Week 9 Dec OS

Paul Takac · January 31, 2010 4:17PM

Hi all, I've been pretty slack in posting lately and wanted to catch up. I too just got my PowerMeter early last week and also did the Run for Haiti (managed 21 miles which is a whole lot further than I've gone in a long time). Thus I had to do some significant modifications the last two weeks. Following the Haiti run I was pretty sore so took a few days to recover, read up on my Powertap, get it installed, etc. On Friday I did my first ftp test and was pleased to post a 243. The first 20' was about 20 watts higher than the second so my pacing needs work, but subsequent workouts have pretty much borne out the test so I think it's about right. I skipped the vDot test since I recalibrated earlier in the month and am sticking for now with the 42 I posted then. This week I'm pretty much caught up as of a couple days ago and have started the VO2 sessions. Does anyone else find these killer? Yesterday pretty much totally gassed me. My left leg is still pretty sore so I'm taking it a bit easier on the running than I probably should but would rather do that than get injured. One thing I'm struggling with a bit is when to exit the OS and start a HIM build for Lonestar at the end of April. I've read through the new tool materials but it's still a bit murky to me. Guess I'll have to ask RnP soon. Figure I'll stick with the OS until about 6 weeks out and then do a short build up. Anyway, sorry for the long post but just wanting to catch up with the Dec OS peeps. BTW... I love the PM - but Bob and David are right, it is a whole different world from HR.

mbseaton · January 31, 2010 4:30PM

I've been looking at when to exit OS for Lonestar also, I think I am going to exit the week of 3/22.

Bob Arsenault · January 31, 2010 5:39PM

Great first test with your PM Paul. You will definately see a nice increase with your next test with the VO2 work as well as a little better pacing next time.

I'm not sure why but I find the VO2 work quite a bit easier than the long intervals. Not saying they are easy by any means, but I just do not suffer as much with them as the lactate work.

I plan on modifying the VO2 work a little each week to get some longer intervals, 1'/1' and 2'/2' instead of doing all 30"/30'

The speed work on the track are definately challenging especially with the wind and cold temps that we've been having here in the Northeast.

I finally feel like I am regaining some strength after 4 weeks with a chest cold. My FTP test in week 8 went down 2 points and I was so bummed, but knew I was not at 100%, now I really can't wait for the next test. I've taken the liberty to bump my zones up a little as I do feel stronger, and will not test again until it is scheduled.

It is amazing how a little cold can really zap you !!! I guess my own fault for over doing it with the Holiday run challenge, in freezing temps and not allowing the body to recover properly. Still learning that very difficult lesson.

Let's continue to keep this Dec OS thread active.

kurshing · January 31, 2010 6:32PM

@Bob - I am a noob but, I think the 30/30s are as they are for a reason, and I might suggest that, instead of lengthening then to 1/1 or 2/2 I would consider doing something like 30/30s with the 'rest' 30 harder than you've been doing...so maybe something like 30/30 as 30 @ 120% and 30 @ 85%. I am just trying to throw something else out there for you to think about.

I agree...let's keep this thread a little more active!

Cary Blanco · January 31, 2010 7:55PM

Nice Job with your 1st powermeter FTP test Paul.

I had to put my OS on hiatus for 2 weeks due to travel and other commitments so I start week 8 tomorrow. mI test again and I can do some VO2 work and peel your pain.

I'm all caught up with Team EN now so I'll be active in the Dec OS group again.

Paul Takac · January 31, 2010 11:12PM

@Matt: so you are planning 4 weeks of build and 1 week taper? Just curious if that's enough time to build in the distance necessary. I'm thinking of starting to do the outside ride option (even though I'm in Pennsylvania) and adding some Z2/Z3 distance to my runs starting in late February or so. Everything on the bike so far has been on trainer indoors. Runs have been outside (can't stand the treadmill!). What do you think? Have RnP weighed in on your timeline? Just curious... Look forward to meeting you there.

@Bob: thanks and glad to hear that you're feeling better. I think this Haiti run really knocked me for a loop (like your cold). I'll definitely have to take it easy on the running a bit longer.

@Cary: thanks and welcome back! Keep us posted on your testing.

One other question for the crew: while I'm happy with the 243 ftp... looked at another way it's 2.9 wt/kg. I'm just under 6' and weigh 180-185. It seems to me that a good bit of the surprising (to me anyway) number is probably due to my larger frame. Do you more experienced power-folk track wt/kg as your primary data point?

It's good to reconnect with everyone.

Bob Arsenault · February 2, 2010 2:50AM

Posted By Stephen Anderson on 31 Jan 2010 06:32 PM
@Bob - I am a noob but, I think the 30/30s are as they are for a reason, and I might suggest that, instead of lengthening then to 1/1 or 2/2 I would consider doing something like 30/30s with the 'rest' 30 harder than you've been doing...so maybe something like 30/30 as 30 @ 120% and 30 @ 85%. I am just trying to throw something else out there for you to think about.

Stephen, Thanks for your input and I would agree with your your recommendation of sticking to the plan 99% of the time, I did so last year to a tee, and it helped me out immensely. During the last 2 years there has been a lot of discusion in the forums about the VO2 max workouts, and how they can be modified for some people.   If you go to the 3.0 version and search 30/30 you will get some great threads and video on the how's and why's to modify these workouts, and why R & P chose to add the 30/30's in their plan.

For some reason I can do the 30/30's at 150-155% and the rest at 80-85% and not find them terribly difficult.   There is a lot of research about VO2 workouts stating why you should/could do 4 X 2.5'/2.5'   instead of the 30"/30".

Some people find the Lactate Threshold work easier than the VO2 max workouts, others find the opposite to be true. I think in my case my roof is pretty high but my ceiling needs a lot of work, this is why I did not qualify for the power hack project.   The 30/30's probably work for 90-95% of our team, some of us may benefit from the longer VO2 intervals.    I plan on giving this approach a try and I will report back my results.

Again, I thank you for your post Stephen, because it made me go back thru the forum and read all the info from the past 2 years that was written on this topic, and it helped me solidfy my approach for the next 5 weeks.

If you get a chance to do that search I think you will find the information very helpful.

Bob Arsenault · February 2, 2010 8:34PM

I wound up changing my VO2 bike workout today to 4 X 2.5/2.5 I did the 2.5's on at 122%, 125%, 125% and 120% and the rest 2.5's between 65-75%.

This was a very challenging workout which allowed me to stay in the appropriate VO2 zone. I will mix in some workouts with the 30/30's but will continue to make at least one of my weekly workouts a 2.5/2.5. When doing the 30/30's I may try to eliminte the 2' rest period and just do the 30/30's consecutively.

I hope I am not confusing anyone just letting you know the option I am choosing to do.

I hope you are all killing these VO2 workouts !!

Cary Blanco · February 3, 2010 7:01AM

Ok, did my FTP test on Monday night, Everything RnP said about 1st vs. 2nd test was true. Know what HARD really is, testing better, pacing better and of course, overall improvement in actual cycling power from doing the OS for 8 weeks. I added 30 watts to my FTP. From 166 in week one to 196 week 8 of OS. I know I can execute my third test even better.

Now I get to find out about those 30/30s!

Ground is covered in fresh snow this morning so I'm going to put the 5k Vdot test off.

Coach Patrick · February 3, 2010 7:22AM

IF you guys are looking for more info on what Bob is doing with his 30/30s, please check out the info we .

mbseaton · February 3, 2010 7:46AM

Good job on your numbers. Did my first 30/30s last night, boy were they fun!

chuckg · February 3, 2010 11:41AM

pounded the 30/30s yesterday and felt great all day. I had a hard time this morning getting in to the right zones for the track intervals. Everything finally came around after the third 200 and I was abe to finsih up strong. I do have a question about the rest preiod during the track intervals. The workout calls for "full recoveries between each", does this mean bring it all the way down to Z1 before starting the next interval or is it more like the bike intervals where the "off" is around 60-65%?? Thanks

Tavis Yeung · February 3, 2010 2:50PM

Good job everybody! Welcome to February and here's to more suffering in the pain cave!

@Chuck - my "full recoveries" have been a slow trot around the track. I wouldn't be too worried about a specific zone or pace for the recovery, just get yourself back into a state that you can hit it as hard as you can for the next interval.

@paul - watts/kg is definitely the "golden metric" that me and my group keep track of. Cranking out an FTP at 300 watts when you're 240lbs doesn't really mean too much Putting things in perspective, there's guys I'm racing in this race series that are up and around 5 to 6watts per/kg since they are focused on crit-riding and are 145pound dynamos that can still crank out 1000+ watts in final sprints...

chuckg · February 3, 2010 3:17PM

@Tavis - Thanks for the advice, that is pretty much what I was doing. I wasn't coming completely into "complete" recovery, but enough to go hard in the next interval. I am starting to feel crapy this afternoon, so hopefully I'll be able to put in a good effort on the bike tomorrow. Thanks again.

Week 9 Dec OS

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