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PT Cervo vs. Joule

henrysaccohenrysacco
in General Training Discussions

This is a bit of an extension of David McLaughlin's question on power, but specific to a real time racing question.

I currently own the PT Cervo head and have used it for power during the OS and leading up to IMLP. I "watch" the real time power indicator to determine my power during workouts, first memorizing my power zones. The display is all over the place (even with 5 seconds intervals set) which makes it difficult.

I now understand that the Joule can display TSS, IF, etc and i'm considering purchasing it. My question is this...

What can provide me with a better indication of my "gearing" during an IM event? I suspect a Joule...

If so, any suggestions on configuration/settings? 

Comments

  • kmephamkmepham
    I just made the switch from the Cervo head to the Joule for the reason you stated - I got frustrated by the fact that no matter how much I watched the bouncing power reading and tried to manage it, when I got home and analyzed the file in WKO+, I had always missed the NP target. Really, what are your chances of hitting a target you can't even see? With the Joule, having NP on the display right next to current Watts = success. (IF doesn't matter if you have memorized your zones, and TSS will be what it will be, I don't see the point in displaying it.) It's also nice to see Speed for the downhills without sacrificing my Cadence display, and to see both Mileage and Time. Not to mention increased safety - I don't have to look at NP as much as I had to look at Watts when all I had was Watts. Definitely recommend getting the Joule.
  • Bob IrwinBob Irwin
    NP is based on 30 second averages. So you can be all over the place and still have NP that comes close to your target. I don't have a Joule, so I can't comment on that, but my Garmin shows 30s and 3s averages. That seems to work pretty well once you get used to what it means. But during a race, you really want to keep your current watts as close as you can to your target.
  • mgraffeomgraffeo
    I think the Joule is a terrific tool, for lots of reasons. But helping you hit your goal gears in an IM is not one of them.

    Having NP displayed can be helpful, if you're riding a little too hot. You see the number a little high, decide to back off a touch, and things get better. But, and this is what is more likely to happen with our easy 30 minute approach, if the NP is a little low, your brain will struggle, wanting to see that NP up "where it's supposed to be", and you'll ride harder. This is not the point.

    The whole reason why RnP advocate taping the gears onto your aerobars is that the bike in an IM is a series of choices. All day long, its "how hard should I be riding right now? On this hill, on this downhill, coming out of this turn, as I want to pass that guy/girl in front of me, as I'm coming out of a turnaround, etc". The only think you can control is your effort on the next pedal stroke, and the 4 gears tell you exactly what to do in that moment. The whole concept of the gears gives you a very specific tool to address each choice along the way.

    Learning how to ride those gears is a quintessential technique of racing the EN way. No purchase makes it easier. Only practice. Yes, the power numbers fluctuate. Yes, you won't see exactly the goal gear each second/pedal stroke/minute. But, you can use the muscle between your ears to decide what to do about it.
  • gilliattgilliatt
    x2 on what Mike said, you gotta practice riding steady period.
  • henrysaccohenrysacco

    Great feedback from all of you. Really appreciate it!!!

  • Scott AlexanderScott Alexander
    Posted By Mike Graffeo on 16 May 2011 04:27 PM

    Having NP displayed can be helpful, if you're riding a little too hot. You see the number a little high, decide to back off a touch, and things get better. But, and this is what is more likely to happen with our easy 30 minute approach, if the NP is a little low, your brain will struggle, wanting to see that NP up "where it's supposed to be", and you'll ride harder. This is not the point.

    On my old school Ergomo (no smack talking please!!) display I show my IF (intensity factor), and it's the same slippery slope that Mike G. mentions here. If my overall IF isn't as high as I wanted for the ride, I find myself pushing harder and harder to get to the level I want, while frequently burning too many matches too late in the game.

  • vabchtriguyvabchtriguy
    To avoid the "my NP is too low" caused by riding the first 30-60 minutes at lower than goal, I did the following for a simple solution during Kinetic Half...
    Use the interval function. Ride for that warm-up period, press interval to start the next and then press and hold interval to display your current interval. If it helps you can break up the ride into 15,30,60 min intervals so you know what your NP is for a shorter period and aren't trying to push to get your goal NP.

    I've been using my Joule for a couple months now and am still feeling it out for training and racing uses, but I can say that having NPand Watts right there kept me from pushing too hard and from going too easy.

    Hope this helps.
  • John StarkJohn Stark

     Mike is right on about gears.  And I LOVE Matt's comment of making each part of the bike "execution" an interval. 

    I have found the Joule to be an indispensible tool for all areas.  The LYC numbers bouncing all over was just painful.  With the Joule I find I am actually more consistent overall in my bike execution.  For me, the more real-time data in my face to go along with my execution strategy the better.

    Other than racing with it, the Joule is fabulous for bike intervals.  To see real-time NP during an interval is fabulous.  It is an electronic whip.  When your NP drops by just 1 you are mentally forced to take it back.  No gray area or guessing.  

     

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