Powermeter and I are becoming friends. I've almost (almost) broken my habit of starting out too fast on intervals from heart rate days and am learning how to kick butt at the end of them instead of the beginning. I like drawing pretty, even curves. Running and I are in a serious honeymoon period, so I will take it. Every workout is just fun right now. The fun thing about this sport is that at least one of the disciplines is always a favorite. It balances out the times when they are big pains in the butt.
OK Coach P. So you did the workout as planned while feeling a cold coming on. Is that what you'd recommend for us under the same circumstances or would you modify?
Do you use morning resting HR as an indicator of when to shut it down?
If so, how do you modify your workouts? No workout, active recovery stuff, etc. I'm looking for how you work thru these issues as an athlete as well as a coach because often we give different advice than we dole out...the nature of the beast.
during FTP testing to you completely stop pedaling for the 2' or soft pedal? It would seem that by not pedaling at all that 2' would elevate the NP as the VI isn't affected as I recall based upon how WKO+ interprets zero input for that 2'. In other words, would intervals of 300 watts for #1 and #2 yield different NP if the 2' rest was 0 watts rather than 118 watts for that 2'?
Seems like if I coast down hills rather than soft pedal I end up with a higher NP when I ride the same course with effort about the same on the flats and hills. The only difference is that I don't work at all on downhills.
during FTP testing to you completely stop pedaling for the 2' or soft pedal? It would seem that by not pedaling at all that 2' would elevate the NP as the VI isn't affected as I recall based upon how WKO+ interprets zero input for that 2'. In other words, would intervals of 300 watts for #1 and #2 yield different NP if the 2' rest was 0 watts rather than 118 watts for that 2'?
Seems like if I coast down hills rather than soft pedal I end up with a higher NP when I ride the same course with effort about the same on the flats and hills. The only difference is that I don't work at all on downhills.
Vince
I typically do the 2' of rest at around 60% to 70% or whatever I can hold while getting my breathing undercontrol and some fuild in. I have never tired coasting during an FTT.
I never thought about the impact to the numbers of just not pedaling for the 2 minute rests. I'm not willing to try two 2 x 20(2) FFTs to test it out either. I might be crazy, but not that crazy. Maybe I will try a smaller scale test sometime and see what the no pedaling does to the VI an NP.
2 x 20' done as 315 and 300. I totally blew up on #2 and was lucky not to blow chunks. I have been "feeling" sick last few days, but this really cemented it. Was okay for first 20' (aside from mental fatigue) but right out of the gate on #2 I had no turnover. Ouch. I suffered through it thinking of you guys (THANKS!), but am glad that's behind me. More rest is needed...been staying up too late trying to bust out these new training plans on top of Xmas stuff...
Good luck all!
P
I have posted variations of this before and still do not know why it is not standard protocol???
This is pretty much always my plan if I think I am getting sick. I ignore it and push through. Figure that this way if I actually do get really sick and have to take some time off at least I got as much in before it as possible. Also, most of the time it turns out that I am just being a baby and am not really sick. Finally, if I am super convinced that I am going to get sick I try to have some strong margaritas at night on the theory that tequila can kill anything. Also, if it does not work and I actually get sick [as has happened a couple of times] I like drinking margaritas, usually have fun doing so and what is the big deal about being a little hung over if you are sick and supposed to sit around resting anyhow?
I never thought about the impact to the numbers of just not pedaling for the 2 minute rests. I'm not willing to try two 2 x 20(2) FFTs to test it out either. I might be crazy, but not that crazy. Maybe I will try a smaller scale test sometime and see what the no pedaling does to the VI an NP.
According to an erg file spreadsheet I have, doing the 2x20 (2') at 250 watts:
I've been "off the grid" EN-wise since my last race in October. The usual work/family/holidays chaos has limited my online EN time but I'm on the Nov OS advanced plan and have been hitting most of the workouts (minus some runs over the past 2 weeks due to tendinitis in my right knee).
I've been lurking on the forums the past couple of weeks to see what everyone was up to and to gain some inspiration and all the collective mojo has gotten me all geeked up to start posting again. For those of you I haven't "met" yet, I've been in Da Haus for one season now and race 70.3/Half distance. I live in Arlington, Virginia with DW, 2 young boys and one energetic dog, and work in public broadcasting. (Note: If you live in the DC/VA/MD metro area I'm always up for a weekend morning ride when the weather's decent!)
It's great, as always, to see all the mutual support and cheerleading in the postings and hear about everyone's struggles and small triumphs.
As for my training progress, I've been feeling really good on the bike and have been hitting all those workouts religiously. I do them all early before work and/or kids/spouse wake up and there have definitely been days where the temptation to turn the alarm off has been very strong. But feeling like I'm making gains keeps me motivated and returning to my basement for more fun intervals w/my iPod and Sportscenter. Overall, legs have been recovering well and I feel like I'm due for a bump next week. As for running, I had my best 5K test ever last month before my right knee started getting achey and forced me to back off the runs a bit so I'll likely be skipping the next test and play it by ear over the coming weeks. This will be my first full 20-week OS effort and I'm really optimistic that it's gonna give me a big jump in performance next season.
Looking forward to watching everyone else progress and reading about more FTP and VDOT bumps from everyone next week!
I was one of the lucky ENers to have the pleasure of meeting Chris Walz. Unfortunately it was as he cruised past me around mile 4 of the 9 mile run at the Brierman half lite tri in October. No surprise your run VDot is higher than mine!
Eagleman is also my A race. Looking forward to seeing you again, though under slightly different circumstances.
Matt - Thanks for your reply. Due to difficulty saving and uploading file from computrainer to WKO+, I restarted each interval eliminating the rest period so my avg. watts should equal normalized power, VI should be constant at 1).
I was fighting a cold last week, so I only got in 3 of the workouts....this week not much better as I've been swamped at work. I missed today and will probably just shift back a day and do the bike workout tomorrow.
I typically do the 2' of rest at around 60% to 70% or whatever I can hold while getting my breathing undercontrol and some fuild in. I have never tired coasting during an FTT.
I never thought about the impact to the numbers of just not pedaling for the 2 minute rests. I'm not willing to try two 2 x 20(2) FFTs to test it out either. I might be crazy, but not that crazy. Maybe I will try a smaller scale test sometime and see what the no pedaling does to the VI an NP.
Maybe Chris G will do a 2x FTP test with the variation being soft pedaling during rest vs complete rest. Just make sure the Tequila is ready. He might need the worm for that challenge.
Hey, Dan. Great to "see" you again. Very much enjoyed meeting you at Brierman. That was a painful race indeed. Let's not forget you made podium that day too! Told myself I wasn't going to return for that kind of hill suffering again but maybe if I use a 12-27 cassette next year.... Looking forward to seeing you again at Eagleman. Nice and flat! Let's hope the headwinds are mellow this year!
Chris M & Keith -- Sounds like you guys are both pretty close-by. Maybe we could hook up somehwere out on the W&OD one of these days for a nice little recovery ride if we can find a dry weekend above freezing. There's a nice loop I do in Reston once in a while that's not too far from the trail but I'm always up for learning some new routes. That makings of NoVa Sleeper Cell?
I've been feeling some of the same fatigue as the rest of y'all. Saturday was particularly tough...thought I was getting sick and really struggled to get out of bed and go Sunday morning. The snow and cold has hit here, so took a major effort to hit the trail before church in 0 degree weather. I was thinking about just making it a 45 minute EP run, but thought of the story someone posted about "whichever dog I feed the most" and decided to gut it out. I didn't put in the whole 60 minutes, but I did the 2x1.5mile @ z4 intervals and got home in time to get the family to church on time! Felt great later that day, so think it was the right decision. No idea if I'm making any real progress on the run, but we'll see
As for the bike, no problem hitting 105%-110% on all the FT intervals and 90%+ on the 85% "rest of time" parts. After 2 years I think I'm finally getting good at doing the FT intervals. My FT test was ~205 watts, and I've been doing my FT intervals at: 2 songs ~205, 1-2 songs at 210-215, and 1 song at 220-230+. The steady buildup seems to work much better than trying to hit the target watts right out of the chute. On the 85% intervals I do the first couple of minutes at around 85% and then pick it up to ~90%. For some reason those 85% intervals seem much more doable than prior years. I haven't shorted myself a single minute, and I think it's making a difference. A little worried about the test, but working on a plan.
@Bill - you do get physically and mentally better at sitting on .85. Just wait until you_can't_ ride any easier. IT will be your default pace and all your roadie buddies will shudder when you show up.
Chris M & Keith -- Sounds like you guys are both pretty close-by. Maybe we could hook up somehwere out on the W&OD one of these days for a nice little recovery ride if we can find a dry weekend above freezing. There's a nice loop I do in Reston once in a while that's not too far from the trail but I'm always up for learning some new routes. That makings of NoVa Sleeper Cell?
Ha! I've gone for rides in some pretty cold conditions but I draw the line at snow and ice. Don't forget to buy milk, bread and TP tonight. It's the DC winter tradition whenever a "blizzard" is forecast!
Comments
ABR = awesome.
Powermeter and I are becoming friends. I've almost (almost) broken my habit of starting out too fast on intervals from heart rate days and am learning how to kick butt at the end of them instead of the beginning. I like drawing pretty, even curves. Running and I are in a serious honeymoon period, so I will take it. Every workout is just fun right now. The fun thing about this sport is that at least one of the disciplines is always a favorite. It balances out the times when they are big pains in the butt.
OK Coach P. So you did the workout as planned while feeling a cold coming on. Is that what you'd recommend for us under the same circumstances or would you modify?
Do you use morning resting HR as an indicator of when to shut it down?
If so, how do you modify your workouts? No workout, active recovery stuff, etc. I'm looking for how you work thru these issues as an athlete as well as a coach because often we give different advice than we dole out...the nature of the beast.
Vince
Matt,
during FTP testing to you completely stop pedaling for the 2' or soft pedal? It would seem that by not pedaling at all that 2' would elevate the NP as the VI isn't affected as I recall based upon how WKO+ interprets zero input for that 2'. In other words, would intervals of 300 watts for #1 and #2 yield different NP if the 2' rest was 0 watts rather than 118 watts for that 2'?
Seems like if I coast down hills rather than soft pedal I end up with a higher NP when I ride the same course with effort about the same on the flats and hills. The only difference is that I don't work at all on downhills.
Vince
I typically do the 2' of rest at around 60% to 70% or whatever I can hold while getting my breathing undercontrol and some fuild in. I have never tired coasting during an FTT.
I never thought about the impact to the numbers of just not pedaling for the 2 minute rests. I'm not willing to try two 2 x 20(2) FFTs to test it out either. I might be crazy, but not that crazy. Maybe I will try a smaller scale test sometime and see what the no pedaling does to the VI an NP.
I have posted variations of this before and still do not know why it is not standard protocol???
This is pretty much always my plan if I think I am getting sick. I ignore it and push through. Figure that this way if I actually do get really sick and have to take some time off at least I got as much in before it as possible. Also, most of the time it turns out that I am just being a baby and am not really sick. Finally, if I am super convinced that I am going to get sick I try to have some strong margaritas at night on the theory that tequila can kill anything. Also, if it does not work and I actually get sick [as has happened a couple of times] I like drinking margaritas, usually have fun doing so and what is the big deal about being a little hung over if you are sick and supposed to sit around resting anyhow?
According to an erg file spreadsheet I have, doing the 2x20 (2') at 250 watts:
250 watts during 2' rest period: NP=250 (duh!)
187.5 watts (75%) during 2' rest period: NP=248
125 watts (50%) during 2' rest period: NP=247
0 watts during 2' rest period: NP=246
Hey, Team--
I've been "off the grid" EN-wise since my last race in October. The usual work/family/holidays chaos has limited my online EN time but I'm on the Nov OS advanced plan and have been hitting most of the workouts (minus some runs over the past 2 weeks due to tendinitis in my right knee).
I've been lurking on the forums the past couple of weeks to see what everyone was up to and to gain some inspiration and all the collective mojo has gotten me all geeked up to start posting again. For those of you I haven't "met" yet, I've been in Da Haus for one season now and race 70.3/Half distance. I live in Arlington, Virginia with DW, 2 young boys and one energetic dog, and work in public broadcasting. (Note: If you live in the DC/VA/MD metro area I'm always up for a weekend morning ride when the weather's decent!)
It's great, as always, to see all the mutual support and cheerleading in the postings and hear about everyone's struggles and small triumphs.
As for my training progress, I've been feeling really good on the bike and have been hitting all those workouts religiously. I do them all early before work and/or kids/spouse wake up and there have definitely been days where the temptation to turn the alarm off has been very strong. But feeling like I'm making gains keeps me motivated and returning to my basement for more fun intervals w/my iPod and Sportscenter. Overall, legs have been recovering well and I feel like I'm due for a bump next week. As for running, I had my best 5K test ever last month before my right knee started getting achey and forced me to back off the runs a bit so I'll likely be skipping the next test and play it by ear over the coming weeks. This will be my first full 20-week OS effort and I'm really optimistic that it's gonna give me a big jump in performance next season.
Looking forward to watching everyone else progress and reading about more FTP and VDOT bumps from everyone next week!
Best,
-Chris
@ Chris W.- I'm west of you out 66 anytime you want to ride. (40 degrees +) Let's not get crazy.
I was one of the lucky ENers to have the pleasure of meeting Chris Walz. Unfortunately it was as he cruised past me around mile 4 of the 9 mile run at the Brierman half lite tri in October. No surprise your run VDot is higher than mine!
Eagleman is also my A race. Looking forward to seeing you again, though under slightly different circumstances.
Matt - Thanks for your reply. Due to difficulty saving and uploading file from computrainer to WKO+, I restarted each interval eliminating the rest period so my avg. watts should equal normalized power, VI should be constant at 1).
4 X 1 mile repeats should be torture tomorrow.
Maybe Chris G will do a 2x FTP test with the variation being soft pedaling during rest vs complete rest. Just make sure the Tequila is ready. He might need the worm for that challenge.
Vince
Hey, Dan. Great to "see" you again. Very much enjoyed meeting you at Brierman. That was a painful race indeed. Let's not forget you made podium that day too! Told myself I wasn't going to return for that kind of hill suffering again but maybe if I use a 12-27 cassette next year...
. Looking forward to seeing you again at Eagleman. Nice and flat! Let's hope the headwinds are mellow this year!
Chris M & Keith -- Sounds like you guys are both pretty close-by. Maybe we could hook up somehwere out on the W&OD one of these days for a nice little recovery ride if we can find a dry weekend above freezing. There's a nice loop I do in Reston once in a while that's not too far from the trail but I'm always up for learning some new routes. That makings of NoVa Sleeper Cell?
As for the bike, no problem hitting 105%-110% on all the FT intervals and 90%+ on the 85% "rest of time" parts. After 2 years I think I'm finally getting good at doing the FT intervals. My FT test was ~205 watts, and I've been doing my FT intervals at: 2 songs ~205, 1-2 songs at 210-215, and 1 song at 220-230+. The steady buildup seems to work much better than trying to hit the target watts right out of the chute. On the 85% intervals I do the first couple of minutes at around 85% and then pick it up to ~90%. For some reason those 85% intervals seem much more doable than prior years. I haven't shorted myself a single minute, and I think it's making a difference. A little worried about the test, but working on a plan.
How about tomorrow morning in 10" of snow?
Ha! I've gone for rides in some pretty cold conditions but I draw the line at snow and ice. Don't forget to buy milk, bread and TP tonight. It's the DC winter tradition whenever a "blizzard" is forecast!
This was my home town last week:
http://www.edmontonjournal.com/tech...story.html
The only city on the planet that was colder was Siberia!
Some of us went running outside just so we could say we did.
Riding? Not so much.
Ha Craig . Good old Edmonchuck was in the middle of the polar vortex wasn't it. I thought it was cold in Calgary but man that weather sux up there!!!