Doping and Aging Athlete
From today's NY Times Magazine:
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/17/m...wanted=all
I'm on the road now, quick post, but will be back tonight to post my thoughts on this (long article, is actually "fair and balanced" on the topic.)
0
Comments
This long NY Times article includes a sampling of research on the value of some controversial ergogenic aids for aging (over 50) athletes. Included are references to testosterone, human growth hormone, and human chorionic gondaotropin, among others. Also, a fair amount of time is spent diccussing the value of diet, intense exercise, and weigh training in helping retard or possibly delay the effects of aging.
After 35 years as a physician, I now understand that the human body, like all biologic systems, is very intricately designed to both function in homeostasis, and change over time. A 6 y/o is not like a 16 y/o is not like a 26 y/o. Those changes over time alter our homestatsis, causing things like wrinkles, grey hair, decreasing levels of hormones like testosterone and estrogen, and resultant effects on athletic performance. We tinker with those pre-programmed systems at our peril. As the article makes clear, give an older man HGH, and he will start making more testosterone. But it's like boring out your cylinders - you go faster, but run out of fuel sooner and risk breaking the engine entirely. If your goal is to be as strong/fast as possible NOW, it may help. But if your goal is fitness for life - not so good.
A hypothetical question is raised: "Imagine that a miracle drug is discovered that guarantees vigor far beyond retirement age, but shortens your life by, say, four years. Is it worth the trade-off?" If only it were that simple. The actual question should be more like "Imagine that a miracle drug is discovered that guarantees vigor far beyond retirement age, but affects your life in the same way as cigarette smoking does. Is it worth the trade-off?" "Only" 1 out of 3 smokers dies prematurely of smoking related illness, but those who avoid cancer stil expose themselves to all sorts of other ailments.
These practices are tempting - so tempting that World Triathlon Corporation this year is having everyone (AGer and Pro) who qualifies for Kona sign a release saying they agree to be tested for use of World Anti-Doping Authority proscribed agents. The assumption is, all of us are racing against people who are fiddling around with these effective, legal, and physician supervised, but self-abusive practices. The article notes that anyone with $10,000 - a not unreasonable figure for what an IM racer might spend on equipment, travel, coaching, and other triathlon related expenses in a year - can have access to this fountain of youth.
For the record, the only supplements I take are Omega-3 caps and Glucosamine-Chondroitin Sulfate-MSM tablets. Everything else, I get from the produce section of the grocery store.
A friend of mine that used to own a running store always carried a few Tri toys to reel the triathletes in as he knew they would blow money more easily than a runner any day.
As for your 'miracle drug' question: if it were only that simple. 4 years shorter life vs having a better quality of life during the years lived? I'd sign up for that but as I think you touched on...not the way the homeostatic mechanism of the body works. We have this innate wisdom of body function that is easy to get in the way of when we tinker. What is interesting is how enduring the body can be for some individuals. Some people really abuse their systems and putter along so much longer than you think they would: be it smoking, obesity, drugs, etc. Others live a clean life and drop dead far too early.
Vince
Al, thanks for the link and your insights. I think there still is a lot we don’t understand about the human body. We will continue to learn and there will always be approaches that are viewed by the traditional western medical community as “way out there” and having no scientific evidence supporting the approach. Those proponents of the way out there approaches sometimes are on to something, but most often they are not.
One interesting question for us old guys is "what do we do about prescibed medications"? Some of us take banned substances (testosterone supplement, asthma medicine, heart medication, etc.). I'm racing as a 60 year old this year; personally, my concern is finishing a race consistent with my training, and not experiencing a major breakdown (my only DNF in 20 years was due to an afib attack that just wouldn't go away). But then I'm middle of the pack at best. Taking drugs to improve my position is not really a practical consideration - even if I thought that way. Clearly my best chance at Kona is the lottery - which I signed up for this year having completed an IM distance race last year.
I don't doubt that for a moment that there is a serious problem. Sadly, bragging rights sometimes is all someone has. Their performance in triathlon defines who they are. We all know "that guy," or someone close to it. It's usually someone you instinctively can't stand being around for more than 5 minutes.
Devil's advocate: if you had the money, the interest, the resources...and it actually worked...to have an "aging-management expert" to manage your aging, and you then competed against others who didn't have those resources, are you cheating?
As I see it, I know that many people, myself included, have/are paying $800-1k/mo on stupid stuff that doesn't matter. I could see myself, someday, saying "I want to be as healthy and active as I can for as long as I can. It's worth $800-1000/mo for someone to help me just make that happen." Now, lots of assumptions about does this stuff in fact work, is $1k/mo worth it, etc, but when I see people driving $80k MB SUV's, I see people who are able to write big checks for stuff that I think is pretty silly."
Bottomline, if it worked and I believed i didn't jeopardize my future health (or at least I can make an informed risk/reward decision), I would do it. As far as it's implications on competing in endurance sports...I'm a human being first, endurance athlete a distance second. I'm not going to not doing something to improve my quality of life because the rules of sport I'm currently doing saying I can't. If it came up in conversation I'd think I'd say something like "I don't have a car payment and live in a 1500sqft house with my wife and two dogs. I choose to spend my dough to stay healthy." If I started to have a big problem with it, maybe I would DQ myself from all of my races?
I think that as medical science and treatment advances, more "stuff" is going to be possible and we will be forced to answer these have/have not questions, is this lifestyle/health maintenance or cheating in a sport?
Rich -
Agree with the proposition "it's your money/body, you can do what you want with it." After all, I grew up in the sixties. Doing the stuff described in that article, IMO, in not immoral or illegal. But it is cheating according to the rules of many sports, just like drafting is, and it is (again my opinion) potentially bad for one's long-term health to add things like testosterone, HGH, or HCG to a body that's not designed to use it in large doses.
Agreed. Assuming it works, and could be made to be healthy, than I guess I would have to reconcile my personal health desires with my competing (since it's cheating) desire to compete in endurance sports. In other words, I'm not going to not do something that will improve my quality of life just because Charlie Crawford at USAT sez I can't. It's up to me then if I want to continue competing in Charlie's sport.
You only have to flip open one of the "rich guy" magazines to know that it is likely a big issue. There are tons of adds for "anti aging" doc and clinics out there which are promising all sorts of things. I imagine it is easier to rationalize for a 50 year old getting HGH on advice of a doctor when the hormone treatment "is clinically indicated" than a 25 year old out there looking for EPO on the net or in the locker room at the local gym.
As Rich mentioned if it actually worked and would really improve the quality of life it would be hard to resist. I would also realize that any competetive racing would be over at that point, its just flat out cheating to win your AG taking more dope than Jose Canseco. And to paraphrase Jose "the only thing conclusively proven about anabolic steriods is that they work really really well". Not sure if that is true but I have noticed that the top performers in about every sport have been linked to PED's...
If I could live a strong healthy life up until the moment I die even if it is cut short by 3 years, I would do it. But it would need to be the drop dead kind of death. Not a 2 year illness for the last years of my life. I had cancer 7 or 8 years ago and it propelled me into triathlon. I had always been active running, but after the big casino, I wanted to 1) prove that I was strong and healthy, 2) insure I am always fit in the event I need to fight it again 3) punish my body for turning on me (I know, but it is hard to explain) 4) do things instead of saying “I always wanted to”… do an Ironman in this case. Going through an illness made it crystal clear in my mind that I want to live a full and robust life as long as I can. I do not want a lingering illness…. Of course maybe the lesson I should be learning is how to lead a robust life with an illness given that "robust" is a state of mind to some extent.
So, I would never take something foreign into my body because I believe at the macro level that natural and balanced are guiding principles. Vigorous exercise, a proper diet, involvement in community, and stimulation of the mind are all things that will keep us fit, healthy and happy. I say go for anti-aging through natural means.
A great book is “Younger Next Year: A Guide to Living Like 50 Until You're 80 and Beyond”. The gist of it is that our bodies have not evolutionarily kept pace with our sedentary life. When we are not active, we are sending the signals to our bodies that food is scarce (because if food was around we would be out expending energy hunting, etc.). When the body thinks food is scare, it starts to conserve and shut down by holding on to everything we ingest, conserving energy, in a word decaying. The way to send the right signals to the body is with vigorous exercise. Food is present, so we are expending energy, and all systems are go. … anyone doing triathlon knows this on some intuitive level. Our bodies perform so much more efficiently when we are training. Stay younger by doing triathlon (or whatever physical activity floats your boat), rather than try to artificially/chemically make yourself younger to do better at triathlon.
Mark - Great post! And inspiring story. I learn so much from people who've had challenges to their health; I've been so lucky to have none so far in my life - like you I want to be prepared when it does happen.
And, yes, our bodies are designed to be used. Rest and inactivity are not good for us.
I go back and forth on this issue. Prior to starting with EN in June 2008 I was diagnosed with low testosterone by my physician. I felt like crap. In part I believe it was stress induced from: divorce, upping mileage from Sprint to 2 - half-IM's in 1 year, etc.
I went on 50 mg test inj/wk and started to feel better. My libido returned. I wasn't falling asleep at the dinner table, etc. Then I started a late season IM program with EN (I just dropped in without any prior build-up EN style...from LSD to EN hammerfest) for my first IM in Wis. My FTP was improving steadilyl instead of flatlining like the prior year. My running was getting faster and easier. So, I felt guilty as if I were doping even though I was still on the low end of the test levels according to my bloodwork. Prior to the injections I had test levels of a 70 y/o with a 41 y/o body.
So, as the intensity and duration increased towards my big day in Wis my test levels were declining because I quite the injections. BAD deal. 7 months of rebuilding my hormonal system to where it is and I still do not think its back to normal.
I've considered injections again but so far 25mg of DHEA makes me feel "normal" somewhat. I recover better than without it but still fatigue faster and recover slower than on the 50 mg Test cyp/wk. I cannot imagine what a high-normal profile of Test and growth would feel like other than I'm sure I'd be faster....and ready to hit it hard again the next day. Ahhh...to be younger again.
Vince
We have all seen the claims of this new wonder plant extract from the Amazon rainforest, China, or India that is guaranteed to (insert claim). I think the bottom line is we all have the "lines in the sand" that come up in life. We see a lot of people crossing our lines in the sand and going to the other side. We must answer the question. Do we stay firm or cross over that line to the other side and spend time to rationalize. The real problems is that surely another situation where are standards will be tested will come up again. Sometimes we are tested on a small level, sometimes we are tested in a big level. Just my idea ramblings But I hate grey areas.
If our goal is a Kona slot...you had better be gifted or on the juice. I saw someone carrying a lot of muscle and very lean get a slot @ 45 y/o. You do not carry that much muscle as an endurance athlete AND run well after a hard bike. I'm not naming names but the body alone looked like it belonged to a 22 y/o fitness model not a 45 y/o IMer.
Canseco is right about one thing....roids work. There was that article in Outside magazine by that ultra-cyclist who did performance enhancing drugs to see IF they worked. I have the link saved at my office. I will try to post it tomorrow in this thread. Very revealing.
Vince
I think it really does come down to staying active so that your body thinks you're still on the savannah hunting for food, I'm not dead yet so keep up with the maintenance.
Jeezus, wtf am I doing in this forum?! I have standing orders with some of my local friends to kick me in the nuts if I ever pull out the age card on a ride. I want to be ripping the legs off of guys half my age and, if I don't, just keep my mouth shut
.
Nice...No age card or nutz kicked. Sounds like solid advice.
V
Here the Outside Magazine article Vince alluded to--an extensive, multi-month experiment by the author with HGH primarily. Guess what? It worked.
Linda,
As I recall he used:
hgh
Testosterone cream
Deca (anabolic steriod)
EPO
possibly 1 more drug also.
What stuck in my mind was that he was sitting with the prescribing dr at lunch and the doc told him to be careful with the EPO....not because it was dangerous but BECAUSE ALL HIS RIDING BUDDIES WOULD KNOW HE WAS JUICING because it is that big a difference in ability/function. Again, I've never fooled around with the stuff nor known anyone that has (admitted it atleast). Great article if it's the one I read.
Vince
Ahh right. It's been a while since I read the article. It was the EPO most discussed.
Don't forget, he may be bat-shit crazy, but there's a reason Greg LeMond is so pissed about doping. In the course of 2 years, the peloton just left him behind. No question these things work.
(just observations from a young 'un trying to learn from the wise)
Mike
Just read the full article. Everytime I think I'm not naive I learn how much I really am. I know there has been abuse in some sports, but this article really gives an idea of how pervasive it is. I've had some suspicions about some people myself and have wondered what they are doing to get so good. I have a tremendous natural engine, but can't touch some of the top guys in my age group. Some I'm sure are just more gifted. Others I wonder about. For those who want to make gains the old fashioned way I offer 10 of 13 tips (1st three didn't really apply to triathletes) on how to increase testerone naturally (from Ron Geraci, Men's Health, December 25, 2000).
Have Morning Sex
German scientists found that simply having an erection causes your circulating testosterone to rise significantly -- and having one in the morning can goose your natural post-dawn testosterone surge. It's a sure bet you'll burn a little fat, too.
Stick With Tough Exercises
To beef up your testosterone levels, the bulk of your workout should involve "compound" weight-lifting exercises that train several large muscle groups, and not just one or two smaller muscles. For example, studies have shown that doing squats, bench presses or back rows increases testosterone more than doing biceps curls or triceps pushdowns, even though the effort may seem the same. This is why doing squats could help you build bigger biceps.
Make Nuts Your Midnight Snack
Nuts are good for your nuts. Research has found that men who ate diets rich in monounsaturated fat -- the kind found in peanuts -- had the highest testosterone levels. "It's not known why this occurs, but some scientists believe that monounsaturated fats have a direct effect on the testes," says Incledon. Nuts, olive oil, canola oil and peanut butter are good sources of monounsaturated fat.
Squeeze Out Five Repetitions per Set
Throwing around 5-pound dumbbells won't help you effect a rise in testosterone. Start off by using a heavy weight that you can lift only five times. That weight is about 85 percent of your one-repetition maximum. A Finnish study found that this workload produced the greatest boosts in testosterone.
Do Three Sets of Each Weight-Lifting Movement
Researchers at Penn State determined that this fosters greater increases in testosterone than just one or two sets. Rest a full minute between sets, so you can regain enough strength to continue lifting at least 70 percent of your one-rep maximum during the second and third sets.
Rest Harder Than You Work Out
If you overtrain -- meaning you don't allow your body to recuperate adequately between training sessions -- your circulating testosterone levels can plunge by as much as 40 percent, according to a study at the University of North Carolina. The symptoms of overtraining are hard to miss: irritability, insomnia, muscle shrinkage, joining the Reform Party. To avoid overtraining, make sure you sleep a full eight hours at night, and never stress the same muscles with weight-lifting movements two days in a row.
Drive Home Sober
To maintain a healthy testosterone count -- and titanium erections -- cut yourself off after three drinks. "Binge drinking will kill your testosterone levels," warns Incledon. Alcohol affects the endocrine system, causing your testes to stop producing the male hormone. That's one reason drinking often causes you to go limp at the moment of truth.
Have a Sandwich at 3 p.m.
As any sensible woman knows, the way to put hair on a man's chest is to fill his stomach. Your body needs a ready supply of calories to make testosterone, so regularly skipping meals or going for long stretches without eating can cause your levels of the hormone to plummet. Then again, that's probably the warden's plan.
Buy the Fried Tortilla Chips
If you want to raise your testosterone score, eat a diet that includes about 30 percent fat, and not much less. Your body needs dietary fat to produce testosterone, so eating like a vegetarian aerobics instructor will cause your testosterone levels to sink drastically. This is bad, unless you actually are a vegetarian aerobics instructor.
Stop Surfing for Porn at 2 a.m.
Sleeping less than seven to eight hours a night can screw up your circadian rhythm. That's why it's no wonder your testosterone levels are higher in the morning after a good night's sleep. So if your work or social schedule keeps you stooped in perpetual jet lag, don't be surprised
A few more articles from the New York Times re supplements/doping. Not related to the older athlete, but interesting nonetheless.
When the Gym Isn't Enough
Will Olympic Athletes Dope if They Know It Might Kill Them?