@maurice matthews - i know there is a thread that discusses this, from when @Tim Sullivan first brought forward the idea. I am curious if you can search for it and present it here for us. I know @Tim Sullivan has good insight on this, so hopefully we'll hear his comments!
Thanks for leading @scott dinhofer ! I do love le Zwift and curious also how we can sub in Zwift races/rides. My favorite is the Wednesday morning Coffee with Espresso ride. Not sure if that's a good fit or not. I just downloaded the OS files and am ready to get at it with you all!
I'm starting JOS week 2 this week. Look forward to all the blood, sweat, tears and smack talk you animals can dish out!
Who's doing structured and who's doing Zwift race for tomorrow's work?
@maurice matthews - I think a good mix of both types of WKO are healthy. At the end of the day just make sure you are getting your work (TSS) done over the right amount of Zones prescribed, i.e., plan time prescribed in each zone - Z3, Z4, Z5, etc......too much too soon may not be sustainable, therefore using the plan as a guide while it gently ramps you each week across the bike and the run is a great start!
@Shaughn Simmons I'm doing structured workouts in TrainerRoad for Tues/ Thurs for the first 4 weeks. I may swap out Saturday 2-hr structured plan for ~2 hr 40 min 3R ride on Zwift I've done with Maurice, Bill Manard, and Steve Boer a few times. Depends if my day has time for the extra ~40 min of riding needed for the 3R.
During the 2nd block I'll replace a Tues or Thurs structured workout with a Zwift race (to really push upper bounds). During the 3rd block, I'll continue one mid-week Zwift race with a Zwift race + Endurance ride on the weekend.
I think once the VO2 workouts start, I'll always do those structured workouts. As far as the sweep spot and FTP workouts, I think I'll do a mix of races and structured workouts depending on how I feel during that day.
For the Sat rides, I'm going to try to get up and do the hang-on ride/ODZ coffee rides as much as possible.
@Carl Alleyne I want to mimic the intensity of the planned workouts just with the feel of group rides/races lol. It may take some tinkering to find specific rides/races that fit my need. I don't want to overdo it and end up in a ride that has been in Z4 for 50 mins....unless the WKO calls for it lol. #KingSandbagger
@scott dinhofer I had used my husband's laptop where my cycleops ANT+ device worked fine for picking up HR, but now I switched to a iPad tablet and bought an Apple sanctioned converter cable to go from USB to the tablet. I have it about a foot in front of my bike. ANT+ doesn't work now. I'm guessing I'll have to check Tech Support. Not sure if the converter is working - maybe I got a faulty one. I'm was hope not to have to purchase a Wahoo ANT+ device... $$$....
yes bike workouts can be replaced with Zwift races. This has been done for a few years now. What races you choose is based on the type of work you’re trying to achieve. For example, if you want 40 minutes of high-intensity effort then you could pick a longer crit race that will almost be all high effort. If you want shorter hard efforts mixed with a little bit of rest then you could pick a course like the volcano CCW course where you get a little bit of rest in between 30 second to one minute efforts every lap. If you need steady state work then you could pick a course that has a climb of your desired length in it or or a series of climbs.Generally, I try to vary the type of races I do so I don’t get stuck doing just flat races, just crit races, just hilly races, .... I also vary the length of the races from under 20 minutes which will be almost exclusively super high effort, to 40 minute races which I can still go superhard on, to longer than hour races.
The key is to work all the different power levels including your 10 second power, your 30 second power, your one minute power, your two minute power, your five minute power, your 10 minute power, your 20 minute power, ....
Zwift has rides anywhere from 12 minutes to 6 hour so you can always find something that will most likely be at the effort level you’re trying to obtain. If it’s a longer ride that doesn’t quite match up to your power then you can adjust your weight to get it to be dead on what you’re looking for.
EN has a bunch of rides that are very good at building bike strength. I personally like the Hang on ride, the CnC ride, and the bump races. I also like the KISS Tuesday/Thursday races for lots of variability. For steady state I like the KISS at base rides but there are lots of options like that ride now.
Just DONT get stuck doing one type of race because you like it trust me, if I picked my favorite course it would be a fast course with short efforts I would not pick Box hill races as those are tough turns out I do a big variety and it helps get me stronger in all races/riding.
hey @Sue DeJesus I bought the Garmin HRM Dual which is Bluetooth and ANT capable. Apple requires Bluetooth. I know a lot of people use the Wahoo HRM or the 4iiii Viiiiva but I am a Garmin loyalist
I’m going with ERG and structured WKOs that generally follow the JOS plan on Tues/Thurs. That will allow me to better control the TSS in the early going. My total training load is in a good place right now, and I hope to keep my TSB near -15 for the next 14 weeks, as I slowly build volume and FTP. While bike focused, I am committed to building my run durability... and I will substitute swimming when recovery seems smart for my legs. Weekend Zwift rides, particularly the West Coast CnC, will be fun, as long as I can stay disciplined. @Jeff Phillips Has a great plan. I like the 3R Ride, and can dial in the necessary efforts with weight-doping and feeling comfortable not completing the ride in the early weeks. In the past, my pattern has been to emphasize heavy weekend training and underutilize the benefits of regular weekday training stimulus. That has been moderately effective, but not optimal, and an easy trap for those of us who do not recover as quickly as we used to. This is the year I make the changes necessary to get to the next level.
I asked Coach P the same question on the Zwift races vs. workouts and his recommendation was to stick to the workouts for the first phase (5 weeks). In the second phase, weeks 6 to 10, you can replace one of the weekly workouts with a race that has comparable levels of work. in the third and final phase you can do one weekday workout and one of the weekend workouts as Zwift Races. For the weekend do a race and then just continue longer to build the endurance.
this is very much in line with what @Jeff Phillips shared above.
And @scott dinhofer i did not know the Velomati rules but i have read them and will play by these rules :-)
I'm in for Outseason #8 (I had to count and still can't believe it!). Thanks for leading this group, @scott dinhofer ! We are in good hands.
Another vote to keep this group in the forums, even though I'm having issues accessing them through my IOS mobile...working on that. I know I'm getting old when I find myself saying GroupMe is too fast and time consuming. New age group for me this year (50!).
I have issues with forums on IOS mobile too. Is there a fix?
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 7, 2020, at 10:55 AM, Brad Marcus wrote:
WARNING: This email originated from outside the organization. Please validate the sender’s email address and do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and are expecting the message. ________________________________
[Endurance Nation Community] ________________________________ Brad Marcus commented on JOS 2020 - Bike Week Zero
I'm in for Outseason #8 (I had to count and still can't believe it!). Thanks for leading this group, @scott dinhofer ! We are in good hands.
Another vote to keep this group in the forums, even though I'm having issues accessing them through my IOS mobile...working on that. I know I'm getting old when I find myself saying GroupMe is too fast and time consuming. New age group for me this year (50!).
iPhone 7 and iOS 13.3. It works randomly as I just got it working. When I click on link to go to forums it just constantly loops back to log in page. I am logged in but never leaves that page. Then randomly it will take me to the vanillacommunities page.
The forums DO NOT work from my iPhone. I'm not a fancy guy like @scott dinhofer and my kids seem to take all the phone upgrades. I have a iPhone 7. @Brenda Ross@AdminOne can you look into compatibility issues please?
@Andrew Lustigman I access the forums via my email notifications on my phone.
I initially couldn't get to the forums from my computer through Chrome and MS Edge, but Firefox works great. I went around and around with Coach P and Brenda trying to figure out why the forums wouldn't load. I just got a computer upgrade and now I can get to the forums via Chrome, go figure.
I have an iPhone 7 and can access the forums via reply to the email through my google gmail. And can navigate to other place from there.
Comments
@maurice matthews - i know there is a thread that discusses this, from when @Tim Sullivan first brought forward the idea. I am curious if you can search for it and present it here for us. I know @Tim Sullivan has good insight on this, so hopefully we'll hear his comments!
Thanks for leading @scott dinhofer ! I do love le Zwift and curious also how we can sub in Zwift races/rides. My favorite is the Wednesday morning Coffee with Espresso ride. Not sure if that's a good fit or not. I just downloaded the OS files and am ready to get at it with you all!
I'm starting JOS week 2 this week. Look forward to all the blood, sweat, tears and smack talk you animals can dish out!
Who's doing structured and who's doing Zwift race for tomorrow's work?
@maurice matthews - I think a good mix of both types of WKO are healthy. At the end of the day just make sure you are getting your work (TSS) done over the right amount of Zones prescribed, i.e., plan time prescribed in each zone - Z3, Z4, Z5, etc......too much too soon may not be sustainable, therefore using the plan as a guide while it gently ramps you each week across the bike and the run is a great start!
@scott dinhofer thanks for leading us my friend!
@Shaughn Simmons I'm doing structured workouts in TrainerRoad for Tues/ Thurs for the first 4 weeks. I may swap out Saturday 2-hr structured plan for ~2 hr 40 min 3R ride on Zwift I've done with Maurice, Bill Manard, and Steve Boer a few times. Depends if my day has time for the extra ~40 min of riding needed for the 3R.
During the 2nd block I'll replace a Tues or Thurs structured workout with a Zwift race (to really push upper bounds). During the 3rd block, I'll continue one mid-week Zwift race with a Zwift race + Endurance ride on the weekend.
@Jeff Phillips - OMG, such a great plan......I may have to plagiarize....
@Jeff Phillips this may be a silly question but I didn't see the blocks in the OS on Final Surge. How many weeks are in each block?
I think once the VO2 workouts start, I'll always do those structured workouts. As far as the sweep spot and FTP workouts, I think I'll do a mix of races and structured workouts depending on how I feel during that day.
For the Sat rides, I'm going to try to get up and do the hang-on ride/ODZ coffee rides as much as possible.
@maurice matthews
@Carl Alleyne I want to mimic the intensity of the planned workouts just with the feel of group rides/races lol. It may take some tinkering to find specific rides/races that fit my need. I don't want to overdo it and end up in a ride that has been in Z4 for 50 mins....unless the WKO calls for it lol. #KingSandbagger
I've included the link below created by Tim for Zwift racing:https://endurancenation.vanillacommunities.com/discussion/23811/zwift-racing/p1
@scott dinhofer I had used my husband's laptop where my cycleops ANT+ device worked fine for picking up HR, but now I switched to a iPad tablet and bought an Apple sanctioned converter cable to go from USB to the tablet. I have it about a foot in front of my bike. ANT+ doesn't work now. I'm guessing I'll have to check Tech Support. Not sure if the converter is working - maybe I got a faulty one. I'm was hope not to have to purchase a Wahoo ANT+ device... $$$....
Hey @maurice matthews!
yes bike workouts can be replaced with Zwift races. This has been done for a few years now. What races you choose is based on the type of work you’re trying to achieve. For example, if you want 40 minutes of high-intensity effort then you could pick a longer crit race that will almost be all high effort. If you want shorter hard efforts mixed with a little bit of rest then you could pick a course like the volcano CCW course where you get a little bit of rest in between 30 second to one minute efforts every lap. If you need steady state work then you could pick a course that has a climb of your desired length in it or or a series of climbs.Generally, I try to vary the type of races I do so I don’t get stuck doing just flat races, just crit races, just hilly races, .... I also vary the length of the races from under 20 minutes which will be almost exclusively super high effort, to 40 minute races which I can still go superhard on, to longer than hour races.
The key is to work all the different power levels including your 10 second power, your 30 second power, your one minute power, your two minute power, your five minute power, your 10 minute power, your 20 minute power, ....
Zwift has rides anywhere from 12 minutes to 6 hour so you can always find something that will most likely be at the effort level you’re trying to obtain. If it’s a longer ride that doesn’t quite match up to your power then you can adjust your weight to get it to be dead on what you’re looking for.
EN has a bunch of rides that are very good at building bike strength. I personally like the Hang on ride, the CnC ride, and the bump races. I also like the KISS Tuesday/Thursday races for lots of variability. For steady state I like the KISS at base rides but there are lots of options like that ride now.
Just DONT get stuck doing one type of race because you like it trust me, if I picked my favorite course it would be a fast course with short efforts I would not pick Box hill races as those are tough turns out I do a big variety and it helps get me stronger in all races/riding.
hey @Sue DeJesus I bought the Garmin HRM Dual which is Bluetooth and ANT capable. Apple requires Bluetooth. I know a lot of people use the Wahoo HRM or the 4iiii Viiiiva but I am a Garmin loyalist
I’m going with ERG and structured WKOs that generally follow the JOS plan on Tues/Thurs. That will allow me to better control the TSS in the early going. My total training load is in a good place right now, and I hope to keep my TSB near -15 for the next 14 weeks, as I slowly build volume and FTP. While bike focused, I am committed to building my run durability... and I will substitute swimming when recovery seems smart for my legs. Weekend Zwift rides, particularly the West Coast CnC, will be fun, as long as I can stay disciplined. @Jeff Phillips Has a great plan. I like the 3R Ride, and can dial in the necessary efforts with weight-doping and feeling comfortable not completing the ride in the early weeks. In the past, my pattern has been to emphasize heavy weekend training and underutilize the benefits of regular weekday training stimulus. That has been moderately effective, but not optimal, and an easy trap for those of us who do not recover as quickly as we used to. This is the year I make the changes necessary to get to the next level.
42 responses on the week zero forum thread, great seeing that contrary to popular opinion, the forums are alive and well! your week one thread is up!
I asked Coach P the same question on the Zwift races vs. workouts and his recommendation was to stick to the workouts for the first phase (5 weeks). In the second phase, weeks 6 to 10, you can replace one of the weekly workouts with a race that has comparable levels of work. in the third and final phase you can do one weekday workout and one of the weekend workouts as Zwift Races. For the weekend do a race and then just continue longer to build the endurance.
this is very much in line with what @Jeff Phillips shared above.
And @scott dinhofer i did not know the Velomati rules but i have read them and will play by these rules :-)
Eager to start tomorrow! Good luck everyone!
@Daniel Ballin What a great idea! I just ordered one! Much cheaper than the Wahoo ANT+!! Thank you so much!! :)
I'm in for Outseason #8 (I had to count and still can't believe it!). Thanks for leading this group, @scott dinhofer ! We are in good hands.
Another vote to keep this group in the forums, even though I'm having issues accessing them through my IOS mobile...working on that. I know I'm getting old when I find myself saying GroupMe is too fast and time consuming. New age group for me this year (50!).
Here's to a great OS!
I have issues with forums on IOS mobile too. Is there a fix?
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 7, 2020, at 10:55 AM, Brad Marcus wrote:
WARNING: This email originated from outside the organization. Please validate the sender’s email address and do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and are expecting the message.
________________________________
[Endurance Nation Community]
________________________________
Brad Marcus commented on JOS 2020 - Bike Week Zero
I'm in for Outseason #8 (I had to count and still can't believe it!). Thanks for leading this group, @scott dinhofer ! We are in good hands.
Another vote to keep this group in the forums, even though I'm having issues accessing them through my IOS mobile...working on that. I know I'm getting old when I find myself saying GroupMe is too fast and time consuming. New age group for me this year (50!).
Here's to a great OS!
I just accessed forums from both safari and chrome on my iPhone Xs, wondering if this is a phone/ version specific issue.
@Daniel Ballin and @Andrew Lustigman what phones and versions are you using??
iPhone 7 and iOS 13.3. It works randomly as I just got it working. When I click on link to go to forums it just constantly loops back to log in page. I am logged in but never leaves that page. Then randomly it will take me to the vanillacommunities page.
The forums DO NOT work from my iPhone. I'm not a fancy guy like @scott dinhofer and my kids seem to take all the phone upgrades. I have a iPhone 7. @Brenda Ross @AdminOne can you look into compatibility issues please?
I'n not a fancy guy @Andrew Lustigman - i lost my phone skiing last year and this was my first Iphone..
@Andrew Lustigman I access the forums via my email notifications on my phone.
I initially couldn't get to the forums from my computer through Chrome and MS Edge, but Firefox works great. I went around and around with Coach P and Brenda trying to figure out why the forums wouldn't load. I just got a computer upgrade and now I can get to the forums via Chrome, go figure.
I have an iPhone 7 and can access the forums via reply to the email through my google gmail. And can navigate to other place from there.