need an adjustment ?

cgres123

My last two Saturday training rides yielded a TSS of 318 and 348 respectively. P said legit , R said your FTP is off.

I went through the Power Webinar this weekend . I had purchased WKO about a month ago and the Webinar a few months ago.Things started to make sense to me. That is one reason to revisit the Webinar and I discovered a few things.

As to my last 2 weekend rides. Lets look at the TSS of 348 , I spent 2 min @ 256, 5 min @ 202 and 10 min @ 194. My last FTP test of training week 8 showed a FTP of 191. I rode my ass of generating those TSS scores , with in my ability any way, I don't see another FTP test in my IM program as which I'm in week 11 of 20 beginner plan.



My BTD # 1 , my ride was 4hr TSS of 236, NP 145 avg w 138, VI 1.05, IF .76 and 68 miles total.

This leads me to believe I will be in the saddle for about 6:15 to 6:30 hours for my IM .

My run after that bike sucked, blew up after 30 min, Vdot is 37/38 , it was HOT and Humid. Anyway Matt posted a walk run calculator that I think fits my needs better. The 2nd BTD weekend was this weekend and it was literally a wash with a hurricane hitting us . So I'm moving on in training.



Adjust the FTP ?

IM , time and watts look ok ?

You see anything here I haven't listed ?

GMAN 19030

Are you basing that 6:15-6:30 time off the .76 IF & 145w NP? Remember, you won't be riding a .76 IF on race day... more like .7 or lower.

Peter Greagg

Hi David - I am no WSM. But I have had a power meter for almost a year. When I am doing my zone 4 intervals (95% to 100% of FTP) for, say 15 mins, I have a fair idea what my FTP is.
If I am struggling in intervals of 15 mins, that suggests my FTP lower than I thought as you are supposed to be able to sit on your FTP for 60 mins.

So how are your long zone 4 intervals?

Chhers
Peter

mgraffeo

David, post the summary from your last few long rides, it will help. In general, a 4 hour ride with a TSS of 236 seems about right/reasonable. The TSS's you're quoting, how long were those rides?

I'm guessing that your FTP is right, but a 28 day power distribution chart would help.

As to your IM time, how much do you weigh? What course are you doing? I did IMLP averaging about 160 watts at 154 pounds, and finished in about 6:15 or so. At your FTP, you should be riding around 135 watts for an IM.

cgres123

@ Bob, yes I'm looking to hold that pace and perhaps bump up my FTP a few points by then so as I'm not on that saddle all day. My big training days coming up will help me dial that in some more.

@ Peter, just like you mate they are hard as is all this stuff but if it were easy everbody would do it !

Mike , the rides were 4 hr to 4hr 5 min,

Power Distribution Last 28 Days
From To Duration
Active recovery 20634
Endurance 33841
Tempo 17016

I weigh 178, Im doing Beach to Battle Ship in NC , Iron Distance. 135 watts ....wow that is painfullly slow
Threshold 5380
VO2max 2800
Anaerobic capacity 2981

GMAN 19030

Only look to hold that pace if you had a legit bump in your FTP that's measured through testing and training. To go 145W at .70 IF would mean a FTP of 207. Can you legitimately get your FTP up to 207 by B2B? Don't chase a magical number if it isn't there. That's a recipe for disaster. Going 5% too much on the bike will have repercussions on the run. Guaranteed.

The numbers are what the numbers are. 135W may sound painfully slow to you but the reality is that's probably just like 10 minutes more on the bike then if you did 145W. That extra 10 minutes on the bike might save you 1 hour on the run. This is assuming your FTP is 191 and not 207. If your next FTP test gives you a higher number than adjust accordingly.

cgres123

@ Bob , Thanks ! I just did a retest off my FTP and did bump it up to 197, I wanted in that 200 club , so I have 8 more weeks to earn my numbers. I will be doing , I think 2 , 6hr rides and will dial it in that much more.
How did you do the math to get me at the 207 FTP listed above. It would help me to learn that so I can adjust my numbers myself in the future.

jburbatt

+1 on what Bob said. Overall it won't make that huge of a difference on the bike, but will definitely have some serious reprocussions on the run. EN mantra #1- there's no good bike without a good run

GMAN 19030

Posted By David McLaughlin on 31 Aug 2011 08:09 AM

@ Bob , Thanks ! I just did a retest off my FTP and did bump it up to 197, I wanted in that 200 club , so I have 8 more weeks to earn my numbers. I will be doing , I think 2 , 6hr rides and will dial it in that much more.

How did you do the math to get me at the 207 FTP listed above. It would help me to learn that so I can adjust my numbers myself in the future.

145/.7



 

mgraffeo

318 and 348 in 4 hours? That's about 80 TSS per hour, or riding at about 90% of FTP for 4 hours. Unless you were completely obliterated at the end, your FTP is set too low.

Take a look at the 28 day power distribution chart, in 10 watt buckets, and look for the biggest drop. That will point to where your FTP is.

What was your average power and normalized power on these rides?

cgres123

@ Bob , Thanks for the math lesson !

@ Jennifer , Your right , I'm a hard head.

@Mike, The 318 TSS Avg was 139 with a NP of 170 VI 1.22 , IF .917
. The 348 TSS was 4hr 12min Avg Per of 152 , Norm pwr was 174 , VI 1.14 and an IF .94

How do I look at the 28 day power distribution chart in 10 watt buckets ?
As to my FTP I retested 2 days ago and I bumped it up to 197 , does that make any of this make sense ?

GMAN 19030

Your VI is very high for your rides... unless you're riding in the Rocky Mountains and not New Jersey. You need to work and concentrate on smoothing that out.

You also should not be able to ride 4:15 at 94%. I agree with Mike that your FTP is set too low. Were your FTP tests done indoors or outdoors? If you're basing your FTP off an indoor test that could explain why your IF is so high on outdoor rides. Most of us have an outdoor FTP and an indoor FTP. I test indoors but adjust mine upwards by about 10% when outdoors. I'm sure you have noticed that holding XX watts outdoors is much easier than holding the XX watts indoors.

cgres123

@ Bob , these rides are with the local rodies who do the Sat tour de Jersey , they do it all wrong according to our way of riding . They don't run nor swim so they kill each other on Saturday's.
I chase them on my Tri bike and work my ass off doing that, as you can see by my numbers. Don't you think that is a good idea to kick butt , my own , once a week on a Saturday to try and build fitness over and above and ride our way on Sunday ?
My FTP was done on Tue this week and I bumped it up to 197 vs my 191. Something I did notice was during my test the first 20 min I was doing a lot of cadence work and wasn't putting much pwr to the pedals. On the 20 min turn around I concentrated on less cadence and more power, which worked my number were about 10 watts higher.
This made me think that I have been testing to easy, hard with cadence but not putting much ass into it as I noticed I did on my 2nd 20.
I may be testing incorrectly, ???
And my test was outside.
Thx D

mgraffeo

David, nothing wrong with a high VI ride if you did it on purpose. Actually a good way to bump up the TSS, and get a ton of work in. As long as you know that you can race with a low VI, training with a low VI doesn't help, and can have some downsides if done too much.

On the FTP, go with the 197 number. If you're spiking the watts a ton during a ride, and it's a real butt-kicker of a ride, I can see putting up TSS numbers in that range, even if they do seem a bit high. The bump from 191 to 197 helps, and your real FTP may be a few watts higher, but just go with the test for now, and in the next one, push yourself a little harder in the first 20 to see what you can do.

cgres123

@Mike , Thanks will do !

mgraffeo

BTW, I'm guessing that your next FTP test is going to put you in the 210+ range.

cgres123

Yea the 200 Club ! I started here at a 168 ,that will be a hoot in my world !!