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How much carbohydrate do you need?

I do a lot of reading about body comp.  Probably goes back to my days as a lighweight rower, where we had as many body image problems as gymnasts, but I digress.

Let's set aside the Paleo / Primal / Zone / Scott Jurek school of thought for just a minute.  Let's also assume that I've got a good assessment of my daily caloric needs, and am in a state of caloric balance (just for the sake of argument :-)

Reading both Monique Ryan's book (Sports Nutrition for Endurance Athletes) and Matt Fitzgerald's book (Racing Weight), they recommend a lot of carbohydrate, even for the level of exercise we do in the OS.  At 5-6 hours per week of endurance exercise, they recommend 6-7 grams of carbohydrate per kg of bodyweight.  In my case, that's about 440 grams of carbohydrate, or 1760 calories of carbohydrate alone.  This is over 100 grams of carbohydrate more than I'm getting on my high days, and about 150 more than I'm getting on my average days.

Both Ryan and Fitzgerald suggest that inadequate carbohydrate intake leads to sluggishness, poor workout performance, poor recovery, and difficulty losing body fat.  No doubt that I've experienced all of the above at times, in addition to frequent inability to stop myself from eating everything in sight at the end of a day.

So, I'm interpreting this as a sign that I need to eat more carbohydrate.  Thoughts?

As a side note, eating that much carbohydrate seems astronomical to a guy who once had a rowing coach suggest eating more "Zone-diet" style, and who has been lectured up, down, and sideways on the body's insulin response and how that leads to fat storage instead of release...

Comments

  • The sports nutrition guy I consulted suggested 30 gms of carbohydrate for each hour of training as the best way to manage my recovery as well as body composition goals (which were/are to get leaner).

    I currently weigh 150.

    This was on top of a suggested range and quantities of foods that I liked which was/is the basis of my eating plan for a non-training day — which has heaps of carbohydrates. A typical day might start with 1/3 cup of rolled oats, a banana and generous serve of honey. Lunch a roll, 90 gms of tuna and salad, dinner 400 gms of potatoes and 130 gms of steak. In addition, two 30 gm carbohydrate snacks — as well as unlimted salads and green and white vegtables.

    Like you, this does appear to be a lot of carbohydrate but I am becoming leaner and have no trouble with recovery.
    Of course, YMMV,

  • or more protein?
  • Like many things, I don't think there is an answer that will work for everyone. Some people process carbs better than others which means they can eat more carbs and lean out while others need to eat more protein and fat.

    The recommendation from Louise Burke at the Australian Institute of Sport is 3 - 10 grams per kg of body weight. When I'm working with an athlete, I determine the "ball park" amounts based on the recommendations, then go with what makes sense. Here they are:

    Carbs: 3 - 10 g/kg (you may go to the higher end when you are building and for racing, lower at other times)
    Protein: 1.1 - 1.8 g/kg
    Fat: 0.8 1 1 g/kg

    Then, I work them out to % total daily calories and see what makes sense.

    The best thing is to pick a level, try it and see how you feel and how your body responds.
  • Thanks, Penny! (and Peter and Brenda!)

    I've definitely been a lot closer to 3-3.5 g/kg on the carbs, with the corresponding higher protein (1.4 - 1.6 g/kg) and fat (1.1 - 1.2 g/kg), and haven't been satisfied the results. This week, I'm working to make the dramatic shift up to closer to 6 g/kg carbs, with the drop in protein (.9 - 1.1) and fat (0.7 - 0.9). Sounds like I may be erring slightly on the side of too low protein, so I'll be sure to keep an eye on that.

    It has taken a bunch of thought and planning to figure out how to get that much carb in the diet without a bunch of added fat and/or protein! Looking forward to seeing how the body responds, and will update here. Definitely curious to hear about anyone else who might have gone through this experience.
  • You must just stare at food labels all day long! How do you make these numbers make sense in planning a daily meal plan? Are you constantly looking at labels figuring out how much meat you are eating out of the package, etc? Seems so time consuming!
  • Dottie: Using food labels is part of it. Logging your food using an app or online tool can help you learn to translate the numbers into real food.
  • I have been a fairly strict zone dieter for years and only in the last year have I (at first, reluctantly) added the extra carbs around training. My first read was Monique Ryan, and I also could never eat all the carbs she recommended. I have tried her carb loading for 72 hours 3 times and I was supposed to have 500 carbs per day (10/Kg) and just couldn't get it all in. I felt a differnce in how I felt on race day, hovever, with 350 carbs/d (and as recommended, to get all those carb calories in I hardly ate any protein or fat cal ). As for training now, and racing, I like Peter above, use about 30 gm carbs per hour of training, which for me is 3gm/kg. My current bible has been the recommendations in 'the Paleo diet for endurance athletes' as regards the modifications around training and racing. After training is done, I eat zone/paleo the rest of the day. I have to say, I am in week 9 OS and doing the marathon hack for Boston-my legs have never felt as fresh for every workout. I haven't had a 'bonk' and I don't have that fade all day and want to eat everything in sight.

    Penny: I haven't yet, but I will take your numbers and compare to my diet and see how it adds up.
  • @Penny-what apps? I use LoseIt with success, but what app converts to grams? Thanks!

  • Dottie, lose it will tell you grams as well.
  • You can move from calories to grams for carbs and protein by dividing by 4, and for fat divide by 9.
  • well, thank you Mike & Penny. I have always paid attention to the percentages on the nutrients tab in LoseIt, but now I see the grams, and the math is good to know. Thank you!
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