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Racing 2 Ironmans in a matter of Weeks......Your Thoughts......
I'm unable to do another full IM this year due to work and life (LOL). But I'd like to do 2 IM's next year if possible. IM Boulder and IM Lake Placid. Do you folks think this is too close together to do? I've completed 4 70.3's and did my first at IM Texas last year. Just wanted some input from everyone here.
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this is the two Ironman recommendations from the WIKI.
These are 7 weeks apart in 2019. The accepted guidance is that if you are going to leverage 2 IMs off one build, then the optimal time frame is 3 weeks apart, 4 at most. I've done 20 days apart and it worked very well. If you go with 7 wks, then you cannot float the 2nd Ironman off the 1st, but will require a solid build block in between (say 2 wks recover, 3 wks full build and 2 wks taper). It's not ideal because 4 of the 7 weeks are lower TSS at a critical period. However, everyone is different. If you target Boulder as your A race and Lake Placid as your B race (with lower expectations) then you should be good (but make sure you have a really solid base before Boulder.
I've done the two ironman season a few times (3) and with a little luck, i'll be doing that again this year
2011 - Kentucky (August) and Arizona (November)
2014 - Tremblant (August) Arizona (November)
2016 - LP (July) WI (Sept) with Leadville MTB 100 between the two
I can tell you that in the 14 & 16 years when I was more into this game seriously, I was heavily fatigued and performance suffered in the 2nd event. I do think there are reasons that this happened and if you are smart (and you have this thread) you can avoid those.
likely I didn't listen to @Coach Patrick's advice and overtrained. Thinking I still need to be at some absurdly high CTL instead of just cruising a bit as he would have liked. I also thought Leadville in 16 (3 weeks after LP & 4 weeks before WI) would be "just a big day in the saddle." In fact, I remember writing that when I first planned it and coach scoffed!
Patrick, especially in his recent years has mastered the 1-2 punch with the 2nd one being a Kona qualifier, so if anyone can guide you, you are in the right place. I did have a friend that trained with a 1:1 coach who had her use LP as a big training day with specifically lower goals as a set up for Wisconsin in 2016 where she qualified.
So, it is very doable, and well, if you listen to smart people and don't try to know it all like I did. I may be there with you at IMLP19 to push you harder too!
@Keith Shireman As mentioned it's doable
There is some older discussion here https://endurancenation.vanillacommunities.com/discussion/19688/two-ims-in-one-month
and Coach P's experience following Kona 2018 in to Cozumel.
Tired to add that 2nd link and I messed something up
https://endurancenation.vanillacommunities.com/discussion/25383/coach-p-1-ironman-cozumel-0-or-something-like-that
@Keith Shireman - how old are you? How many years have you been doing endurance events?
@Dave Tallo I'm 52 and competing in endurance events since 2009. IM Texas was a 13:18 for me.
I’d say yes, then. Not that there’s a magic formula.
One tip would be ignore your PMC after IM 1 (if you ordinarily pay attention to this) cuz the basic model fails to capture reality.
There's still a lot of things to work on but I've got plenty of time to try and plan things out. But like Mike Tyson said.....'Everybody's got a plan until they get punched in the face or knocked out.' I don't know if I'll every be fast enough to qualify for Kona, but I'd still like to try and challenge myself. A lot of the information here and from Coach P are extremely helpful. But hey you never know! There a lot of fast 50 yo triathletes!
"One tip would be ignore your PMC after IM 1 (if you ordinarily pay attention to this) cuz the basic model fails to capture reality."
this is exactly where I went wrong and didn't listen to @Coach Patrick
PMC @scott dinhofer ?
performance management chart, as used in WKO, Trainingpeaks, and others.
In addion to Scott’s excellent advice, here’s my additional note: if you are looking for a model of how to go about this, pay more attention to the type of questions and thinking that Patrick had brought into his “assault on 2x” and less on his actual training or workouts. The guy is a different species than the rest of us and had a pretty unique “fast adapter” physiology, and trying to follow his work - personal experience here- is a tall order for hurt. But he’s also really good at asking questions and applying advice to his circumstances.
Thank you for the advice @Dave Tallo If I do decide to tackle 2 IM's in that time frame, I plan to discuss with @Coach Patrick further so that I can get a better analysis of what my training plans should be like. It won't be easy but deciding which race will be an "A" race and which is a 'fun race' is what I need to do. I have to ask myself why do I want to do this and what are my expectations in tackling 2 IM's 7 weeks apart.