I haven't fully read this thread, but I'd like to interject a drop of reality here. ALL of the comments on the ST thread are various people's own suggestions for how to do it and how it might play out. NONE of it (as far as I know) actually came from WTC. One guy said he "heard a rumor" on Kona... I personally think that as WTC has said in the past, the WC is very much tied to the location and all that Kona presents...
Scott - if you read the thread carefully, it appears there was discussion, to the point that Andrew Messick was even asked about it in an interview at Kona. His response is that he doesn't want to be the one that moves the WC from Kona which is not the same as him being ordered to move it, or it moves shortly after his employment extension contract ends (e.g., Dalian Wanda's purchase of WTC was contingent on key employees signing a new employment contract but I don't know how long it lasts).
And then there's this: More races to be announced this weekend and specifically noted to be 140.6 on their FB page. The IM shell game - where will the slots end up next?!?
All I have to say about a new IM is that if it is in the fall, then I don't give a flying fluck. With the exception of Texas (the only IM in the US between 1 Dec and 31 Jul), Ironman in this country has basically become a fall sport.
All I have to say about a new IM is that if it is in the fall, then I don't give a flying fluck. With the exception of Texas (the only IM in the US between 1 Dec and 31 Jul), Ironman in this country has basically become a fall sport.
RIP: Ironman California, Ironman Utah, Ironman Arizona (April version), Ironman St. George, Ironman Coeur d'Alene (June version). OTOH, it makes ski season more enjoyable.
I have to agree with Paul's frustration with the timing of North America ironmans. I'd prefer to have the opportunity to not have the main part of my build in the Okinawan (or soon to be Louisville) summers...
Add this to the mix. On the Ironman Weymouth page:
This event will offer 30 slots to the 2017 IRONMAN World Championship, Kailua-Kona, Hawai`i. Age group awards will be based on our traditional age group categories; for the purpose of Kona slot allocation we will blend the oldest age groups into a 55+ category for each gender.
A hypothesis: Slots will soon go the way of the pro's - available only at certain races, i.e. regional championships, other 'designated' races based on subjective criteria.
Age group awards will be based on our traditional age group categories; for the purpose of Kona slot allocation we will blend the oldest age groups into a 55+ category for each gender. ..
I'm not in the hunt for a KQ until 2017, so I hope Weymouth remains an outlier, but I suspect that is the start of a new trend. Over the next few years, I expect we will see more races like Weymouth, forcing the older athletes to target something akin to a regional qualifier to get a slot.
@ Roy: Agree with your hypothesis that Kona slots will be available only at certain races. I suspected this might happen when Andrew Messick responded to a question about the changes to pro payouts only being at certain races by saying something like, 'we, and our fans, want to see the best athletes race the best athletes and not only at Kona.' And this may already be happening in the 70.3 races. In the press release that @Al posted ^^, it states that there are 40 age-group Kona slots for the Ironman Vineman, but did not give a total number of slots for the 70.3 World Championships. @Paul: I too don't expect to be at the pointy end until 2017. But I would like to use the 2016 season as a race rehearsal for my 2017 KQ attempts by racing on the same courses in 2016. Nothing like having course intelligence. But if WTC decides to change their policy on which courses receive Kona slots...oh well. Just like EN has changed from offering camps at most courses to only regional camps. Although if WTC changes the policy, I probably wouldn't be too difficult to predict which races would get slots. The question would become, how would WTC change the registration policy to ensure the "best athletes race the best athletes" when a race like IMAZ, which would probably be a KQ course, fills on-site? Do they allow all AWAs the ability to register early for the KQ races like the Gold-level athletes get to do now for certain races? If not and it continues to only offer early-registration to Gold-level athletes, then Gold-level becomes more of a "perk". As of today, there is only early registration for 4 North American IM races (LP, Wisconsin, FL, and Chattanooga). But I could see them expanding that number to more races and having those races be the KQ races. Thoughts?
@ Bob - your race strategy is wise. Unfortunately, I have competing goals that do not allow me to pursue that strategy. E.g., Paul to wife - Honey, would you like to take vacation time during the school year and join me for Ironman Texas (imagine an icy stare right about now) or would you like to go to Zurich for Ironman Switzerland in July when it is too hot to do anything else in Tampa (my SAU bucket overfloweth!!)?
Re slots. Messick has made several posts on ST this week and indicated that Weymouth is an experiment, and that they are considering a number of tactics and changes to the KQ process to deal with the impact that the proliferation of races has done to the age group distribution at Kona. E.g., by guaranteeing one slot per AG, with more races, the 30-49 age groups have lost a proportional amount of slots to the older age groups which are now over represented at Kona. In short, it's gotten easier over the years for M60+ to qualify for Kona and they are going to reverse course. Besides Weymouth it remains to be seen what other avenues they may try and at which races. We'll just have to stand by.
Your comment on early registration is a separate issue. Apart from IMAZ, the increase in available races has virtually eliminated the instant sell out that characterized so many IMs in the past. In fact, I think the new tiered pricing structure that has gone into place this year is a direct reaction to the lack of instant sales. They are probably feeling the pinch of delayed cash flow compared to the days when they practically got 100% of the registration revenue on day 1. They want and NEED people to sign up sooner. So, no, I don't think the AWA early registration is a factor at all; and I don't expect to see them changing it.
Comments
I personally think that as WTC has said in the past, the WC is very much tied to the location and all that Kona presents...
Scott - if you read the thread carefully, it appears there was discussion, to the point that Andrew Messick was even asked about it in an interview at Kona. His response is that he doesn't want to be the one that moves the WC from Kona which is not the same as him being ordered to move it, or it moves shortly after his employment extension contract ends (e.g., Dalian Wanda's purchase of WTC was contingent on key employees signing a new employment contract but I don't know how long it lasts).
And then there's this: More races to be announced this weekend and specifically noted to be 140.6 on their FB page. The IM shell game - where will the slots end up next?!?
RIP: Ironman California, Ironman Utah, Ironman Arizona (April version), Ironman St. George, Ironman Coeur d'Alene (June version). OTOH, it makes ski season more enjoyable.
This event will offer 30 slots to the 2017 IRONMAN World Championship, Kailua-Kona, Hawai`i. Age group awards will be based on our traditional age group categories; for the purpose of Kona slot allocation we will blend the oldest age groups into a 55+ category for each gender.
A hypothesis: Slots will soon go the way of the pro's - available only at certain races, i.e. regional championships, other 'designated' races based on subjective criteria.
Guess who's not going to Weymouth anytime soon?
Meanwhile, this: http://www.ironman.com/triath...z3pcrG24Iq
@Paul: I too don't expect to be at the pointy end until 2017. But I would like to use the 2016 season as a race rehearsal for my 2017 KQ attempts by racing on the same courses in 2016. Nothing like having course intelligence. But if WTC decides to change their policy on which courses receive Kona slots...oh well. Just like EN has changed from offering camps at most courses to only regional camps. Although if WTC changes the policy, I probably wouldn't be too difficult to predict which races would get slots.
The question would become, how would WTC change the registration policy to ensure the "best athletes race the best athletes" when a race like IMAZ, which would probably be a KQ course, fills on-site? Do they allow all AWAs the ability to register early for the KQ races like the Gold-level athletes get to do now for certain races? If not and it continues to only offer early-registration to Gold-level athletes, then Gold-level becomes more of a "perk". As of today, there is only early registration for 4 North American IM races (LP, Wisconsin, FL, and Chattanooga). But I could see them expanding that number to more races and having those races be the KQ races.
Thoughts?
Re slots. Messick has made several posts on ST this week and indicated that Weymouth is an experiment, and that they are considering a number of tactics and changes to the KQ process to deal with the impact that the proliferation of races has done to the age group distribution at Kona. E.g., by guaranteeing one slot per AG, with more races, the 30-49 age groups have lost a proportional amount of slots to the older age groups which are now over represented at Kona. In short, it's gotten easier over the years for M60+ to qualify for Kona and they are going to reverse course. Besides Weymouth it remains to be seen what other avenues they may try and at which races. We'll just have to stand by.
Your comment on early registration is a separate issue. Apart from IMAZ, the increase in available races has virtually eliminated the instant sell out that characterized so many IMs in the past. In fact, I think the new tiered pricing structure that has gone into place this year is a direct reaction to the lack of instant sales. They are probably feeling the pinch of delayed cash flow compared to the days when they practically got 100% of the registration revenue on day 1. They want and NEED people to sign up sooner. So, no, I don't think the AWA early registration is a factor at all; and I don't expect to see them changing it.