Achieving my potential on the bike?

Rob Mohr

Since I started OS (20 weeks ago), I’ve been bugged by my inability to ride at a high heart rate in comparison to my LTHR for running. I’m wondering if I need to push myself harder on the bike. That said, even though my HR is only in the 155-160 range, my legs burn and keep me from going much harder for the required time. 

Is this normal? Have others struggled with this? While I train with power, I keep thinking that my power levels would be (and maybe should be) higher if only I could ride at a level near my running LTHR. 

When I run, I’m relatively comfortable at a pretty high HR. I can be at 165-170 for several hours. When I ride, (cadence of about 90, watts at about 200) my legs get tired before my heart rate gets into the 170s. This makes me feel like I’m doing something wrong.  

In running the 5K test, my pace was 5:50, LTHR was 182, vDot was 56.

In biking the 42 minute all out, my FTP was 204, LTHR 159.

Thanks for your thoughts

Peter Greagg

Hi Rob — it's pretty normal for running heart rate to be higher than the rate on the bike.
When I used to train with heart rate (before EN) my Z4 bike heart rate was mid 150s, whereas for running Z4 was hi 160s.
Because you have power, I wouldn't worry about your HR on the bike — just get the work done.
BTW, how long have you had power? The reason I askis that it usually takes a number of tests before you can really nail 2 x 20 mins tests — it took about 12 months before I could rewally suffer enough on the bike to be confident in my FTP.

tuckerm

Why do you worry about HR when you have power?

Al Truscott

E.g., my bike HR @ FTP is now 90% of my run HR @ TP. This seems pretty standard. Remember, your heart is not the rate limiter for work, it is what's going on in the muscles. As Tucker said, pay attention to your pace and your watts, the HR is for amusement only. 

Swanie

I put away my HR strap after buying my power meter last year. On the bike HR is doesn't come into play if you can accurately monitor power.

Joe Matchette

Steve, et.el -- while I ride with power, I still use my HR as a cross-check. In my two IM races last year, it proved very helpful to make sure I moderated my effort on the bike so I could have successful runs. At IMLoo - my HR showed that I could keep using all four 'gears' and at KONA it was very elevated so I only used 1st and 2nd Gear (which was also validated by RPE).

jhbinsc

Depending on how long you've been riding, it can take a while to develop the fitness on bike to drive your HR high as compared to your running.

MattAaronson

I regularly hit a 187-188 HR running, and sometime see 190-191 on z5 intervals. Average is somewhere in the high 170's depending on the length of the run.

On the bike indoors I'm usually averaging 160s on z4 intervals, and rarely going above the very low 170's. On 2.5' z5 intervals where I barely make it to the end, I don't think I've ever gone above 181.

On the bike OUTDOORS you can subtract about 10bpm from the above. And on z3 work the difference is even more pronounced, where running will be 170s, bike indoors mid-160s, and outdoor biking literally as low as mid-130s-140s.

I guess in my experience the bike just does not do the same to your HR as running.

Rob Mohr

hey guys, thanks for all this - very helpful.

to answer some of the questions:

i guess the main reason i kept looking at HR, even when training w power, was that i wasn't hitting the power numbers i often hear guys riding at, 250-300 watts etc. because i'm used to being at the top of the game in running, i figured i should be able to translate that to biking somewhat quickly with training (i know, i know, not exactly a straightforward assumption...). the fact that my HR wasn't that high made me think about these power numbers more.

i've only had trained with power for the past month. i'm also new to the tri bike. i've only done one FTP test and "suffer" is definitely the right word. hope to get better at nailing it after more time training w power.think that also gets to your point Jeff - i haven't been riding for long, at least not with specific goals and a training schedule. guessing i'll be able to ride at a higher HR (and of course watts!!) once my fitness on the bike is more developed.

thanks again for all these responses.

Coach Rich

Notes:

• Push the watts, observe what HR you see at the watts you are doing. IE, power is primary, HR is secondary, largely just observed and noted for informal future comparison purposes. This is most true for interval sessions where, as others have noted, it's often best to just ignore HR.
• As your rides become longer, still push the goal watts but observe your HR at these watts more closely. These correlations between watts, HR and RPE are what you'll use on race day to add depth to what is going on with your body.
• Look at bike and run HR's as completely separate, with no relationship between the two.

Coach Patrick

Also, to clear up Joe Matchette's contribution, no HRM in training, but yes on Race Day.

It's easy to compare and say I am a strong runner and should be a strong biker, but the watts don't lie. Repeat after me: "These are my watts. I know my watts. I will learn to love my watts, because they are my own. I will master my watts, and strive to push them higher, but they are my own watts and no one else's." The only thing you can compare between peeps is IF (% of intensity for a given ride) and you can do Watts/kilogram if you want to see who is in your neighborhood!

Joe Matchette

Posted By Patrick McCrann on 03 Apr 2012 08:55 AM

Also, to clear up Joe Matchette's contribution, no HRM in training, but yes on Race Day.

Coach, I beg to differ.  I think wearing and referencing an HRM in training is very valuable.  It is over the course of the long rides, that you develop your "I am pushing these watts, in this environment (heat/humidity/wind/etc) and it gives me this Heart Rate" data points.  Without these historical data points, you are making decisions blindly.  And that would break the "nothing new on race day" rule.  

Or am I totally missing what you were trying to say --- such as 'don't adjust the workout in training, only note what your HR does.'?

Thx

 

tuckerm

I think he means don't change your workout relative to HR. Because if you never wore the HRM during training, how would you know what to use on race day?