironman Coeur d'Alene 2011

General Prep Week 1?

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  • Not me... in week 19 of NovOS. Probably do a 1-week transition and then pick it up from there...
  • @Greg - I am in with you. I am about to hop on the bike for our brick ride today. I broke down and needed a break from the NOS group and went ahead and did a week and a half transition and hopped into our 20 week plan as of Monday. So, the party is getting started tomorrow with my first run over 75 minutes in a LONG time. I sm already fearing this first long weekend...probably will make me want to go back into OS again! Just kidding, i am ready for some suffering and ready for IM to get here!
  • I just started week 5 of the Ironman training plan on Monday, after switching from the December OS group. Is the General Prep basically the same as the first 8 weeks of the Ironman training plan? I think it might be.

    It feels good to get back in the pool after months of not swimming. I've decided to add Wednesday as a third swim day, in addition to the Monday and Friday swim days. I NEED the swim practice since my form isn't very good. I'm hoping to be much faster than my 2:08 swim at IMFL. And I also am getting excited for some long runs and bike rides!
  • @Scott - FWIW my N=1 is that finding a swim coach can be a huge help, even if it is just a few times... really helped me alot last year. Swimming is so technique driven that it is really hard to get better by just doing more of it. Pretty sure that RnP say something similar somewhere in the wiki...
  • Crikrey! I'm doing the 4 week gen prep followed by 12 week intermediate IM plan. Does that sound weird at all to anyone?
  • @ Art, thanks for the advice. I will definitely look into options for a swim coach. I've thought about doing the Mary Meyer swim clinic in the past, but my main concern with that was not knowing how much attention I would get since it's a group class. Also, I think my gym offers private lessons, so that might be a better option.
  • General Prep is just the first 8 weeks of a 12wk IM plan I believe.
    @Greg, you are fine. Though you should have done the Nov OS instead of Oct.
    I'm planning on finishing out the OS, 2wk transition with a nice 4 day big bike focus thrown in there. Hoping for some nice weather!
  • You know what's crazy. I went all the way to like week 14 of the OS before restarting it. Let's just say I'm ready for some change.

    Pending my brick workout. First, got to survive my flight home. One step at a time!
  • +1 on Nov OS... Serious mojo in there.

    Will say I am draaaaggggiiiiinnnngggg myself to the finish though.
  • @Scott: I second Arts suggestion on a swim coach. I just finally found one that I am comfortable with and am hoping she can get me to 2.4 miles in the next 4 months. However, focusing on smaller goals. By the end of the month hoping to be able to swim 1800yds non-stop.

    I am a straggler and still working through the JOS. Won't be starting IM plan until April 1.
  • Okay,

    So scrawny me will get the numbers started. After yesterdays outside 7 miler and today's flying around Montana adventure, I was a cooked goose before even getting on the bike. Still, just couldnt let today pass by, so I climbed on for some pain. 60 min with 3X8 zone 4, finish zone 3. Then 30 brick run:

    Entire Workout (1:00:01.48):

        Duration:      1:00:00

        Work:          562 kJ

        TSS:           62.5 (intensity factor 0.794)

        Norm Power:    167

        VI:            1.07

        Pw:HR:          0.15%

        Pa:HR:          5.45%

        Distance:      76.728 mi

        Elevation Gain:        916 ft

        Elevation Loss:       917 ft

        Grade:         0.0 %  (1 ft)

            Min    Max    Avg

        Power:           0    216    156     watts

        Heart Rate:      64    173    155     bpm

        Cadence:         40    115    82     rpm

        Speed:           0    79.8    76.8     mph

        Pace             0:45    0:00    0:47     min/mi

        Altitude:        2933    3115    3052     ft

        Crank Torque:    0    309    161     lb-in



    New Range #1:

        Duration:      8:02

        Work:          92 kJ

        TSS:           11.2 (intensity factor 0.913)

        Norm Power:    192

        VI:            1

        Pw:HR:          1.02%

        Pa:HR:          4.22%

        Distance:      10.436 mi

        Elevation Gain:        105 ft

        Elevation Loss:       165 ft

        Grade:         -0.1 %  (-62 ft)

            Min    Max    Avg

        Power:           129    216    192     watts

        Heart Rate:      143    167    161     bpm

        Cadence:         75    99    85     rpm

        Speed:           77.9    79.6    77.9     mph

        Pace             0:45    0:46    0:46     min/mi

        Altitude:        3003    3094    3052     ft

        Crank Torque:    136    209    191     lb-in



    New Range #2:

        Duration:      8:00

        Work:          92 kJ

        TSS:           11.1 (intensity factor 0.911)

        Norm Power:    191

        VI:            1

        Pw:HR:          1.51%

        Pa:HR:          3.2%

        Distance:      10.533 mi

        Elevation Gain:        75 ft

        Elevation Loss:       58 ft

        Grade:         0.0 %  (11 ft)

            Min    Max    Avg

        Power:           62    210    192     watts

        Heart Rate:      150    171    166     bpm

        Cadence:         74    102    86     rpm

        Speed:           76    79    79.0     mph

        Pace             0:46    0:47    0:46     min/mi

        Altitude:        3046    3115    3068     ft

        Crank Torque:    64    205    188     lb-in



    New Range #3:

        Duration:      8:00

        Work:          90 kJ

        TSS:           10.6 (intensity factor 0.893)

        Norm Power:    187

        VI:            1

        Pw:HR:          3.13%

        Pa:HR:          5.21%

        Distance:      10.391 mi

        Elevation Gain:        167 ft

        Elevation Loss:       209 ft

        Grade:         -0.1 %  (-45 ft)

            Min    Max    Avg

        Power:           0    214    188     watts

        Heart Rate:      142    173    166     bpm

        Cadence:         55    115    86     rpm

        Speed:           44.6    78.7    78.0     mph

        Pace             0:46    1:21    0:46     min/mi

        Altitude:        3019    3087    3054     ft

        Crank Torque:    0    309    186     lb-in



    In short, tonight really sucked. Little short on the numbers and hurt all the way through. Even the easy 30 minutes after sucked. Oh well, its done. BTW, I have no idea what is going on with the speed, but I dont really mind.

     

  • Man...a 90 min run is long when you're used to all those OS 60 minute runs. I was hurting to get through it today! Feels good to put some distance on the body again...CdA, here we come!
  • @Stephen: Yeah, that totally sucked today. Really sucked. Mostly 9:45 pace for nine miles at 1:27. Compression socks take me away.
  • @Greg - I like your speed on the bike too.  Avg about 78 mph.  What's your secret?  Must be that clean Montana air.   Looks like you have 90 minute  IM bike split in you.  Are we looking at a new course record?

    I'm in week 14 of the Dec OS. Did the bike and run tests this week.  Good results and I'm not sore or too tired.  I have a half mary @ the end of week 15, which will conclude my OS.  Then 2 weeks of transition with lots of swimming.  Then I'm starting the 12 IM  plan on April 4.    However, since I have the half mary coming up, I've been extending the Sunday OS runs to 90-100 minutes for the last month.  Since I've raced 3 marathons in the last 16 months, my run legs are able to handle the extra distance ok.  But the bike is a whole other story.   Just working to build up my endurance.

  • @Bruce: Like Charlie Sheen, Its because I have tiger blood!

    After yesterday, ready for a nice swim day. Anyone else?

  • @ Greg: yup, hit the pool this morning for my 4th swim of my "re-start"... 2200 yards with ~1700 of them pull-only... felt pretty good... feels like form/feel is coming back around a bit... followng the beginning of the OS swim hack until I jump on the IM plan in a couple of weeks...
  • @Van, what does the schedule look like? I think it's pretty similar to the HIM plan but am just too damn lazy to switch my plan back and forth. I figure it is:
    Monday - Swim
    Tuesday - Swim and run
    Wednesday - Interval bike and run
    Thursday - Long run
    Firday - Swim
    Saturday - Long Bike
    Sunday - ABP Bike

    Is that about right? I think there may be more short runs thrown in there but not sure.
    Or is general prep different from the IM plan? I can't remember.
  • @ Tucker: Pretty much I think:

    Monday - Swim

    Tuesday - Interval run

    Wednesday - Interval bike and brick

    Thursday - Long run

    Firday - Swim

    Saturday - Long Bike

    Sunday - ABP Bike

    Just finished 2000y in the pool. Loving the drills and feeling good. Doesnt look like I lost anything from last year. Time to eat for tomorrow!

  • Posted By Art Zaske on 11 Mar 2011 11:24 AM

    @ Greg: yup, hit the pool this morning for my 4th swim of my "re-start"... 2200 yards with ~1700 of them pull-only... felt pretty good... feels like form/feel is coming back around a bit... followng the beginning of the OS swim hack until I jump on the IM plan in a couple of weeks...

    Nice Art. I love the ebook drills, especially the fist drill half and halfs. Good stuff.

  • @ Peter - I'm with you. I'm currently in JOS and planning a 2-week transition the last 2 weeks of March and then starting the 12-week IMCDA race prep on 4/4.

  •  I was looking at today's workout and was wondering how to interpret it.  Here is the main set:


    MS:

    • 2 x 10' (4') @ FT/z4-5, 10' Easy
    • 4 x 10' (4') @ 80-85%/z3; cadence as twice thru:
      • #1=80rpm
      • #2=90 rpm
      • #3=100 rpm
      • #4 = self-selected
    • Remainder of available time is 75-80%...or harder if you feel like it.

    The way I interpret the second bullet point is to do 10' @ 80 rpm, 10' @ 90 rpm, 10' @ 100 rpm, 10' @ self selected rpm, 10' @ 80 rpm, 10' @ 90 rpm, 10' @ 100 rpm, 10' @ self selected rpm.  So really it's 8 x 10' @ z3 not 4 x 10' @ z3, right?  It's confusing me that it says 4 x 10' but then says twice thru four different cadences.  What do you all think it means?

  • I am not sure how either...but, I did the z4 stuff and then just tried to hold z3 as much as possible, and i was humbled by the experience today! Gotta get that mileage back up after OS! 3 hours felt like an eternity!
  • @ Stephen, I ended up taking the same approach. By the time I finished the 2 x 10' @ z4 and 4 x 10' @ z3 my legs were hurting. I ended up doing 2 x 15' @ 75-80% and the rest @ z1. I really struggled the entire third hour, but was able to push thru and get it done. I think I've gotten a little too use to the shorter OS workouts. With only 3 weeks until Oceanside 70.3, I'm glad I'm getting some longer workouts in.
  • Okay guys, here's my damage from yesterday. Did 2:30 on the trainer with 3x8' Zone 4, 2X12' Zone 3, and then rest zone 1-2. Followed it ba 30 minute brick run.

    Entire Workout: (2:30:04.08):

        Duration:      2:30:04

        Work:          1321 kJ

        TSS:           140.9 (intensity factor 0.752)

        Norm Power:    158

        VI:            1.08

        Pw:HR:          2.69%

        Pa:HR:          -2.94%

      

            Min    Max    Avg

        Power:           0    226    147     watts

        Heart Rate:      66    168    146     bpm

        Cadence:         30    136    81     rpm

        Crank Torque:    0    394    152     lb-in



    8' Zone 4:

        Duration:      8:00

        Work:          94 kJ

        TSS:           11.7 (intensity factor 0.935)

        Norm Power:    196

        VI:            1

        Pw:HR:          1.72%

        Pa:HR:          4.93%

            Min    Max    Avg

        Power:           164    224    197     watts

        Heart Rate:      131    161    155     bpm

        Cadence:         78    107    84     rpm

        Crank Torque:    148    220    199     lb-in



    8' Zone 4:

        Duration:      8:00

        Work:          96 kJ

        TSS:           12 (intensity factor 0.951)

        Norm Power:    200

        VI:            0.99

        Pw:HR:          -1.04%

        Pa:HR:          5.07%

            Min    Max    Avg

        Power:           160    226    201     watts

        Heart Rate:      134    166    159     bpm

        Cadence:         75    93    85     rpm

        Crank Torque:    175    218    198     lb-in



    8' Zone 4:

        Duration:      8:00

        Work:          93 kJ

        TSS:           11.4 (intensity factor 0.924)

        Norm Power:    194

        VI:            1

        Pw:HR:          -1.17%

        Pa:HR:          4.37%

            Min    Max    Avg

        Power:           110    222    194     watts

        Heart Rate:      142    168    161     bpm

        Cadence:         67    100    86     rpm

        Crank Torque:    99    215    191     lb-in



    12:00 Zone 3:

        Duration:      12:00

        Work:          119 kJ

        TSS:           12.5 (intensity factor 0.791)

        Norm Power:    166

        VI:            1

        Pw:HR:          0.78%

        Pa:HR:          -26.93%

            Min    Max    Avg

        Power:           38    189    166     watts

        Heart Rate:      151    157    154     bpm

        Crank Torque:    40    251    167     lb-in

     

    12:00 Zone 3:

        Duration:      12:00

        Work:          121 kJ

        TSS:           12.8 (intensity factor 0.8)

        Norm Power:    168

        VI:            1

        Pw:HR:          0.38%

        Pa:HR:          2.55%

            Min    Max    Avg

        Power:           0    191    168     watts

        Heart Rate:      143    158    153     bpm

        Cadence:         40    106    85     rpm

        Crank Torque:    0    281    168     lb-in

    Wasnt too bad, especially starting at 5:00 am. I took one scoop of Perpetuem for every hour on the bike. Looks like I need to up that becuase I ended up completely drained by the last 10 minutes of the run. Other than that, transition off the bike was good.

    Had to push todays ABP ride to tomorrow as Im recovering from a homebrew party last night. Got to have priorities you know. Hope everyone is having a good weekend!

     

  • All - I train with HR and pace so I don't have all the fancy numbers like Greg (not sure I even understand half of them), so here is my weekend stuff.

    Sat Bike - 15' WU. 4 x 2.5' ON/OFF @ HR 163,165,164,166.  Legs felt fine but mentally I had a hard time finishing each interval.  I think it could be just mental fatigue from the OS week 14 tests this week.  Then to build endurance I rode 3 hours in spin class @ HR Z3 142-149 (ok there were some cute ladies in the class to distract me and I lost track of the time).  Total time on bike 3 hours, 35 minutes.  Also tried my Infinit formula for the first time + lots of H2O.  Seemed to work well. No cramps & I felt good.

    Sat Swim - 3000 yards with my swim coach.  He chewed me out for riding that long before getting in the pool and made me pay (I think he was jealous) with a speed workout.  Did sets of 200s, 100s, 50s and 25s.    Thought I was gonna die.  He also gave me some good pointers on technique. Got to rotate more and make sure I don't cross the center with my left arm.

    Sat Nap - 1 x 60'.  Best part of the day.

    Sun Run - 12 miles @ 8:10 avg pace.  Did 3 x 600 hill repeats @ 6:45 pace and then ran a few more hills as part of the 12.  Quads felt a little tight but not as bad as I expect following Sat ride.  But later in the day I aggrevated an old hip flexor strain by turning quickly while opening a door (pretty stupid way to get hurt).  So I've iced it twice already and will do so once more before bed.  Rest tomorrow and we'll see how it feels this week.  I'm registered to race a half marathon next sunday, but now I will be very cautious.  Might pull out if the hip is still sore.

    Hope everyone is training well and injury free.

  • My ABP Bike workout today was tough, especially after yesterday's long bike. The workout was 150 minutes and called for as much z3 as possible. I ended up doing 4 x 20' @ z3. I was surprised that I was able to make it thru the last interval. Here are my numbers for the weekend.

    Saturday:

    Duration: 3:02:11
    Work: 1711 kJ
    TSS: 174.7 (intensity factor 0.76)
    Norm Power: 164
    VI: 1.05
    Pw:HR: n/a
    Pa:HR: n/a
    Distance: 51.221 mi
    Min Max Avg
    Power: 0 263 157 watts
    Cadence: 30 112 86 rpm
    Speed: 0 19.9 16.7 mph
    Pace 3:01 0:00 3:36 min/mi
    Hub Torque: 0 11 6 lb-in
    Crank Torque: 0 411 153 lb-in

    Sunday:

    Duration: 2:33:29
    Work: 1446 kJ
    TSS: 143.8 (intensity factor 0.751)
    Norm Power: 162
    VI: 1.03
    Pw:HR: n/a
    Pa:HR: n/a
    Distance: 42.754 mi
    Min Max Avg
    Power: 0 240 157 watts
    Cadence: 32 114 85 rpm
    Speed: 0 18.5 16.7 mph
    Pace 3:14 0:00 3:36 min/mi
    Hub Torque: 0 14 6 lb-in
    Crank Torque: 0 471 156 lb-in

    @ Greg, I didn't realize you were a homebrewer. Are you bringing some of your own beer to the RR?

    @ Bruce, those ladies must have REALLY been good looking if you inadvertently added 36 minutes to your ride. Also, good call on the 1 x 60' nap interval. It's nice to fit those into your weekend training.
  • Yeah, I would agree this weekend felt tough. I ended up doing the long run on Friday due to weather and illness, followed by the long ride on Saturday. I made it through the FTP, and the two sets of 4 cadences on the trainer, although managed to blow a tire and had to do an emergency wheel swap after about 2:20 into the ride.

    Sunday went to do my ABP and legs felt it, went outside as the weather was okay, but found that my front brake was sticking a bit into the ride so fiddled with that and rode back to fix it. Then just finished off last two hours on the trainer instead with the legs pretty much shot, but did manage to hold the 80% for 1.5 hours.
  • @Tucker: You know it. But it is only for everyone who is 6:30 or slower

  • I did it... I scheduled my first private swim lesson for this Thursday. Thanks to Art and Peter for pushing me in the right direction. I need that sometimes. Hopefully my instructor will be able to help me on my form, because I definitely need it.
  • @Scott: Good move! Let us know how it goes...
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