JOS Bike Thread Week 1
Hi, I am Ralph and I am here to be your Bike Captain for the JOS this year. There will be a new Bike thread for each week of the OS.
The purpose of this thread is for folks to post their workouts for week 1 along with questions or comments about how the workout went or general kibbitzing with the rest of the crew.
I had a very inspirational long post with lots of words of wisdom but the site logged me out and it was lost. Probably a sign not to be so longwinded.
After reading everyone's bio and goals, we havea great group and I am looking forward to seeing some great workouts.
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Thanks Ralph.
Normally run 5 days/week with my wife (she is preparing for the Little Rock Half Marathon weekend March 2/3). Going to skip today and just do yoga along with getting back in the pool. Give the legs a day rest before executing an FTP test tomorrow on Zwift.
Have a great day.
Ok. So bike workouts and questions here in the forums. Smack talk in GroupMe. 😝🤠🥳🤩🤪😜😋
Got it.
I plan on 5 ride days a week.
Thanks for leading this, Ralph.
Quick question for the group. I was looking at the bike workouts in Final Surge and comparing to the ones in Trainer Road and there seems to be a mismatch in workouts? The most obvious example appears to be Thursday's VO2 rides. In Final Surge, this coming Thursday's workout is listed as "-Level 2: Twice through 9 x 30/20 @ Max Sustainable Effort with 5' @ Zone 2 (156 - 167 watts) to recover after the intervals. Total of 18 repeats". The TrainerRoad workout for 2019 OS Wk1 Thu L2 is described as "Level 2: 2x12' (4') @ Z3-Z4 (90%FTP) -- this isn't a VO2 workout in my opinion.
Am I missing something? Are the VO2 workouts in TR incorrect? There are differences in the workouts for other bike days, but not as material as this.
@Ralph Moore any suggestions?
I looked at the 2018 TrainerRoad workouts and those sync with what is in Final Surge. That is a work around if 2019 OS workouts are not adjusted
Thanks, Jeff! Had no idea. Great work around.
Maybe @Brenda Ross can help figure this out?
I got on the trainer and did my first bike workout today as I had an hour window that will be harder to get tomorrow.
3X6' in Zwift this afternoon and I could feel that. Definitely tired tonight. Trying to migrate my data over to the new computer so no other data. I did SWAG my FTP at 210 and the last interval was at that mark with the first two around a .98 & .99 from my memory of the numbers.
@Ralph Moore @Jeff Phillips @John Stark - I did not enter the workouts in the various locations, so let me reach out to Coach Patrick and see if he can shed some lights. Workouts in both platforms should be the same.
So this happened. First lesson of the OS if you don't have time, just hit the main set. Had to cut this one a bit short but got the good (painful) stuff in. Also, don't be afraid to go easier in between intervals if you need the recovery. Queen was the soundtrack today.
I only know about the zwift workouts, I don't use trainerroad any more.
Bike workout done yesterday knowing that today was going to be busy. Feeling it a little this morning but not too bad.
I went ahead and did an FTP test last night, in lieu of today's bike workout. I haven't touched the bike in the last 3 months, so I needed to get it all set up and cleaned up. The results were a bit better than expected. FTP is only off by about 4 watts from last year, so I'll take that as a good starting point. Feeling a little tight today, but I'll do today's run and shake things out.
Got’r done but... after starting (on Zwift), realized my FTP was set too low but thought WTH, I’ll see how I feel with this pitifully low number. I was fine so... need to adjust and best yet, do a dang test... how I dread those! Question for you zwifties - I used ERG mode, which I usually don’t. Should I have? It seemed to make the watts a little jumpy but does keep you honest, plus little gear changing.
@Julie Pfeifle I just got a KICKR a few months ago and have played around with ERG mode. I find for the longer steady intervals (like today's workout), ERG is great -- keeps you locked in so you hit your targets. For more punchy efforts (like Thursday's VO2 workout), I keep it in resistance mode. I've found it takes a couple of seconds for the trainer to catch up when increasing and decreasing the watts and when the intervals and rests come quickly (30/30s) I've found that annoying.
Workout #1 complete, I tested last back at the end of Oct, so knocked a couple points off to start the OS, ended up with IFs @ 99, .98., .98 on my 3x8'. Did part of the cool down, but my running partner (dog) was getting a bit upset that we hadn't gone for our morning run yet so I hopped off the bike after the sweet spot and took her for a 1.5 mile walk (will run tonight).
@Julie Pfeifle as to ERG mode, I have been using it on my Tacx and used it on the Computrainer for anything FTP related. But I do find that on Zwift if you want to hit 100% of your FTP you have to nudge it up 2 pts, otherwise you constantly hit 1-2 pts lower than your FTP. I use it for some of the sweet spot work too, but things like cruise and crush rides, etc. you are better just riding normally. For VO2 max on the real short stuff (30/30s) the spin-up can be an issue as Jeff said, although as they get to a 1+ minutes it will at least keep you honest for overall effort level.
Out of curiosity, anyone doing Tour de Zwift in addition to/as part of these workouts?
Did an FTP test today since I had no idea where I was relative to past efforts and last season. That plus operating with different bikes/power meter sources, it was good to set a baseline.
Not at all the number I had expected (204 down from 227). My HR was at max in the first five minutes (around 170 for me at almost age 64), so I backed off just a touch, thinking I would never sustain that for 20 minutes, backing the HR down to the mid 160's. Maybe I should have just let it ride. Anyway, its a baseline and I can certainly work with that.
Ran 30 minutes with my wife Virginia after the bike test. I ran 3 miles and she ran 5. Felt very good on the run, so I definitely left some watts on the table in the bike test. No worries.
We both had good days, so we celebrated with waffles.
Bike #1 and Run #1 in the bag. Bike felt good, but like Pat Koss said, I think I left some watts on the table at my recent FTP test on Sunday. No worries, plenty of time to get them back. I was able to run workout in TR and have Zwift up at same time to accrue those XPs :)
25 min treadmill brick off the bike with three 20 second strides in the middle. Coming off of 3.5 months of RDP, that was easy.
@Patrick Hayden I thought about Tour de Zwfit but decided against -- this is my first OS with the team and I want to keep it to the formula. I may do the Rob Sabo's Tour of Zwift he's mentioned (Jan 19-27).
@Julie Pfeifle - I have a love/hate relationship with ERG mode. To me, ERG is like doing a long run on a flat route with headphones on. I get the mileage and pace done. But all the while lost in thought listening to music or a podcast. It is almost unconscious training.
Non-ERG to me is like doing the long run on a hilly trail where you listen to the music while focusing on the fluctuation in the dirt, rollers, etc. Way more engaging.
Non-ERG also helps with practicing actual steady pedaling like you would outside. One goal back in the old days of EN OS before "smart" anything was to get your VI during your intervals as close to 1.0 as possible. The closer to 1.0 meant you were very smooth. Great practice for the real-world.
The end result is basically the same. Just depends on what I am in the mood for that day.
I have also found Trainer Road to be WAY less jumpy when displaying non-ERG real-time watts than Zwift. TR is just smoother. Zwift almost drives me nuts.
Ok, I am done. Now to put on on my spandex and shred a chamois. 3x10's coming up.
Still snow on the ground so WKO will be inside.
@Jeff Phillips - heard back from Coach P. Here is what he said:
"There is no Thursday VO2 in Week one. It’s a Sweet Spot Workout, image attached. Please ask him to confirm he’s using the 2019 OS plan in Final Surge"
Thank you very much @Brenda Ross , that was it. I loaded the 2018 OS back in Sept before the 2019 was available. Apologies to anyone if I caused confusion!
OK, I "ate my own dog food" as they used to say back in my tech days. I did two of the three 10 minute intervals non-ERG and one ERG.
Take away: Non-ERG interval time passed WAY faster than ERG. Plus lots of work focusing on cadence during the non-ERG sections. ERG time was almost boring. Hate to say that and I guess I now know why I can't do ERG WKO's longer than 90 minutes without wanting to shoot myself in the head. 😕
Duration: 1:00
NP: 180
TSS: 77
IF: .88
INTERVAL #1 (non-ERG):
IF: 1.01
NP: 206
VI: 1.0
Cadence: 95
Interval #2 (ERG)
IF: 1.00
NP: 204
VI: 1.0
Cadence: 88
Interval #3 (non-ERG)
IF: 1.01
NP: 206
VI: 1.0
Cadence: 89
@Julie Pfeifle ; I ride an old Computrainer, and ERG has always gotten me pretty fit. Glad your back is better! ERG mode does make it more difficult for me to mix standing into harder efforts, and the position change keeps my back from tightening-up. @John Stark : I rarely ride my trainer for over 90min, so I’m still alive. @Patrick Hayden : Great observation, I always end up a few watts short! I’ll need to graduate to a smart (non-ERG) trainer if I want to race on Zwift... or hit those 150’ rides on cold, rainy days later in JOS.
I’ve been riding a couple days/week, and assigned a FTP of 220w based on the PE of my harder efforts. I noticed that my HR only got to upper zone 3 range. The Sat ride looks like the real deal, so that should settle any questions. Good news is that I’m 10w higher than start of last JOS... and I’m 10lbs lighter. Today’s work: 3x10’ this am (.98, .98, .97). Run 1.5 with 3 strides this evening. Really enjoyed “airing it out” for 20s... like swimming 25’s in the pool.
Overall, great start everyone.
Thanks, everyone, for the great ERG feedback! I see what you mean, @JohnStark , by it being a little boring, and @John Culberson , great point on the need to shift positions to baby our backs! Guess I’ll play with it a little but likely go more non-ERG.
Did mine today as 3 x 8’ within Tour de Zwift stage 3 (dang hill at the end!). Did it non-erg and still kept 1.01 IF (SWAG FTP) and 1.0 VI.
I think I’ll still usually use erg mode, though, since it lets me put my head down and get the work done. Non-erg certainly kept my head in the game, though. Guess I’ve gotten spoiled by my Kickr...
Strong group coming together here.........
How are you all approaching your weekend ABP ride?
I've been doing the Sunday East Coast Cruise and Crush rides (in Zwift) which I really enjoy the and am planning on switching my long ride day to Sunday to continue doing them. This week I'm going to do an "open" ride in TrainerRoad at the same time to capture TSS and IF data and see how close the overall results compare to the stated goals in the plan. If the EN ride ends early, I'll continue to spin to hit that 2-hr mark.
For those of you that haven't done one of the weekend rides yet, I highly recommend. Get the discord app as well so you can get in on the banter during the ride.
So the bike was all setup and ready to ride yesterday morning. THen at 2ish AM, i start to throw up and then the other end was not happy either. Food poisoning hit and hit hard. I have not eaten anything besides pretzels. I have stayed hydrated and on the mend. Still feel like a$$ but much better than yesterday. So tomorrow i will try to get the bike in. maybe a shorter workout than schedule, TBD.
My schedule works best with the 5:05 a.m. CST TeamEN Hang On ride. Mix of Z4/ABP work with plenty of TSS. Thereafter I usually stay at Z2 through 2 - 2.5 hours and then finish early to have most of my Saturday free for other activities.
This week I ride/rode:
Tues: Z4/Z5 bike work (brick run)
Wed: Z2 Social Bike (later run)
Thurs: OFF (Run intervals - 5-6X800M)
Friday: Bike Race - no run
Saturday: Longish Bike ride (TeamEN Hangon Ride ~120 - 130 TSS) Short brick run EZ
Sun: Long Trail Run
@Jeff Phillips - Even though I live in snow country now, I plan on trying to get as many of them done outside. ABP on a fatty? 😀 @Gabe Peterson would be proud. :-) The high desert is also a few miles away so I can drive there, drop ~ 1,000 in elevation and ride the MTB on some flat terrain.
We also have a local studio that has a Sunday morning 3 hour training session where you bring your own bike and they set you up on a Kickr and you group ride and everyone is up on a huge screen riding together. They put Sufferfest-esque videos up but you do your own ride or one that are doing. Very fun. May try the EN group rides but really trying to be "Avatar Free" any place but the Tues./Thurs. rides or where I have targets. Will use TR or Zwift on those days and probably the other days where I need structured WKO's.
@Jonathan Brown - That's a crappy situation! :-). Too soon? :-) Feel better, brotha!
@Bill Manard - Way to get it done! ERG or no ERG. Done!
@John Culberson - Keeping it real old school Computrainer! Well done!
@Shaughn Simmons - Good to see ya, dude!