VO2 results vs. Threshold results - Power profile?

jayadams

Funny thing, want to know how you all relate (or don't) to this:

I have an FTP of 257w and Vdot of 39.25 for reference.

I just started week 9 of my OS plan (first week of VO2 max thresholds).

120% of FTP should be 308 watts.  I find that for my VO2 max threshold intervals (2.5' on / 2.5' off), I'm much more comfortable pushing these thresholds up around 330 watts (almost 130% of FTP) and on Tuesday and Thursday of this week did my 4 intervals at 329, 331, 331, 332 and 331, 329, 330, 331 respectively...so it's not like I imploded on the third interval and limped in on the fourth.  They all felt very "controlled" (using that word loosely here) but extremely challenging.

Similarly, on my VO2 runs my Vdot driven Z5 interval pace should be 7:56/mi.  But that felt very pedestrian to me, so I ran my 200m and 400m intervals at around a 6:15/mi pace on a track, and while they felt challenging, they were very much under control.  I knocked them all out while jogging about 200m between them and then kept banging them out right on pace.  800's at that pace would be doable, but challenging.  A mile at that pace? Forget about it, no chance.

Conversely, my FTP test and Vdot test which yielded the aforementioned scores were extremely challenging over the 2x20'(2') and 5k TT time and distance, so I have no doubt that those results are very close to best effort.

I guess my question is: is it possible that my personal "power profile" is very heavily weighted to being VO2 power dominant, and that I might be more suited to events like track or criterium cycling which require bursts of power than 112 mile TT's and marathons?  For the record, I was a football player through high school, so everything I did was 5 seconds at a time, at breakneck effort, so maybe that shaped my muscular development and memory (and maybe I am fast-twitch dominant...dammit...)

How might I better cultivate my strengths and transform my weaknesses?

I welcome your thoughts, thanks in advance!

Jay

kurshing

Jay, I had a similar question last year during my second OS. Here is what I heard as a response to that question.

Those zones are correct, and the zones have 2 elements surrounding them:

1. What does it take, exertion-wise, to get faster?
2. What can I fully ad repeatedly recover from in light of the big picture - 5 hard workouts per 7 day cycle.

Here are my thoughts: you may not have to go as fast as you went to have positive adaptations and to get faster. However, it is also true that some people exert power in a manner that makes them a better sprinter versus attacker in cycling, so, it certainly could be as you have assessed, you may be more of the spriter. The other possibility is that you might have a slightly better FTP than you achieved on the test.

My suggestion would be to continue to Challene yourself, but pay very close attention to your recovery. Don't let it suffer - you can dig a hole for yourself really quickly in these OS plans. If you DO push those limits, do so in a subtle manner as you did - don't drift up to 150% of FTP or vDot z5.

Good luck bud. Work hard!

(oh, and if you really are stronger at tho VO2 max stuff, make sure your head is in the game for those FTP intervals - you have lots of positive improvements you can make there; which will translate to raised FTP!

kurshing

You could also try doing your next FTP test as 1x20 and take 95% as your FTP. It may produce a better OS training FTP.

Just be careful not to go overboard on using this without a RR in a long race!

jburbatt

Stephen is definitely right- you are probably just a better sprinter. He's also right when he says that you can easily dig yourself into a massive hole by doing "more" or "better" than prescribed in the workouts. 20 weeks is a LONG time.

Re: the running and Z5- while it is possible that your vdot is too low you have to remember a few things about how the paces are set up in EN. Z5 is essentially equal to the average mile you ran for your vdot test. We run a lot of the longer intervals at Z4 because it builds the speed up in the same way as running faster (say Z5 like during a test) but without the recovery needs and downstream effect that the harder run would create. Now, for the extremely short intervals it totally makes sense that you are able to run at more than your Z5 pace, since it's a shorter distance than what you did to arrive at those zones. The point of the intervals is not to run as hard as you can, but to do short bursts at that Z5 pace that will increase your speed without creating a detrimental downstream effect.

I'm assuming that these are your first few tests, which means they feel extremely hard. I generally feel the same way, as I'm also much better as a sprinter. As you do more tests and get used to the speeds, I'd imagine that your paces/power would eventually all come more in line (i.e. your Z5 will not be so extreme vs. all the rest of the zones).

jayadams

Thank you all for the feedback. I had questioned the Z4 run stuff a few weeks back because it seemed easier than it should have, and was cautioned then about the down stream hole digging I may have been doing. It never materialized, but could see how it might over a full 20 week OS plan. I will keep on the harder intervals for now, and closely monitor my recovery and performance to see if either are suffering. I woke up today feeling like I hadn't done anything this week, and with today being a recovery day I am sure that Saturdays workout will go well.

Thanks for the feedback,

Jay

kurshing

Jay

I am guessing you tested below your ability too. Those tests take a few go-arounds to get right. I am still sometimes blowing up on them as I am always pushing my limits.

Joseph Lombardi

If inclined and have the time it is helpful to read Jack Daniels to understand vDot and training zones.  Z4 is the real work zone...just at or below threshold....

Would concurr that you probably tested below your actual max. but that is okay....thats why there are multiple tests...also helps to do it on a flat 5k race...if so inclined.

Good Luck.

Work works!

Keith Wick

I agree with others that at this point in time your muscular structure is tilted toward the V02 max stuff vs the FTP stuff. Over time this will level itself out based on the type of training within the HIM/IM plans. One other thing to consider is what your running technique looks like while your running the IP (z5) intervals. I often think that the running technique I used on the basketball court was very different than the technique I currently use for longer distance runs. I was much more bent forward and leaning forward on the court vs the more upright position of distance running. You may want to focus on how your technique during the intervals should be adjusted to more resemble the form used for distance running, thus providing you body the opportunity to adjust. I found that this definitely impacted my pace on these intervals. Think of a 100 yard sprinter vs a middle distance runner in the Olympics.