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NOS 2014, Week 11 Bike wko's (More harder please!)

Joe HallatschekJoe Hallatschek
in General Training Discussions

Roy is out of town and so I'm firing up the bike thread for this week!

The Tuesday workout reaches yet another new level for us at Z4! Using your new FTP, this should certainly be a challenge for anyone to meet 1.0 FTP for all the assigned sets! Although the Thursday workout keeps the same Z5, the Saturday bike increases Z4 just enough such that if you overachieve on Thursday, you'll know it!

Since EN has about 50% not using power, we encourage those using HR/Speed (sensor on back wheel) to chime in with their workouts as well. Weeks #11-13 are the hardest weeks in the OS based on the workouts, weather, and just OS fatigue. So, keep the mojo going and post when you can!  

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Comments

  • Edwin CroucherEdwin Croucher
    Joe, Can't wait for the Tuesday workout. Beating around that FTP for those intervals with less than full recovery between efforts is increadibly building. I was getting dizzy during Saturday's FTP work.
  • Joseph LombardiJoseph Lombardi

    Hey everyone...back on board...not that I was overboard...but I was absent pretty much from these boards over the holiday...had a little cold but hacked away at most of the workouts....and looking forward to an extra level of seriousness this month...

    Quick Question....rough percentage of you workouts that you ride in Aero position v road position?...I typically ride Aero and sit up during recoveries ...but this weekend I did a tough sufferfest video and road some of the harder intervals in a more upright position...but really worked ...it felt good...Thoughts?  Good Bad Indifferent at this point of the season?

  • Shaughn SimmonsShaughn Simmons
    @ Joseph - I try to do everything except VO2 in the bars as much as possible.......When I go to 110% and beyond, I personally have to get out of the bars to get it all done......
  • bc4uabc4ua
    For my own sanity I did everything on my road bike until I loaded up the full ironman plan.



    After a couple weeks on the full plan with the tri-bike, my power was the same. YMMV.



    When I was on the tri bike, I followed Shaughn's approach. Everything in the bars except VO2 stuff.
  • zwubazwuba
    I do Z4 and above upright - all the rest in the bars!
  • Joe HallatschekJoe Hallatschek
    @Joe - I do just like you on an old Javelin Tri-bike, circa 1997. Z3 and below I am off the aero.
  • dpiburndpiburn
    Mostly in the bars, except between sets.
  • Mark MaurerMark Maurer
    All in aero except the recoveries.
  • Brad MarcusBrad Marcus
    GOOD LORD! I did the 10', 15' 10' FTP wko today and I'm not sure if it was due to tired legs or general fatigue but I found it to be THE toughest wko in the Nov OS yet! It was also the wko that I was the most proud of since despite what my legs told me from the warmup - I got it done!

    Here's the results (target FTP = 225:

    23' warmup including 10' @ .81 (183w)
    10' @ 1.0 (224w)
    15' @ 1.0 (224w)
    10' @ 1.0 (225w)
    20' @ .84 (188w)

    Total 1 hour 35 min - 199w NP

    Followed this up with 30' run with strides on the treadmill - my 1st indoor run of the year...I finally succumbed to the weather!

    Have a great week!
  • Brad MarcusBrad Marcus
    @Joseph- at this stage, I'm only 25% in aero. As I get closer to racing I'll spend more time in aero, but I am not too comfortable in aero on the the trainer. Once I get outdoors, I can ride in aero much longer.
  • Edwin CroucherEdwin Croucher
    I only have one bike and I am with Stefan. Zone 4 and above up on the horns. That is how I climb hills and there is no other time when I am riding that I put out that kind of power for any sustained period.
  • MikeInNHMikeInNH
    I'm with Brad on this one - had to get Tues bike in today because of schedule and it was tough, even cut down to 60 min.

    MS Int IF 0.99 / 0.99 / 0.98

    Enjoy everyone.

    Mike
  • Mike WeinmannMike Weinmann
    Tues bike done & dusted. Was just as tough as expected and was only able to hold the bottom end of the range but wattage increased in the last interval, so I'll take it

    standard EN w/u (did not hit 80% on the 12' segment)
    12' @ 95% (230W)
    20' @ 95% (230W)
    12' @ 96% (232W)
    total time of 1h18min

    @ Joseph, for the first 8 weeks, I was aero pretty much the whole way. after the 2nd test, i've been upright during the Z4/Z5 work and have historically found that I can generate more power out of the bars

    @ Roy, tough loss last night. enjoy the weather even if you can't enjoy another championship and safe travels back home!
  • Shaughn SimmonsShaughn Simmons

    @ Mike & Michael - Solid work today because that is what is was.....WORK!..

    http://www.strava.com/activities/104632467    12' / 20' / 12' Z4 at .98 IF for all 3 = not fun at 5 a.m......run will happen at lunch.

    http://connect.garmin.com/activity/426181477

    On the aero bar string, remember you are going to be racing aero....not a bad idea to try to train yourself to Z4 it in aero.   Yes, you can turn a few more watts upright but the wind resistance is going to more that eat that up so think about whether or not you are doing yourself a favor but eeking out a few more watts sitting upright vs. training those muscles to push in aero mode.....I only want you to be faster!

    SS

  • Elizabeth HornakElizabeth Hornak

    I am tired and not motivated today. I am just whining and hoping to get myself a bit more excited to hit this bike this afternoon. I usually workout before work - today just didn't happen. School was cancelled and that put a crimp in my back to school mojo! Have a terrific Tuesday and I hope to post back today that I did the work that needed to be done! 

  • zwubazwuba
    About the Aero-position thingy:
    Nothing wrong on doing all the work in aero but remember there will be PLENTY and PLENTY of time after OS where you will ride in aero outside!
    For me it's all about maximizing the amount of WORK that is performed during the prescribed TIME of the workouts (let's call it workout efficiency)!
    This means the higher your power-output the better ... why should I ride with 280W in Aero when I can ride 300W upright?!
    In the end you can just look at your kJ-# you get from your PM data image
    BTW - I did never do any Z4 or Z5 interval in aero position and all of my FTP tests are also done sitting upright but even though I was able to ride my olympic distance (39k) @ almost 97%.

    @Elizabeth - GO GET IT!!!
  • MikeInNHMikeInNH
    Go get it Elizabeth - you'll feel motivated after you do!
  • Joseph LombardiJoseph Lombardi

    Stefan....this is the conclusion I have come to after two seasons...I have spent most of the time in Aero...but now believe that the "nugget" of work in the OS is the most important factor...and that doing Z5 in whatever position allows you to do the most work...gain the most overall bike strength is what matters...and that as you stated getting reaquainted to aero in Z3 and then in the outside/race prep phase is suitable/sufficient....and for Z4 I mix it up...a little of both....

    Not that there is anything wrong with doing the sessions in Aero...or however you feel you want to do them....but I have never worked as hard as I am now...so maybe it was just a mental change for me....but I'm going with it for now.

    Today; I felt I needed to mix it up a bit....so instead of the Z4 intervals I did Sufferfest Revolver (16x1 @ Z5++ with 1min. recoveries...) my best effort ever...

    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/...t-Revolver

     

    Now lets see if I can run at lunch

  • zwubazwuba
    Wow impressive IF!!! I really need to give that "Revolver" a try at some time ... it's 16x60' @ 135% correct?
  • rlh2000rlh2000
    Got it done, but it was another experience of a very sluggish warmup feeling like I just didn't have it in me, followed by being able to hit the intervals. I'm doing the 25 min EN warmup, and finding that it is really tough to hit that 12 min Z3 part of the WU. But I guess it does the trick in getting me warmed up because I was able to do the Z4 work. Definitely tough though!!
  • Edwin CroucherEdwin Croucher

    Holy hard workout. There Hurl meter was at 9.5 today. I am impressed that I made it through without a messy end. Best set of FTP work this OS. Pushed the intervals for 1.0, .968 & .981 IF. No time for the run, headed into work.

  • Brad MarcusBrad Marcus
    @Rachel- I've had a similar experience...especially in this weeks FTP wko. Throughout the warmup I almost convince myself that I don't think I'll make it through the intervals...but I do and seem to get stronger with each interval. I've also been doing a 25 min WU with 10-12' at z3 and I find it very hard. Funny enough is that the last 2 bike wko's I've finished with 20' at z3 after the intervals too, and I find those easier than the warmup! Way to get it done!
  • missyschorpionmissyschorpion
    Broke the rules a little bit today... After recovering from the flu this weekend and dealing with the cold temps outside, I put away the computer and Trainer Road and just hopped on the bike and spinned. It felt great to do a little bit of my own workout, without the pressure of trying to reach all my FTP targets. Definitely won't be doing this all the time, but it was a great refresher. Hoping it will give me the motivation to power on the rest of the week!
  • bob hillerbob hiller

    @Rachel.  I was struggling to hit z3 in warmup, so I just try to do z2.  I figure the point is to warmup, not build fitness, power, get tired, or struggle before the MS.   I don't have much trouble doing my extra time after the MS in the z3 range.  Bob

  • bob hillerbob hiller

    @Melissa.  Sounds wise.  A little mental and physical active recovery.  

  • Joseph LombardiJoseph Lombardi

    4miles on the TM (30min) at lunch...felt much better than expected.

    @ Melissa...ditto to your approach today...smart.

    @ Rachel....(&Robert)...ditto on the warmup...it is only that...a warmup...not work...do whatever you like that gets you ready for the MS...thats all that matters...go longer, shorter, whatever...the only part of the workout that matters is the MS 

    @ Stefan...Yes...give it try...you'll love it!...btw...the workout says 15x1...then when you get to fifteen...they throw in an extra one...chukl...throws you a curve the first time you do the workout...lol.

    Great work everyone...only 131 days to IMTX (thanks John Stark)...and todays temps in Houston is a sweet 39 degrees (wetsuit legal too  Lookin Good!

  • bmr94539bmr94539
    Saturday's wko was terrible for me. Rest day yesterday was so nice, my legs were still tired today, though. Got the MS done, but only hit .96, .96, .91. Last interval was tough and then got unlucky with some traffic lights.

    Going to get in some more time on the ride home and then hit the run there.

    I'm doing all of my OS riding on my road bike. Most of the miles are commute miles for me and it's just easier to drag along my stuff with the road bike than to try and get it on my tri bike image.

    Lots of good looking results. Go team!
  • rlh2000rlh2000
    @Melissa- agree with the others that it is totally a good approach some of the time. I love that EN is so data driven, but sometimes you need a break to just get back to that pure joy of biking and running.
  • Ralph MooreRalph Moore
    So, my trainer is on my outside screened Porch.
    weather at 5 AM said 17 degrees feels like 9.
    I know that is whiney compared to my northern teammates but it was cold to me.
    Bike gloves for a stationary bike ride.

    felt pretty good with IF 1.03, 1.04, 1.04.
    we'll see how the run goes.
  • zwubazwuba
    Back from the pain cave with an astonishing victory against the gorilla living there image
    I was prepared for another super-hard workout after reading some of your posts but I was really feeling solid and strong without any struggling throughout all 3 intervals!
    Did the intervals at 0.97 / 0.97 / 0.98 - > http://tpks.ws/dGzh

    @Joseph - holy cow 135% calculates to a horrifying 425W :-O .... I'm not sure if I and my little trainer can do that
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