finally done with these 2 weeks rest !! My impression, I "believe" 10 days could have been enough, I was starting to feel more tired than rested, meaning I was getting flat and bleh. This morning after the CnC, I went for a 12 mile run.. I know it brought the total mileage over 40 mile, but I needed it =)
This week, we are back to week 6 and its going to be a shitty week weather wise with Tuesday and Wednesday be a snowstorm and cold. Will follow the week 6 plan, except that the long run (3h30 and 3h) will be done on Friday and Saturday.
so:
Monday - Commute morning and detour on the mountain on my way back - 35' zwift race in the evening
Tuesday - just survive the commute
Wednesday - commute morning and detour on the mountain on my way back to do the tempo run (5X1M @ z3)
Thursday - commute only
Friday - 3h30 long run, will do that one on the flat
Saturday - 3h long, will do that one on the mountain to get elevation
Sunday - rest + 40-50' zwift ez spin
Total time on feet should be around 10 hours for the week and mileage approximately around 80-85 mile.
That looks perfect to me I agree with you on the recovery aspect. In the future, you can definitely reach out to me and we can make changes in a more dynamic fashion. That said, nothing wrong with being A little extra rested.
I agree that this week will be tough simply because it means getting back to baseline run numbers. Do yourself a favor and listen to your body, stay on top of the protein and recovery as much as possible.
all dashboard monitors are green - only thing I realized when looking at data is that I lose weight during the recovery weeks, isnt suppose to be the opposite ?
Last week was week 8 which was recovery week, I toke it as a recovery week even if we took 2 weeks easy at the beginning of January - as you said, nothing wrong with being extra rested, also was perfect timing with work where I did over 65 hours for the last 3 weeks and will be like until end of February.
This week the runs are capped at 24 mile.. I will try not to do the additional 2 miles just to get a marathon =).
We are now 7 weeks out Rattler, I am glad where my volume is and nothing hurts on the body, but I am still going to the PT weekly to ensure hips and groin are still OK, anyway with insurance its 0$ for 90 minutes consult, so better to use it! Also still doing the 15-20 minutes exercice when in bed before falling asleep.
As for the volume, I am in the 74-80 mpw zone, I'll probably stick in that zone until Vermont 100K which is 7/22, I dont think we need to add more at this point and until the race, once the ice and snow will be melt I think I could add little more speed, by being cautious of course.
Again, the A-GOAL for now is to quality for Leadville at Rattler, its hard to know what is the targeted time now since its a new course.
Sounds like you are really absorbing the training alone well. There’s nothing wrong with “sitting steady” at the current level of work because you will get stronger and become more accustomed to the load.
I strongly encourage you to avoid chasing those extra 2 miles and recommend that if you have any extra energy after all of that work in training to spend it on your bike or doing some flexibility work I think that will be your best bet.
From a macro perspective I do think it’s important that we give you some time to recover from the running. Another words, I don’t want you running 80 miles a week for the next four months. One or two bike focused weeks would also be beneficial for you similar to your evil teammate @Tim Sullivan - you can keep the workload high but give your running muscles a short but well-deserved rest of 5 to 7 days. Maybe even a Monday to Friday focus so that you can get the long run in again on the next weekend. What do you think about that?
I am not familiar with the new course, have you found out anything about it that could help you?
Didnt really find anything about the new course.. I guess we will all be on the same boat.. best plan is to get there healthy, rested and strong.
As for the Macro level - got it, last week ending at 79 was on purpose :) I did split the 2 big days into 2 runs per day. Day 1 was 3 in the morning and 23 in the evening and Day 2 was 2X13 mile. Splitting the runs makes it easier on my working schedule.
4 months bring us 6/24 which is one month before Vermont 100K, which I think we should get there fit with your recommanded volume cap
My questions for now are :
1) Being between 70-75 per week for 4 months, are we going to have enough time to build for Moab in 4 months ? My feelings are i dont think we will need to increase much more when we get into the deep Moab preparation - I think 120-140 per week might be the biggest weeks, unless you have a different view on that, after all, you are the coach and i am the one suffering =) I realized this week how big of a challenge it will be, but if dreams arent scary is that because they arent big enuff!
2) I totally see a difference in my runs and recovery speed when biking the CNC and doing Zwift Races on Monday night (these 2 days work the best for my schedule) - whats your opinion on that ? I can maybe make another bike session but that will be stretch, also do you think I should keep the Monday races which are the 10 mile flat races that last less than 30 minutes and do just an easy boring spin
3) Doing bike focused weeks mean not run commute for 2 weeks !!! - are you sure I dont need to go to the office ? :) I could maybe reverse it by running during the week and do a Thursday night to Sunday bike focused as I should be able to resume working from home on Friday in 2 weeks.
@Francis Picard SUPERKUDOS to you for staying under 80. I am grateful. And so is your body.
Small things...
Splitting the run is always welcome...it's better for your body as well!!
Yes to the cycling during the week. It will make you stronger and cross training will be key for you.
You don't always HAVE TO race, but the intensity is a nice counter point to the steady running. If you aren't feeling it, an easy ride with 6 to 8 x 30" bursts of high cadence (Seated spinning) Will help.
I think we need to work outside of the box WRT to prep for MOAB.
Basically you can't do that many miles in a week, consistently, without really suffering at home, at work and physically.
4/15 - Rattler
7/19 to 7/21 - VT 100k
10/11 to 10/15 - Moab 240
I think it might be worthwhile to have a long run in early September, in the 100mile race range. It would be your peak long run (solo) and would Be a great way to final prep. Of course, that's asking a lot of time and money and support. I am not sure if you can Make that happen, but I want to Put the option Out there.
If its straight running, I would need to know just how long you can run in a solo session and/or double Weekend session (SAT + SUN).
Yes there will be some bigger weeks, but that's a function of how we distribute the running.
So...let me know about SEPT and the weekend question...we can go from there!
on the schedule there is also Barkley Fall Classic which is between (nobody knows the exact distance) 50k and 70K - its on 9/21 which fits perfectly well before entering Moab taper, I know 4-5 people who did both last year. Considering its mostly climbing and not "hard" run I dont see issue with it and I "need" to get 2 BFC finish under my belt to be in the considered bucket for the Big Barkley eventually.
For the bike, I enjoy our Monday night 25-30 minutes races where we now have a guaranteed FTP bump, we are usually the same people, so mojo is nice to push each other, but will keep in mind your idea if I dont feel it. Most important is to put time on the bike and use it as a recovery and training tool.
Regarding September, I actually have no plan considering the goal at Rattler is to qualify for Leadville which is 8/18. I suggest we wait until Rattler and we can plan after. - I dont wanna jinx it =)
Regarding Moab, I agree with you - people I know who did it told me its mostly like doing for a 100 miler, but it sucks 3X longer. Here are some items I thought about.. but it will be a trial & error process
1) Stretch, lesson to the small little signal body gives. I started stretching since I went to PT for my groin and its now in mt go-to-bed routine to do 25' of different exercises for the groin, butt, knees and toes. I am confident this helped the build to the volume I am actually at
2) I thought about standing more during the day, we have standing working station at the office, I might start using it a bit everyday - aka time on your feet.
3) in our approach I guess we need to train smart, not necessarily more. I havent yet figured out that aspect
4) I guess that run commute will help about the fastpacking aspect of that race
I agree with you in terms of not jinxing us! It is still a long year just yet. I think the BFC would be perfect… At least we know it will not sell out I agree that we need to see how your year goes. I don’t want to set any arbitrary targets that may prove to be too much. I will keep following you.
Entering week 12 & 13 which are the biggest week of this training plan. - cant believe we are already there.. considering the 2 weeks down because of Rattler date changes, that makes 14 weeks we are on this plan! Time flies
The plan this week has 2 big runs and my planing is to do :
1) the 4h run on Thursday after work - will split it by doing 45 minutes in the morning during the commute and balance after work.
2) the 5h run on Friday morning.
As you can see, both runs will be done within a 12 hours window, this is the only way I can make it this week.. hopefully working schedule will collaborate and let me take Friday morning off.
Both are capped by 1) no longer than 24 but not less than 20 and 2) Between 26 to 30 mile. We are finally getting warm weather this week and it will make so that trails should be usable (Finally!!!). My question is : should I get on trails, which will make my run slower considering mud etc but will make me get the total time aspect of the workouts or do what I did all winter and mostly stay on bike path, hit the distance only and not caring about the time - following that aspects usually remove 30'-45' to workout. - Let me know!
@Francis Picard it is so funny that you mention the weather. When I saw the forecast for this week I totally thought of you. I wasn’t sure if the weather would get that nice up by you or not, I’m glad to hear that it will. I think that getting you on the trails is a top priority. It is a nice change of scenery for you and will be much more specific to the challenges of your race. Also important to note that it Will be a little bit easier on your body then just running on the bike path.
The most important aspect of this “double session” is making sure that you recover well between them. This means recovery protein right after the first session, and excellent meal, protein at bedtime, and lots of rehydration. And on Friday he will need to really fuel right out of the gate. Do not be afraid to use caffeine if required in that second session. I can’t wait to see the maps!
first double session in the bag! Finally trails weren't yet ready for running.. I feel sore but less than expected but really looking forward to do these long on trails/wood, I think next week will again be on roads.
I mostly use the same recovery protocol as the camp weeks but did add the following:
1) Air relax for an hour after each run
2) micellar casein before bedtime
Cant believe we are entering the last week of the training plan, that was a challenging plan!
Not much climbing, I am actually climbing over 5000 feet per week, so legs should be good for a 4000 feet climbing race. The course also doesnt seem to have a major climb. My worry is more about the temperature drastic change going from the Canadian Ice Cube to the sweaty and humid Texas
Thanks for the update. I agree, I am not concerned at all about the elevation. And you certainly are fit! I know you hate your heart reminder, but that is a great tool to make sure you aren’t overheating. Something to think about. The key to the heat is showing up hydrated, as in using the free hydration next, and doing your best to stay cool. Do you have A plan to stay cool?
We are in taper weeks !!! made it! that training was tough considering the conditions I was with weather and work but made it.. remember to not register in any spring races next year!
I register to another stupid race last night - a last man standing race. Concept is every hour we start a 4.111 mile. So basically its a 100 miler in 24 hours.
a month before VT100, so fits perfectly as 4 weeks before is usually the 4X4X48 for 100 milers.
@Francis Picard So impressed. I can't believe yogurt that much work done in such crappy conditions. You are either super tough or you lack almost any common sense. 🤣
I love the last man standing concept. The pressure not to miss the start Would terrify me. Doing that would be awful. If you can, please increase your yoga to keep the self care high. We have a long road ahead of us yet, so every session counts.
Comments
@Francis Picard Your stupidity is outpacing my capacity for coaching!!! We'll have to talk more about it...time to set up another call methinks!
sure ! that will be a great coaching challenge for you :)
@Coach Patrick
finally done with these 2 weeks rest !! My impression, I "believe" 10 days could have been enough, I was starting to feel more tired than rested, meaning I was getting flat and bleh. This morning after the CnC, I went for a 12 mile run.. I know it brought the total mileage over 40 mile, but I needed it =)
This week, we are back to week 6 and its going to be a shitty week weather wise with Tuesday and Wednesday be a snowstorm and cold. Will follow the week 6 plan, except that the long run (3h30 and 3h) will be done on Friday and Saturday.
so:
Monday - Commute morning and detour on the mountain on my way back - 35' zwift race in the evening
Tuesday - just survive the commute
Wednesday - commute morning and detour on the mountain on my way back to do the tempo run (5X1M @ z3)
Thursday - commute only
Friday - 3h30 long run, will do that one on the flat
Saturday - 3h long, will do that one on the mountain to get elevation
Sunday - rest + 40-50' zwift ez spin
Total time on feet should be around 10 hours for the week and mileage approximately around 80-85 mile.
I am open to suggestions too!
Thanks!
That looks perfect to me I agree with you on the recovery aspect. In the future, you can definitely reach out to me and we can make changes in a more dynamic fashion. That said, nothing wrong with being A little extra rested.
I agree that this week will be tough simply because it means getting back to baseline run numbers. Do yourself a favor and listen to your body, stay on top of the protein and recovery as much as possible.
I'll be stalking...
~ Coach P
Just checkin in!
all dashboard monitors are green - only thing I realized when looking at data is that I lose weight during the recovery weeks, isnt suppose to be the opposite ?
Last week was week 8 which was recovery week, I toke it as a recovery week even if we took 2 weeks easy at the beginning of January - as you said, nothing wrong with being extra rested, also was perfect timing with work where I did over 65 hours for the last 3 weeks and will be like until end of February.
This week the runs are capped at 24 mile.. I will try not to do the additional 2 miles just to get a marathon =).
We are now 7 weeks out Rattler, I am glad where my volume is and nothing hurts on the body, but I am still going to the PT weekly to ensure hips and groin are still OK, anyway with insurance its 0$ for 90 minutes consult, so better to use it! Also still doing the 15-20 minutes exercice when in bed before falling asleep.
As for the volume, I am in the 74-80 mpw zone, I'll probably stick in that zone until Vermont 100K which is 7/22, I dont think we need to add more at this point and until the race, once the ice and snow will be melt I think I could add little more speed, by being cautious of course.
Again, the A-GOAL for now is to quality for Leadville at Rattler, its hard to know what is the targeted time now since its a new course.
Thanks!
Sounds like you are really absorbing the training alone well. There’s nothing wrong with “sitting steady” at the current level of work because you will get stronger and become more accustomed to the load.
I strongly encourage you to avoid chasing those extra 2 miles and recommend that if you have any extra energy after all of that work in training to spend it on your bike or doing some flexibility work I think that will be your best bet.
From a macro perspective I do think it’s important that we give you some time to recover from the running. Another words, I don’t want you running 80 miles a week for the next four months. One or two bike focused weeks would also be beneficial for you similar to your evil teammate @Tim Sullivan - you can keep the workload high but give your running muscles a short but well-deserved rest of 5 to 7 days. Maybe even a Monday to Friday focus so that you can get the long run in again on the next weekend. What do you think about that?
I am not familiar with the new course, have you found out anything about it that could help you?
Didnt really find anything about the new course.. I guess we will all be on the same boat.. best plan is to get there healthy, rested and strong.
As for the Macro level - got it, last week ending at 79 was on purpose :) I did split the 2 big days into 2 runs per day. Day 1 was 3 in the morning and 23 in the evening and Day 2 was 2X13 mile. Splitting the runs makes it easier on my working schedule.
4 months bring us 6/24 which is one month before Vermont 100K, which I think we should get there fit with your recommanded volume cap
My questions for now are :
1) Being between 70-75 per week for 4 months, are we going to have enough time to build for Moab in 4 months ? My feelings are i dont think we will need to increase much more when we get into the deep Moab preparation - I think 120-140 per week might be the biggest weeks, unless you have a different view on that, after all, you are the coach and i am the one suffering =) I realized this week how big of a challenge it will be, but if dreams arent scary is that because they arent big enuff!
2) I totally see a difference in my runs and recovery speed when biking the CNC and doing Zwift Races on Monday night (these 2 days work the best for my schedule) - whats your opinion on that ? I can maybe make another bike session but that will be stretch, also do you think I should keep the Monday races which are the 10 mile flat races that last less than 30 minutes and do just an easy boring spin
3) Doing bike focused weeks mean not run commute for 2 weeks !!! - are you sure I dont need to go to the office ? :) I could maybe reverse it by running during the week and do a Thursday night to Sunday bike focused as I should be able to resume working from home on Friday in 2 weeks.
Thanks!
@Francis Picard SUPERKUDOS to you for staying under 80. I am grateful. And so is your body.
Small things...
I think we need to work outside of the box WRT to prep for MOAB.
Basically you can't do that many miles in a week, consistently, without really suffering at home, at work and physically.
I think it might be worthwhile to have a long run in early September, in the 100mile race range. It would be your peak long run (solo) and would Be a great way to final prep. Of course, that's asking a lot of time and money and support. I am not sure if you can Make that happen, but I want to Put the option Out there.
If its straight running, I would need to know just how long you can run in a solo session and/or double Weekend session (SAT + SUN).
Yes there will be some bigger weeks, but that's a function of how we distribute the running.
So...let me know about SEPT and the weekend question...we can go from there!
~ Coach P
@Coach Patrick
on the schedule there is also Barkley Fall Classic which is between (nobody knows the exact distance) 50k and 70K - its on 9/21 which fits perfectly well before entering Moab taper, I know 4-5 people who did both last year. Considering its mostly climbing and not "hard" run I dont see issue with it and I "need" to get 2 BFC finish under my belt to be in the considered bucket for the Big Barkley eventually.
For the bike, I enjoy our Monday night 25-30 minutes races where we now have a guaranteed FTP bump, we are usually the same people, so mojo is nice to push each other, but will keep in mind your idea if I dont feel it. Most important is to put time on the bike and use it as a recovery and training tool.
Regarding September, I actually have no plan considering the goal at Rattler is to qualify for Leadville which is 8/18. I suggest we wait until Rattler and we can plan after. - I dont wanna jinx it =)
Regarding Moab, I agree with you - people I know who did it told me its mostly like doing for a 100 miler, but it sucks 3X longer. Here are some items I thought about.. but it will be a trial & error process
1) Stretch, lesson to the small little signal body gives. I started stretching since I went to PT for my groin and its now in mt go-to-bed routine to do 25' of different exercises for the groin, butt, knees and toes. I am confident this helped the build to the volume I am actually at
2) I thought about standing more during the day, we have standing working station at the office, I might start using it a bit everyday - aka time on your feet.
3) in our approach I guess we need to train smart, not necessarily more. I havent yet figured out that aspect
4) I guess that run commute will help about the fastpacking aspect of that race
I agree with you in terms of not jinxing us! It is still a long year just yet. I think the BFC would be perfect… At least we know it will not sell out I agree that we need to see how your year goes. I don’t want to set any arbitrary targets that may prove to be too much. I will keep following you.
Hi @Coach Patrick !
Entering week 12 & 13 which are the biggest week of this training plan. - cant believe we are already there.. considering the 2 weeks down because of Rattler date changes, that makes 14 weeks we are on this plan! Time flies
The plan this week has 2 big runs and my planing is to do :
1) the 4h run on Thursday after work - will split it by doing 45 minutes in the morning during the commute and balance after work.
2) the 5h run on Friday morning.
As you can see, both runs will be done within a 12 hours window, this is the only way I can make it this week.. hopefully working schedule will collaborate and let me take Friday morning off.
Both are capped by 1) no longer than 24 but not less than 20 and 2) Between 26 to 30 mile. We are finally getting warm weather this week and it will make so that trails should be usable (Finally!!!). My question is : should I get on trails, which will make my run slower considering mud etc but will make me get the total time aspect of the workouts or do what I did all winter and mostly stay on bike path, hit the distance only and not caring about the time - following that aspects usually remove 30'-45' to workout. - Let me know!
Thanks
@Francis Picard it is so funny that you mention the weather. When I saw the forecast for this week I totally thought of you. I wasn’t sure if the weather would get that nice up by you or not, I’m glad to hear that it will. I think that getting you on the trails is a top priority. It is a nice change of scenery for you and will be much more specific to the challenges of your race. Also important to note that it Will be a little bit easier on your body then just running on the bike path.
The most important aspect of this “double session” is making sure that you recover well between them. This means recovery protein right after the first session, and excellent meal, protein at bedtime, and lots of rehydration. And on Friday he will need to really fuel right out of the gate. Do not be afraid to use caffeine if required in that second session. I can’t wait to see the maps!
first double session in the bag! Finally trails weren't yet ready for running.. I feel sore but less than expected but really looking forward to do these long on trails/wood, I think next week will again be on roads.
I mostly use the same recovery protocol as the camp weeks but did add the following:
1) Air relax for an hour after each run
2) micellar casein before bedtime
Cant believe we are entering the last week of the training plan, that was a challenging plan!
I found the new Rattler course:
https://ridewithgps.com/trips/31413242?fbclid=IwAR1-GWvL-12Cq53jl9MAmpq_D-D1JnyLSDmOIbip_F2v9y2tBQ7sKZvj7-k%20target=&_ga=2.186851688.1161492604.1552740607-396060124.1545184048
Not much climbing, I am actually climbing over 5000 feet per week, so legs should be good for a 4000 feet climbing race. The course also doesnt seem to have a major climb. My worry is more about the temperature drastic change going from the Canadian Ice Cube to the sweaty and humid Texas
Thanks for the update. I agree, I am not concerned at all about the elevation. And you certainly are fit! I know you hate your heart reminder, but that is a great tool to make sure you aren’t overheating. Something to think about. The key to the heat is showing up hydrated, as in using the free hydration next, and doing your best to stay cool. Do you have A plan to stay cool?
We are in taper weeks !!! made it! that training was tough considering the conditions I was with weather and work but made it.. remember to not register in any spring races next year!
I register to another stupid race last night - a last man standing race. Concept is every hour we start a 4.111 mile. So basically its a 100 miler in 24 hours.
a month before VT100, so fits perfectly as 4 weeks before is usually the 4X4X48 for 100 milers.
@Francis Picard So impressed. I can't believe yogurt that much work done in such crappy conditions. You are either super tough or you lack almost any common sense. 🤣
I love the last man standing concept. The pressure not to miss the start Would terrify me. Doing that would be awful. If you can, please increase your yoga to keep the self care high. We have a long road ahead of us yet, so every session counts.
Let me know what you think!
~ Patrick
Totally agree with you, seeing how easy people doing these ultra stuff get injured convinces me to keep self care.
you should register to the last man standing thing, you could win!
😂